Osaid

Oh, lol, well I disagree with that. But not the OP.

Yeah I gotta agree. I think it's pretty obvious what Osho is saying. Leo is just pissy about his words. Checks out

Ball knowledge

Hahaha, true. I'm not a quick sleeper. Extra meditation gains, though. Yeah they start to feel like Superman again. The notion that there is something other than this, like "past", "future", etc. Colloquially referred to as thoughts or the sense of self, yes. I imagine that's the point of yoga, although I've never done it. Maybe yoga is better for some? Different strokes for different folks. Yoga seems to be something that stirs up an energetic process in the body or something. Keeping the body still seems to be like setting an intention that you're not going to do anything or pursue anything. It's like the ultimate form of "letting go", even all the jobs of the body. Most people constantly have thoughts that tie them to the body. At least that's how I see it. As an analogy, Einstein wouldn't have tried to come up with an equation for the universe while going sledding, he would've sat down and simply focused on the mental activity itself. Similarly, meditation is focusing on the activity of being, and that seems to naturally create a "stillness" in the body.

God never becomes anything.

Reading the story, it seems that a great many things are done. Dragons are slain, villages are conquered. Yet, the one reading the story never actually moves anywhere or goes anywhere.

Holy shit, great thread topic. Maybe even deserves a pin so everyone is up to speed. Strange that Leo seems to backtrack, as if it's not the same stuff he teaches or spiels about even to this day. The egocentrism, the idea that "I'm more conscious than you", etc.

Lol right. A nightmare still seems like something. Whereas what is talked about is nothing. I'm sure it's the "death" and "reincarnation" aspects which were triggered in hindsight.

Is suffering smart? No. Is it smart to suffer? Still no. But actually, it logically makes sense to suffer. Still no! You can package the horseshit any way you want and it's still horseshit. Even a child or an animal can see it. The eggheads are blind to their own horseshit.

Interesting. When the body is still, like in meditation, or even when falling asleep, all sorts of "things" and "ideas" can come up. This is "par for the course". I bring up sleep, because from my POV, falling asleep is not really different at all from meditation. It's like a mandatory meditation you do every night. The same happens when the body becomes sick. Lots of people say being sick makes them more humble. Some say it makes them more grateful. Some say it makes them contemplate death more. Depends on the ideas the person has accumulated mentally. Essentially, the state of the body will make all sorts of ideas about yourself come up and out, kind of like a "mental purging". The exact same happens in meditation. The "smoothness" of meditation, or dealing with any kind of energetic or emotional state, comes down to your ability to focus on what is present (real) rather than what isn't present (unreal). That's why people use the breath and other things as an "anchor" to focus on. Meditation is going back to what is most fundamental, which is the fact of your existence, in spite of any thoughts that seem tempting to "chase after". Meditation is "letting go", like sleep is, rather than "chasing after". Technically, it can be done anywhere, even while moving, as you said. Since the present, or the real, is indeed everywhere. Keeping the body still is just to lessen the significance of the body.

Right. It can definitely spawn an investigation. Because it is so pertinent for the seeker. But the resolution always seems to be "doh, it was just a belief".

Sounds like you're opening the closet and realizing that nothing is in there.

It makes sense that the finite would be concerned with what happens after the finite disappears. Like paper being concerned about scissors. But that's the belief in finite. What about what isn't disappearing, which isn't finite and isn't a belief? Death seems to be spiritual because it looks supernatural and mysterious by virtue of being unknown, but it's a distraction from what actually exists.

Right Everyone is so macabre.

It's almost like hatred, envy, and narcissism isn't actually inherent to either gender (contrary to all the posts in this section of the forum) 🤔🤔🤔

Haha, nope. I wasn't lying when I said it was ineffable. As an analogy, there is seeing, and then there are the objects we see. It's easy to get entangled in all the different objects, to the point where one might even ask "which object am I?". The kicker is that seeing itself is never any of the objects and never was. You can say that you're seeing a table and a chair, but you can never say that seeing is a table or a chair.

Well, if you take away the "your" and the "my", then it's the same "this". So, in the end, it's not this that's ever different, it's your idea of what you are that differs from this.

Maybe. I know what nouns and verbs are, but I thought the decision to bring those distinctions into a talk like this was interesting on Osho's part.

I thought there was something strange about that statement. It's AI lol.

Very interesting distinction to make, I kinda like it.

Osho's elaboration, basically. I gotta steelman him or he'll roll in his grave.

I see, well I was mostly just joking.

Seemed like you wanted someone to argue with.

Very cool. Unfortunately, I have nothing to argue about with you.

What about when you're trying to fall asleep? Same deal?