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Painful sensations in the body.. Isn't that obvious? I'm not sure what do you mean by "does it need". I know I want it to end and I assume everyone else want that as well. Yes me. And I assume all other sentient creatures don't like it as well. Not necessarily. It just makes the world a shitty place depending on how much suffering you experience regularly. nothing happens. If I stop caring about suffering I'm gonna still experience it!

I swear by all the gods in the world.. There is no one identified or misidentified with anything.

Not true. Because there is already no one here to suffer but still there is suffering.

@Nahm Suffering has nothing to do with ego or identity or thoughts. Suffering (pain precisely) is a feeling not a thought. And I know you will say "no it's a thought".. Yes because as I told you before.. Feelings are thoughts and thoughts are feelings.

Don't worry lol... I'm not gonna get contact with the fire directly. Maybe I will touch something hot with my fingertip to feel a little painful sensation and try to actually accept it as It is without spraying concepts and judgments on top of it and will see how does that make the experience different.

Will do it lol. Maybe I will burn my finger or something and try to focus on the sensation as just being.. Or meaningless perception and will see.. Maybe I'm about to discover something huge.

It says HERE through ME. Tada! Lol Actually yeah.. I have a theory.. Since everything Is relative.. The only absolute is whatever I am experiencing at the moment. Which is the relative. Because the relative IS the absolute and the rest of the story ya know lol.. It is a way to intellectualize your way out of the suffering.. But I wonder if it's REALLY gonna work!

Have you actually done this process and no longer are affected by external unpleasant data?

How? Honestly I can't get how is that possible.

I agree and that's actually what came to my mind as the only way to deal with suffering. But does that mean you conquered suffering permanently? Because you Believe in reincarnation ( I honestly have no idea what happens after the body dies). Also I don't think that ramana maharishi couldn't feel pain for example.. So at least there is minimum level of pain that you just CANNOT avoid.. Right?

LOL please this is hilarious. Each moment there is a new me and a new ego and a new thoughts. There is no one identified or misidentified with anything. Do with this fact whatever you want.

I get that. But there is still something lacking here. It's true that sometimes if one is experiencing extreme suffering.. Surrendering and acceptance will actually ease out the suffering contrary to what denial will do. But isn't that like the last option? Like it's just because you are powerless and there is nothing you can do about it so you just give up? Because conventionally when you are experiencing suffering you run away looking for all possible solutions to end it.. And you only surrender when you discover that it's unsolvable.

Who listens to who? There is no me AND " my ego". There is not even an ego or thinker of thoughts. Thoughts just arise randomly out of the blue. And "your" response to them also arise in the same way.. Completely random and out of the blue. So there is really nothing you can do in the area of listening or not listening to thoughts because there is no "you" in the middle of "your" thoughts.

Does that mean your answer is there is no permanent end to all suffering? It's gonna continue forever (with pauses in between)?

Yes it is not satisfying answer. As long as there is experience or bodily sensations whether one is identified as the body or not.. There is still painful sensations. So let's say I'm identified as the observer of the body not the body itself(really this distinction is not even there.. It's just one thing) ..there will still be painful sensations in the body if it's going through it .. It's not a matter of identification.

@Nahm was being sarcastic lol.

True. I need 3 grams of enlightenment every morning with my vitamins and 2 grams before bed to be immune to human emotions. I must not be a human who feels natural human emotions to be an enlightened cold senseless zen rock. Oh so you have some preferences and judgments?? Not so enlightened. You must be OK with being tortured to death to be considered enlightened.

Rupert Spira is really great. What do you think about him? He explains stuff very eloquently and rarely talks about superficial stuff.

Well maybe at first it's gonna be a great spiritual atmosphere. There is a certain joy to being alone tbh. But after a while you will start getting bored and wishing to Interact with humans.. "ahh man I wish I have a girlfriend or some cool buddies to hang out with". Social animals we are and all that. Unless you are going for a total liberation.. In which case you wouldn't be worried too much about the rent and survival.. Because you will realize it's all a dream lol

Except that's exactly what I think during my dreams as well. In my dreams I'm also 100 % sure that It's the waking reality.!, It's not so obvious. Don't you see there is literally no difference between the two states? Even If we just say we are in the waking state right now.. Now what the heck is the waking state? What is this waking state? Where did it come from? What is it's context? You could say the context of the dreaming state is the waking state like it is happening inside of it being rendered by the brain or whatever that is... Nice.. But what is the context of the waking state? What is rendering it? How do you know that your whole life is NOT one giant ass dream and that you actually are an alien in some alternative 5 dimensional universe and that we all are just figments of your Dream???? And just to save time and get to the point.. The answer is YOU DO NOT KNOW THAT. So what does this have to do with your question? Well you insist that everyone are aware and then you are wondering why can't you access their awareness. I'm telling you go make sure first that we are aware.. That's the assumption that you need to question first.. Because the reality is as you yourself stated that you don't actually have access to other people's awareness.. That means you don't actually know if they are aware or not. That is what's actually the case not the beliefs and fantasies about "I should have access to other's Awareness because we are all one". You are taking it all backwards. It turns out you dont have access to that nor do you "should".

Are you in the "waking state" or the "dream state" right now? And how do you know?

@Halm @Halm you are conscious now.. Right? Right. You perceive other people and they appear to be having subjective experience of reality but you don't have direct access to their POV from inside..right? Right. You are asking if me and them are identical why can't I access their POV from inside?. I would suggest a new possibility to consider.. What if they don't have an internal subjective experience of their own just like people in your dreams.. They appear to be self- aware but actually they are just extensions of your own mind. I'm not saying that is actually what's going on right now.. But just a possibility to consider.. My question to you.. How do you know that that's NOT going on now? . Another way to put it.. How do you know you are NOT dreaming right now?

It doesn't matter. You exist. Other exists.. Others don't exist.. No difference. The only thing that exists is that which exists..isn't that obvious?. You "me and us" still playing games. Clinging to one perspective or another. All equally false and equally true. You will only be absolutely true when you are that of a non-perspective.

Idk I don't get it.. How are you terrified of "love"? Is love a terrifying thing? For example Is it natural for a child to be scared when his mom is trying to hug him and give him love?

Because honestly a huge percentage of the new age concepts are straightforward bullshit. Miraculous healing and manifesting your dreams.. Attracting good things.."you create your own reality.." "Suffering is optional but pain is inevitable." . And the list goes on.. All that Is just fantasizing. Also in my opinion.. The ideas about infinite love and infinite goodness.. unconditional happiness are also in the same category.. Just some drugs or ways to jerk off your way out of the suffering of this existence. It doesn't help with the life situation all these spiritual ideas.. You could say unless it is actualized.. To actualize it means to give up being a human.. Literally not metaphorically.. As long as you are in this human body you are going to suffer. There is no soultion from within the human condition.. Because the human condition itself is the proplem.