Beginner Mind

@Nahm I appreciate your thoughts but I'm pretty comfortable with my understanding at the moment. I'll just leave you with this quote from Nisargadatta Maharaj: "In reality things are done to you, not by you."

@Key Elements We'll just have to agree to disagree.

Think of someone you highly respect. Now, choose to not respect them. Can you do it? No, you can't. Respect is either there or it isn't. It's not up to you. Think of someone you are not sexually attracted to. Now, choose to feel attracted to them. Can you do it? No. Again, you'll find that attraction is either there or it isn't. It's not up to you. Can you even choose to stop thinking for five minutes? I certainly can't. At the end of the day, it's clear that we do not really have the choice that we think we have.

@Nahm Not sure. But the illusion of choice is not a mistake, I'm sure. It's as much a part of the design of the universe as anything else. So if you feel like the chooser, then be the chooser. It's all good.

A relaxed/quiet mind is impossible for me. But thanks for trying to help me.

Yes! The heart is beating without choice, finger nails are growing without choice, hair is growing without choice, even thoughts are appearing without choice. With so much beyond our control, can there really be said to be any choice at all? I'm not sure what you mean by this. Can you elaborate?

I wouldn't say we are victims. Our conditioning is always changing, so you may be exposed to an inspirational teaching that will become part of your new conditioning, which may fundamentally change your personality and behavior for the better.

When I was 18 I called my dad (who lives in California) and told him how much his absence in my life had impacted me. He basically said that he'd like to be a mentor to me if he can, but that a traditional father-son relationship wasn't going to happen. In my 20's as I started to get into certain spiritual teachings, it started to dawn on me that my dad was simply acting out his genes and conditioning. We don't really have a choice over who we are and what we do. Our genetics and our conditioning determine everything about us. This realization allowed me to forgive my dad. Nowadays I mostly ignore his phone calls, not out of bitterness, but rather because I feel like I don't even know who he is. Now, though, with my newfound willingness to cultivate love and express love, I'm feeling a little more willing to receive his next phone call.

@Nahm Thank you for your thoughtful post. I am a bit skeptical of the law of attraction but I can definitely see the benefit of writing down what I want.

You make me laugh. Don't ever change. P.S. I don't know you well enough to say for sure, but I'd be willing to bet that what you truly long for is love also. You just aren't being honest with yourself.

You're probably right. I'm not sure what you mean by this. I'll have to watch your video on devilry.

@AlldayLoop I value winterknight's opinion but I don't think psychoanalysis is for me. Yeah, the pursuit of enlightenment might've been an avoidance tactic for me, to some degree. Although, there has always been a genuine curiosity about knowing the truth of life. (I was a Philosophy major, after all.)

I know intellectually that I am not the chooser, but there is still the illusion of choosing. I feel responsible. Even as the heart beats by itself, finger nails and hair grows by itself, and even thoughts appear by themselves, somehow I feel responsible for my life. Scanning from head to toe, it's obvious that I'm not responsible for the functioning of this body-mind. And yet, somehow I feel responsible. Should I just surrender to that? Is accepting responsibility necessary in order for this body-mind's existence to unfold?

@winterknight I'm interested in hearing your perspective on choice. I cannot choose to feel attracted to an obese woman, no matter how hard I try. I cannot choose to respect someone that I do not respect, no matter how hard I try. I can go on and on with these examples. But the bottom line is, it has become obvious to me that I do not really have any choice in this life. Can you comment on this?

@Truth Addict That's an interesting topic: Is everything predetermined? I used to think so. A few years ago I was heavily immersed in the teachings of Ramesh Balsekar, who taught that everything that happens is God's Will and predetermined. But, these days I'm skeptical. Not having choice doesn't necessarily mean that everything is predetermined, does it?

@seeking_brilliance Yeah, ultimately actions are not yours. But, if you don't accept responsibility for your life, you may find yourself just sitting on a couch, immobilized, not taking any action at all and probably having a victim mentality.

@Aaron p That's what I'm sayin' bro!

@Gili Trawangan So in your experience, are you able to simply sit back and witness the functioning of the body-mind and not take ownership of it?

@Gili Trawangan It's a beautiful possibility to contemplate... The possibility that things can't be any different than how they are in this moment. So much suffering would be reduced if this was truly seen.

@seeking_brilliance It might be boring but there would be far less suffering. There are certainly things in my past that I'm not proud of. It brings me some peace to contemplate the possibility that I wasn't responsible for those choices.

@seeking_brilliance Definitely feels natural for me to act as if I am responsible, but that's probably due to my conditioning from parents, school, etc. It would be interesting to see what kind of society we would have if people realized that they aren't truly responsible. There would almost certainly be less shame, guilt, hatred, pride, arrogance, etc.

@seeking_brilliance Yes, I think we do need to act as if we make choices. Accepting responsibility is an empowering thing to do.

@ajasatya I'm not trying to avoid responsibility. I'm just not convinced that I truly am responsible. I don't really feel that I deserve the credit or blame for what has happened in my life.

@Key Elements @ajasatya If I am truly capable of making choices, then I should be able to choose to feel attracted to an obese woman. But I can't do that. And so it is with everything. You don't choose to have liberal or conservative leanings. You don't choose to prefer coffee over tea. You don't choose to be a spiritual seeker.

@SunnyNewDay Even now as I feel inclined to disagree with you, I'm conscious of the fact that I am not consciously choosing to disagree with you. I really have no say in the matter. Having said that, I think it's necessary for us to act as if we make choices.