LfcCharlie4

@Bill W LOL, don't worry mate, I'm only responding as I've been discussing privately with him recently and to be honest, I've had some chats with a few people about it and he comes across very strange, let's put it like that. Certain things he said didn't sit well with me, but I didn't know if that was because I was being naive or if he was using his knowledge and age to act superior, to be honest I still don't know and am not really bothered. What I do know, is this year has been incredibly transformations in terms of my direct experience of reality and level of awareness so to speak (language always fails here), so to have my direct experience be called a mindfuck and 'Neo-Advaita Dogma' didn't sit well with me, hence asking 'other awakened beings' as I know their paths are VERY different from mine It is likely due to the limitations of language but I just didn't believe certain things said were true such as the first 6 SD stages are all pointless and bullshit, the absolute doesn't include anything relative (lol), meditation is completely pointless, Transmissions are BS, basically any relative activity except this work is childs play, My direct experiences aren't that. Obviously these are huge claims to make to someone, so I wondered if I was being unfair that's all I just remember being a seeker and if I would've read stuff like that a year ago it would've played on my mind and made me spiral into non stop overthinking, so certain info can be very dangerous when certain people read it, I'm lucky now I have the ability to actually think for myself, and use my own experience as my vantage point, instead of mere concepts and books etc, but not everyone can yet, as I couldn't just 9 months ago.

@Bill W yeah I get how it looks. it wasn’t to “gang up” as such, more to see if I was missing something/ being blind as he’s made some bold claims towards me, and I’m of course biased to my teachers and awakenings, as well as my own direct experience, I’ve gone about it wrong but I was more asking whether I am completely wrong and missing something. im sorry if it came across that way and that is far from my intention at all. just being told your awakening experiences are complete BS, you’re at stage blue and that your teachers are complete shit doesn’t always sit too well with me, also being told if I eventually become a teacher using what worked for me I will get bad karma didn’t sit well with me either, also using Jed McKenna to disprove masters like Ramana didn’t make sense. also, being told I’m being mind fucked and the happiness and peace That is now stablaized, is only temporary and illusory and that it is all neo-Advaita dogma, similar to traditional religion, these are not small claims, therefore, of course I’m going to investigate whether I am genuinely missing something here, see where I’m coming from more so? I am genuinely intrigued to see if I’m missing something or being too harsh, but from the 5+ people I’ve contacted regarding it it seems like I wasn’t. sorry again if it seems like that, at the end of the day he’s questioning the whole foundation of this forum regarding non-duality and modern teachers (including Leo) therefore I wanted to be thorough in my discussions, maybe I’ve come across too strong who knows. it was not to do with corners but to genuinely ask perspective from a range of people on here, as my perspective is 1 perspective, and as I said will of course have forms of self bias, Leo, Nahm etc have had different paths to awakening hence me asking them to see if I am genuinely wrong.

@Leo Gura Leo coming in clutchhhhhhh, this guy has also told me the Absolute DOESNT include anything relative at all, when in fact “duality” is merely an expression of The Self, and EVERYTHING is the absolute.

@Inliytened1 @Inliytened1 Yeah all beliefs and concepts need to be dropped I 100% agree. However, he feels everyone is a Neo-Advaitan ?

@Nahm @Leo Gura @VeganAwake @Jkhv1 @Haumea2018 I’m interested to hear your guys thoughts on the statement “Non-Duality isn’t enlightenment” as well as the many many other quotes this guy has said, I genuinely am intrigued to hear others opinions, as I might be being biased (And anyone else, I genuinely can’t remember many usernames to tag, preferably those with awakening experiences/ awakenings)

@Haumea2018 Check this out, I’ve never seen someone more obsessed with spiritual knowledge and concepts and models. @V-8 you never answered my question- are you happy?

Art quite literally is everything. it isn’t just drawing a picture. Creation is an art and therefore everything in creation is a form of this art, from the bodybuilders to the best painters of all time, from those building billion dollar companies to those protesting global warming. All of this is a form of art, therefore, creation is quite simply nothing other than art. Go into nature and see how nature takes care of everything it needs to in a perfectly flowing system, do you not see how this is art? You may then ask what about Earthquakes, volcanoes etc, naturally occurring ones are necessary for the overall system to thrive, so yes even these are forms of Art. Of course, relatively speaking, not all art is created equally, but even this forum, this message, these words are all forms of Art. Find your medium, and go enjoy it!

@VeganAwake I like her? It’s a paradox the mind wi never understand, lucky the mind doesn’t actually exist I guess!

Arriving home. being stabilised in absolute peace and happiness, the unshakeable absolute. then what you might ask? Go be happy, enjoy life and have fun, as your heart desires in each moment

@VeganAwake yessss exactly I’m glad we finally got there Literally everything feels so normal again, yet it will never be the same, hard to put into words. Everything is ordinary, yet the ordinary has become the extraordinary, and every moment provides boundless joy. So while it’s the same, it will never be like before, but it feels like home. Beyond duality and non duality, just THIS as it is, and it is beautiful isn’t it

@VeganAwake No I am trying to describe what is beyond both duality and non duality in terminology you are familiar With but I cannot do it, maybe this passage will help explain. The absolute is beyond Non-Duality, beyond duality and is just this as you, but This includes absolutely everything, which after all is just the Self.

@VeganAwake yeah it’s just language. I personally think it’s more than just conditioning, while I no longer identify with the character and the knowing knows myself As The Self, I am just saying each human has a personality. the best term I have heard is “Transcendental Individuality” you know there’s no “you” at your core, but let’s say it’s awareness expressing itself through the vehicle of a human, as a play, for the fun of it yes there is merely awareness/ The Self looking at the Self or awareness at all times, as I keep saying all there is is The Self. Maybe I over emphasised the human dimension, I was merely stated it seems to be neglected in most non dual circles, kind of transcended or negated, which I just wanted to emphasise I do not support 1 bit. All I will say is when you go full circle, Duality is not an “illusion” as such, more that The Self as all there is so Duality is no longer a problem to be solved and is instead all is seen as The Self therefore why negate something that is literally your very own Self, why not embrace and enjoy it instead? Sorry im just not fond of the word illusion, but you are not wrong, it just goes deeper in my experience

@purerogue I'm not saying to go out and dig through everything, but it's likely shit will arise, and as it does, dealing with it then is what I mean, that's all For some, they may need less/ little work, or most may be done before awakening, all I am saying is for many things do arise post awakening that is all. Also, if you don't deal with things like Trauma that can't wreak havoc. As I said I was luckier than many in terms of Trauma and my childhood in this lifetime. @VeganAwake When I say life begins, I mean I would rather life 1 day in these peace and happiness, than 10 days how I was just a year ago, nothing compares to the radical acceptance of each and every moment and spontaneously enjoying whatever arises next. You are correct, when you investigate your thoughts, feelings and sensations, what is at the centre- Space/ Awareness/ Whatever you want to call the many names for the absolute. I feel complete, whole and fulfiled, that is exactly what I mean by life truly begins. It's like I'm a completely different person, reborn again as The Self. You're right THIS IS It, and it's beautiful. But in this, is this world and 'others' and guess what THIS Includes them and ALL aspects of duality, duality is the Buddha itself, This planet is heaven, is Nirvana, is complete freedom. Not some special place out there, but THIS right now. All I was attempting to point to was to not neglect the human dimension, while you are alive, you are still a Human as well. I am NOT saying there is a self at the centre but it can SEEM like there is. What I merely mean is you will still have a personality and be more 'VeganAwake' (idk your real name) than ever before. If anything everything will be richer and more intense than before. This has also taught me to be more careful with words and express myself better which is hard.

@Spiral Wizard Yes, no answer with words will ever be correct, they are all concepts, that's why no word could ever utter the ultimate truth, and all words are pointers and tools, same as books and videos and whatever other medium is being used. Also, inquiry is an all day affair 24/7 until you arrive at the unbreakable silence. This link will get deleted but this book is like $6 on Kindle, only problem with Ramana for newbies is they struggle to add context to the eastern teachings, plus a translation can never be 100% perfect (e.g. Buddha never said not to desire, yet look at how common knowledge that is!) https://www.amazon.com/Who-Meditation-Self-Inquiry-Self-Realization-Tradition-ebook/dp/B00OZYIXE2/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8 @Guru Fat Bastard thanks mate

@VeganAwake I am not talking about Ego, I am talking about Human integration, maybe it will help if I explain in terms of Psyches? You have an insight say that you are God, but then you need to integrate this insight into your life and way of being, there can be habits that have unreal momentum from years of reinforcement, this is more about the Human side of things than existential. I know you're just going to say this is Ego, but yes while when you have thoughts, feelings, sensations there is NOBODY at the centre just pure awareness, it will still FEEL as if there is someone and unless you go live in a diaper and want to actually participate in the world, being 'detahced' from relationships, people, if you have children etc is a very dangerous thing imo, almost a numb state. What 1000 represents is complete self realization, the END of seeking, I have arrived home in the kingdom of heaven, and know myself to be The Self alone. However, this is a key point of going full circle, I know while in this body I will still be human, have a personality and interests and still be 'Charlie' which in my opinion is beautiful, unique expressions of awareness as our individuals is to be embraced and enjoyed, what fun would life be if we were all blank canvasses? As much as you won't want to admit you still have a personality, things you like, girls/ boys (idk you and don't want to offend) you are attracted to more than others, hobbies you enjoy more, however yes you no longer IDENTIFY as just that, but individuality will continue after awakening. It is nothing to do with seeking spiritually speaking. I can guarantee you, you have a shadow to integrate especially as your awakening is fresh, I can't say what lies in your sub/ unconscious but there will be 'shit' you as a Human need to deal with to fully integrate your awakening. Maybe you don't get what I mean by integration I'm not sure, but it is NOT seeking, it is more of an inner clearing of all everyone has suppressed over the years, WinterKnight touched on this with his talk on PsychoTherapy. I myself was lucky in terms of my childhood, however, there could be past lives Karma to deal with idk yet, I'm still in a honeymoon phase. As I said 1000 is a complete end to the journey of seeking. I feel completely stabilized in happiness and peace, compared to this time last year was constant overthinking and low level of depression. But is only the beginning of the journey of life and deepening, that never ends, to me life truly begins at 1000, as you are now free, as any resistance to life has evaporated, and all there is is the spontaneous joy of living life moment to moment, I have no idea what the next moment will bring, but all I know is there will be complete acceptance and enjoyment whatever arises. This article could help, only decent one I could find aside from paid Satsangs that I cannot legally share. https://www.scienceandnonduality.com/article/integrating-the-shadow-in-awakening @WelcometoReality During earlier awakenings integration of the shadow happened slowly, such as integrating deeper love into my personal relationships, and treating everyone as The Self, as me. In terms of my shadow, I still have a fair amount of work to do, 1000 represents home existentially, seeking is over. There then arrives a 'clearing' period, often Enlightenment is called destructive and I can see why. @Haumea2018 can shed more light on this as he has actually been through the process. @zeroISinfinity It's merely limits of language, you're right there is no 'I' to be enlightened. If you know of a better way to say it please inform me, I am not meaning to say my 'self' has awakened, it is merely awareness becoming aware of itself. However, I feel saying things like that just adds concepts and confusion to many. The Self has realized itself and has now taken center stage. @Nahm I don't think I'm ready just yet, this thread is exposing how poor I am at articulating in words these things, I would need to become much more concise and direct, as I can hardly explain basic Maths concisely to people when they ask, let alone the Absolute lol. I would also want to be able to give a form of transmission, ideally RASA, and would like a deeper understanding of the Enneagram, as each human has a unique path to awakening, and personality type plays a huge role in this. For example, a 7 (me) hates negativity and being bored, therefore, I would constantly read and watch instead of facing my feelings and the silence. Whereas, a 9 (Tolle, Ramana) is addicted to peace and bliss, therefore can become lazy and just bliss out all day long, so instead needs to and meet people and socialize and stop using their bliss or peace as a way out to face their fears. Hopfully you get what I mean & How are you finding coaching so far?

@kag101 AWESOME POST! Yes, traditional methods can work and in fact healing yourself like this will only help on the spiritual path, and is something a lot more people need, congratulations mate!

Self-Help/ Personal Development is still incredibly useful unless you wish to go live in a diaper or become a monk. PD encompasses Diet, Fitness, Career/ Business, Emotions, Trauma, Skills, etc etc So, I don't see why it's a one or the other scenario, you have a shit diet? Go work out how to fix that. Awakened and addicted to porn still? Go figure out how to fix that. Even post awakening Self-Help will have value in your life in an array of areas, for example Self-Realisation/ Enlightenment won't automatically make you incredibly fit, wealthy or have great relationships. Don't think enlightenment will solve all of the issues you face in your life. What you need will be different from what I need for example.

This whole is something 'low conscious' is toxic. But, yeah most of them are very corrupt and damaging. Can't you just invest in companies that provide value, or Crypto, or something, or maybe even Stage Green companies, this will be the future of the world after all as we get dragged into Green. I'm sure in good time they'll be some Environmentally Friendly funds or something like that, or Marijuana stocks, or even A.I. stocks. Or, reinvest in your own Biz?

Ramana 'invented' inquiry for those who were not ready for the teaching of silence, the highest teaching of all. Therefore, the purpose of Self Inquiry is to ask yourself once 'Who is the one aware of this ....' or 'Who am I' or some variant of this question, and then rest in the silence, rest in the absolute. If this doesn't resonate with you try Natural Pure Awareness meditation.

@VeganAwake No, see this is where I think you could struggle. Integration is learning to bring your awakening into your life, I am awake as such, self realised etc, And this is nothing to do with the “separate self” and it isn’t to do with knowledge or the Egoic self agenda. Instead it is to do with dealing with everything else, your shadow, all the shit that you haven’t dealt with in your subconscious and unconscious, you may be in a “honeymoon” phase of the 600s, I am currently in one for 1000, however, depending on each of our lives/ karma/ past lives (if you believe in them idk) you will face some challenges integrating and dealing with your shadow. When the time comes, you will know what I mean, it’s nothing to do with not being awake, or self realised but is merely part of the path for a full embodied awakening. The only other I know at 1000 and who has been through this on this forum is @Haumea2018 so maybe he can help me explain what integration and “shit work” involves. @Nahm RASA is a 15 minute silent transmission, I think In group settings it is 20 minutes. And, well I guess scientifically speaking yes it’s subjective, but it’s not like a debate if you get me. In the book 1000 they go over how they calculate the LOCs, but the individual number itself isn’t important, once you know each “stage” 600s 700s 800s 900s and 1000, you can see common signs and subtle differences in people and teachers at different depths of awakening. This is why I recommend the book as most people never realise not all awakenings = the same awakening, both Ramana and Eckhart Tolle spontaneously awoken, However Eckhart awakened to No Self and being “awareness/ the witness” whereas Ramana awoken to “The Self and The Absolute, and realised the Self is all there is” it’s subtle, and I’m no master but I can tell pretty clearly roughly where teachers/ people are at from how they speak. however, to gauge a full picture you’d need to meet someone really.

@Nahm https://www.rasatransmissioninternational.com/what-is-rasa if I’m honest, unless I could give some form of silent transmission I personally wouldn’t bother teaching, as there’s enough already out there with a flower and talking, personally I believe 1-1 + a transmission is much more powerful and effective, and certainly more efficient. Although I still have a LOT of integration work to do, I imagine 99.9% of people on here do

@Highest only goes up to a 1000, learn the rules bro? @VeganAwake yes life is meaningless but isn’t that beautiful? You are then free to create your own meaning and purpose in life, in any area you wish, and as you say free to enjoy the beautiful game of duality, whatever it is you enjoy in life yeah it’s almost funny, what we were seeking was always right in front of us, yet 99.9% of us miss it, for years on end. And I agree, seeking is a blessing and a curse, without it you’d never uncover the truth, but at the very depth the pain you can feel I wouldn’t wish on my worst enemy, the confusion is enough to keep you up all night at times, I can only imagine what it was like when people had to go to India or order books from India and wait weeks with a burning question in their head only for the book to confuse them more ? We really are in extremely lucky times to have the internet and spiritual teachings only a fingertip away at all times! And, yes I’ll message you at some point and we can catch up, maybe once I’m trained to give RASA, but that’ll be a while yet, although I think it’s one of the BEST gifts the divine has ever given us, in my opinion, nothing beats silent teachings, as the truth can only be found in silence. however words and spoken teachings also have their place without doubt! Have an amazing evening

@Serotoninluv The book 1000 by Ramaji, it’s one of the best books on Non-Duality this century. His wife Ananda has helped me beyond words and I will be forever grateful, I wouldn’t be the person I am today without them 2 @VeganAwake My seeking days are over, very recently I have arrived home, there is nothing left for me to seek, in the 6,7,8 and 900s I knew there was a little further to go, maybe you will realise this some day, it’s hard to put into words mate. Youre right this is it, and you’re doing amazing, sorry if I came off harsh, its all from love, and just because I know there’s more, I’d love to connect via message and become friends, I promise not to preach anymore I’ve realised my way of speaking needs to upgrade if I’m ever to teach people , and thank you for helping me improve that Enjoy this period bro, even becoming enlightened at all is awesome and it’s presumptuous of me to make out it isn’t good enough, you seem happy so enjoy it bro.

@VeganAwake I haven’t once said I’m enlightened, enlightenment is a concept that will eventually need to be dropped like all others. I have not once said it is something in the future, I am not doubting your awakening, what I am saying is you have had 1 awakening, and it can go deeper, not all awakenings are the same depth. This is nothing to do with a separate self, in fact it is to with Realising The Self though. Yes enlightenment literally is the most destructive process possible, you are seeing through everything that is false and are left with the naked truth, which is This. but, THIS changes, for me now, everything has infinite precious value, as this very world, the duality you are subtly rejecting, is The Self, there is no need to reject duality, once you arrive home you realise Duality is The Self and you no longer need to reject it. You may well be enlightened, that is clear, but it is also clear, you are far from finished, it goes beyond Enlightenment, there is no enlightened person, just The Self. The problem with the 600s is it’s too focused on negation which can never be an ultimate truth. ”No Self” “No Separate Self” “No Doer” “Non Separation” What happens is you subtly reject activity and doing and separate yourself from it as the “No Self” “Nobody Here” anything with negation can not be a final truth, the heart yearns for more than that I’m afraid. No Self is a huge difference to being a suffering seeker, that’s for sure, but it’s only the beginning of the journey, I don’t mean this in a belittling way I promise, I just know having been through that stage myself that going beyond No Self, into realising you are God/Everything (700s) is a drastic leap and one you will love. You are not wrong, it’s just you’re not completely right, you probably think I’m an arsehole and will reject what I am saying and that’s also fine, I honestly don’t mind either way, but “No Self” is not the final truth, no matter how much you spin it, in good time you will also see this. You have negated the separate self, are experiencing non-doership as a result and likely a sense of “Borderless Presence” it is easy to mistake this as the final frontier. Yet it isn’t and the biggest tele tale is explain your experience of “other people” and the world you inhabit please?

@VeganAwake Okay mate I understand, I am just trying to merely say you’ve had an awakening in the 600s and while that is amazing it can go much deeper But if you’re happy so am I, however, please be careful if you want to become a teacher, and when you’re ready to go deeper lmk @Serotoninluv 1000 it’s by Ramaji, Book is No mind, No problem, highly recommend, helped me see the mind is nothing but thoughts and never actually existed, and helps you allow awareness to become the forefront instead of background.