r0ckyreed

Thanks for that trip report. It awakened me a little bit to realize more about eternity. The girl seemed to imply that her friends were the same god as her and yet each had their own experiences. She was able to tap into them but not fully. This is what I was suggesting in that others have experiences, but it is all still within the same reality. Her insight was of Infinite Gods and not solipsism. If she said her friends were imaginary, then that would be solipsism, but she was able to tap into their experiences which is contrary to solipsism.

If others do actually have experiences, then it isn’t just a concept. If you right now are actually conscious, then your experience is more than a concept. But if you are a philosophical zombie appearing like you are conscious but really aren’t, then I would agree that others are concepts. But it seems like you, others, and my dog have a private experience that is beyond my own.

And they would also judge him for not buying any at all, saying that he has no experience to comment. But the OP does have experience of it, and therefore, OP has a right to talk about it, whereas outsiders have no authority on the matter. You get my point.

That is the million dollar question. That will vary to each person. For me, it is contemplation that raises my awareness the most. For you, it may be visualization or body scan, chakra meditation, or whatever. Just sit and notice everything just happening entirely on its own. Then, think about free will.

What does meditation mean to you? What is your meditation practice?

You imagine the boundary. That is how. A distinction is nothing but a boundary you draw. You have to draw the line somewhere; otherwise, there is nothing to discuss. Of course, all boundaries are imaginary and arbitrary.

But if everything is one and my experience is absolute, why are there other experiences that I cannot access? Why can’t I access your experience? My human experience is finite.

That’s like saying sound is purely conceptual. Sound is a concept but sound is also an experience. You are dismissing that reality is an experience and not just something you think. Your concepts are occurring in a reality of some sort. Otherwise, there is no truth to what you are saying. You ain’t gonna convince anyone that consciousness is a concept. You are conscious right now whether you are conceptualizing or not.

Not sure I understand because if you are saying difference is imaginary but sameness isn’t, then you have created a duality. If there is no other, there is no self. If there is no difference, there is no sameness. If there is no space, then there is no object. This is another contradiction. Sameness has to be imaginary because everything is always changing. There is nothing the same/identical in reality? You could say the substance is the same, but the contents are different.

Consciousness isn’t a concept. All concepts occur within Consciousness.

You aren’t getting it. The moon isnt just a pure concept. The idea of a moon points to an actual moon. Whereas the idea of Santa doesn’t point to anything in existence of actuality. For instance, Leo’s toilet isn’t just my imagination. I can go out and find Leo’s toilet. This is different from Santa Clause.

What are you meaning by state and contemplation? From my understanding, you view contemplation as deeply thinking about something and state as one’s level of consciousness.

Right. Peter Ralston discusses this in his book that contemplation is all about direct consciousness of truth. But isn’t an insight a state change? Does contemplation bring about a deeper state change than meditation? All the times I have spent counting my breaths in meditation, I could have spent contemplating a question and gaining a valuable insight. I am not sure how chanting, counting breaths, etc. will bring about the state change. Meditation makes me more blissful and contemplation makes me more insightful.

But what about contemplation and curiosity? Being present without curiosity won’t lead to awakening. This is the downside of meditation and shutting off the mind. There are plenty of dogmatic meditators who sit very presently and can access satori’s and samadhis, but this isn’t the same as complete understanding of reality. I don’t think meditation can ever lead to the highest levels of understanding because meditation encourages us to shut off the mind rather than to utilize it to explore our curiosity. Do you see how shutting off the mind is only exploring half of reality, whereas using our mind explores the other half. I am certain that contemplation leads to the highest levels of understanding because contemplation is being deeply curious. Without curiosity and contemplation, even psychedelics and the Buddha himself cannot awaken you. Awakening is a process that happens from within in the same way that medicine helps the body/mind do what it needs to do to heal from within. All meditation has ever done for me is make me feel happier and peaceful. All of my deepest insights have come from me sitting down and thinking curiously and critically about the present moment or what have you. Correct me if I am wrong, but awakening is about insight and truth rather than my happiness, suffering, and how I feel. Meditation helps more with the latter and contemplation is effective with both.

There is no such thing as a meditation technique. You are correct that meditation is a happening and not a doing. Techniques are just more doings.

Isn’t sameness also imaginary too? The mind creates difference and sameness. Separation is definitely an illusion and so are boundaries. I am with you on that, but what I am not quite with you on is this contradiction between my experience being absolute but also relative amongst other experiences. If other people have experiences like mine, then that means there are parts of reality that I, my experience, cannot access.

If we don’t exist, then why do we say “we”, “my”, and “you”? We have to draw distinctions to be able to talk about things. I could just say River but you would have no idea which river I would be talking about. I say external world to identify yourself beyond the ego. There is a seen world and an unseen world and both are the self. There is an internal world of your thoughts and feelings and private experience, and then there is a world beyond your beliefs, opinions, thoughts, feelings, and subjectivity. That is why it is called “external” because we are making a distinction relative to a certain point of view because you don’t experience all of Infinity as a finite human experience. If you did, then reality wouldn’t be infinite. There is more beyond your senses because that is what infinity is. You are a leaf on a tree in which you are tree too.

Yes. I agree but these concepts point to an actuality of some sort. Right now, my car is a concept that points to something that exists, whereas the Spaghetti Monster isn’t. My car isn’t purely conceptual. Likewise, others aren’t purely conceptual. I exist as a concept and as an actuality. The ego is concept but consciousness (what I am) isn’t.

I agree that I have only ever experienced my experience because that is all I have. You might say that my experience is reality but the issue is that if other people have experiences, then that means my experience cannot be total. My experience is completely sovereign, but it isn’t absolute because my experience only captures a small part of this Infinity. Just think about it, I see in 3D, but an alien might perceive is 3000D. Can you imagine that? Who would be God in this case? Can you see that the alien would have a totally different reality than me and could see different parts of the world that I can’t? Also, look at blind and deaf people, they can’t experience sight or sound and are thus missing out on other parts of reality. My experience right now is like that of a blind and deaf man compared to an alien. My experience is relative to others and to the Universe itself. I am not sure what you mean because this seems obvious to me that my experience is limited and not absolute. It is absolute in the sense that I cannot experience anything but my experience, but my experience also tells me there is more than just my experience. If it is true what you are saying that there is no external world and my experience is absolute, then it would follow that there are no others and that there could not be other absolutes. This contradicts Infinite Gods. It would also follow that you don’t even exist and are just my experience talking to me, which is technically true, but it would mean that you have no experience outside of my experience of “you.”

Well, according to the logic of this spiritual talk, you are technically imagining that we talked about this multiple times within this one time, the present moment.

Right there. You just acknowledged that there is more than one perspective. Idc if there are a million clones, they will all be the same but will also have different experiences in the game.

But if there are others, then it isn’t absolute because there would be experiences happening outside your own, which would make your experience relative amongst other experiences.

I believe other people are living life even if I don’t experience it. I believe cops are murdering black people even if I don’t experience it. To say otherwise is racist and inaccurate. Injustice is done around the world without my awareness. I mean look at this Gaza war. It is obviously happening while I am on the toilet drinking a root beer, typing this message.

Boundless infinity is what is meant by external world. It is the world of consciousness that existed before you were born and after your death. The external world is also you. The external world just means that there is a world beyond your current experience. If there are other minds, then there are other worlds. And they are all the Universe. If there was no external world, then what am I watching on a cops body cam footage? If there is no external world, then Leo doesn’t exist and neither does his house unless I am there. But the world doesn’t evolve around my ego.

I have been very lethargic and lazy today and was contemplating what meditation is. I came to the realization that meditation is not a doing but a being. Let me explain: In life, we are always doing something, and I started to notice myself meditating as another doing in that I would be "doing" meditation or performing a meditation technique just like I would another task or activity. But here is the truth: Meditation is NOT a task or activity. There is no such thing as a meditation technique or even meditation itself. As soon as you make a technique out of meditation, you turn it into a doing. True meditation is just being, just being aware and satisfied with just existence itself. Anything else you add onto that is a "doing" and is a distraction. You don't even have to sit to meditate because that is a doing. Whatever you are doing right now, just allow and accept everything as it is. Don't try to change anything about your experience. Just be. The thing is that you are always doing something. Let meditation just be just like your breath before you notice it. Just be aware of existence and just accept it. True meditation is being satisfied with not doing anything at all and just letting everything become a happening rather than a doing. Your breath happens, your thinking happens, and then your meditation happens. If you are focusing on your breath or doing anything else, you are technically doing a technique than true meditation. Why can't you just do absolutely nothing and just be satisfied with being? A client told me that she can meditate, but it is another task that she does. And when she has nothing to do, she gets really bored. But it is that moment you are not doing anything, that is the meditation. The only thing you are "doing" is noticing, letting it be, letting it go, and being satisfied throughout the experience. And notice that the act of noticing, letting it be, letting it go, and being satisfied are not doings but are happenings. Try that out. That is true meditation and to even call it "meditation" is a trap. To saying "I am meditating" then becomes a doing, and is therefore, not meditation. True meditation is when people ask, "What are you doing?" And you reply, "Nothing at all! I am simply being." One more thing I want to point out is that while meditation is helpful in your life, it shouldn't be all you do in your life. Notice that survival is against being. You have to do something if you really want to live, so in a way, just being is a way of facing death and being in touch with the present moment. But if all you are just being all the time, you will die, and you won't be fully satisfied as a human being. No amount of meditation will satisfy you. Did you get that? Let me repeat it again, NO AMOUNT OF MEDITATION WILL SATISFY YOU. A 10 minute or 10 hour "practice" may give you a little bit of satisfaction, but you will reach a point where your mind just has to do something. In fact, it is not healthy for you to be sitting in zazen 24/7. Life requires you to do other things besides shutting off your mind and just being. When I asked ChatGPT the purpose of meditation, it listed the themes to be centered around enhanced well-being, improved mindfulness, and spiritual development. On the other hand, when I asked ChatGPT about the purpose of contemplation, it listed themes around gaining insight/understanding, problem-solving, and introspection. Notice that no amount of shutting off the mind will give you insights because insight requires that you allow your mind to open, and to open, your mind needs to be able to be used, to think, and to connect dots. You cannot connect any dots in your mind if it is silent. Can you please notice this!!? You Buddhist Bats!! You cannot be deeply curious about life if you are silencing all forms of thought, including your curiosity. You cannot solve problems if you shut off your mind!! Solving problems requires that you use your mind. Some of you may object saying that meditation and having a silent mind allows you to have insights into problem-solving. Yes, but that is only AFTER you allow yourself to think again and use your mind. You get a ping of insight and that is mental content. And technically, you still can't solve problems with no mind. Contemplation is important to deeply think things through and to self-reflect. Just being aware of your self and your thoughts isn't enough. You have to engage with them and follow your curiosity. I hope this helps. So basically, meditation is a helpful "practice." You want to engage with just being satisfied with being. But don't mistake that for shutting off your mind and being a mindless Buddhist Bat. You want to engage your mind and be like a Leonardo Da Vinci or a Sherlock Holmes, Einstein, etc. Those are the greatest minds because they have used them but have also not used them. You cannot have a great mind if you are always shutting it off. That is really not a life worth living. The unexamined life is not worth living and so is the thoughtless life. Meditation is bullshit. Meditation doesn't exist. There is just being and doing. Allow yourself to be and then allow yourself to do. Engage in being deeply (meditation) and then engage in doing consciously and curiously (contemplation).