Joscha

Disclaimer: this is not meant to deter anyone from lsd. It just so happens that I got into a negative situation with it. I am writing this post so I don't feel alone with it anymore and perhaps to receive a few helpful ideas. Hello guys, two weeks ago I took 60 ug lsd. First two thirds of the trip were positive: mild visual changes, feeling of lightness and fun, laughter, etc. There was also a point where I became very aware of my being, with a feeling of strong inner peace. I seem to react quite sensitively. Things took a turn in the last third. I slowly started to feel uncomfortable. Thoughts started to loop, I would get stuck on a thought and hope it would go away, but that seemed to make it stronger. Things like "I want the trip to stop", "I'm gonna freak out", "Something terrible is going to happen", "I'm losing control". There was a very sudden shift and I suddenly felt myself in extreme danger. Danger of myself freaking out and hurting myself. So I immediately took an old xanax I had lying around, though I don't know if that had any real effect, but it calmed me immediately after swallowing a little bit, in a placebo kind of way. I still, for the rest of the trip, had to exert a lot of mental effort at not freaking out. I had to tell my friend he had to lie down with me. I forced him to give me easy calculation exercises to solve in my head. I told him to keep me engaged. I had to distract myself as much as possible, watching stuff with him on my iPad, trying very hard to focus on normal things instead of my thoughts. I was in survival mode. I also seemed to regress and became a little like a young boy, I felt like a scared, dependent child. There was this strong desire to be held and protected. After a while I felt better, my friend left and I could sleep. I was intensely exhausted. The next day is a bit of a blur. I was mainly resting I think, I can't remember so well. For one week after the trip I had a stinging pain in my chest area, close to the heart. The second day after the trip I had to work. I was talking to a client and mid conversation, I had a similar thought again, like in the trip. "What if I freak out". There was also this weird, strange uncertainty whether I was really sober. Things didn't "look" sober, but there also weren't any obvious visual effects. My heart started pounding like crazy. I was very afraid of my life. I would see images of me freaking out, hurting myself. I also had these ideas of "what if this never stops". I felt very stuck, similar to during the trip. I still pulled through the conversation. After she left I seriously considered going to a clinic. I had to exert effort again at not losing myself in the thought loops. They were not as intense as during the trip and I had more concentration power, but the fact that this was happening without a substance is what made it, in a way, even scarier. I used affirmations to help myself, even though I was never an affirmations type person. Things like "I am the observer, good things are coming to me, I am strong, I am stable, I am centred, I am sober, god is with me (I am not religious but the concept of a benevolent god helped me). On that second day after the trip those were very helpful. I would talk to myself aloud the entire evening, repeating myself over and over again. It was a random idea to do that and it helped somehow. The days after the anxiety would come in waves. I get triggered also by places, like the kitchen and my room (because that's where it started). I was seriously happy when "normal" worries would reappear after a few days, like work and relationship stress. I was literally relishing a bad mood over this survival mode situation. I thought I was pretty much good, but then yesterday I felt this mild anxiety during the afternoon again. It's this very subtle shift in how I notice my thoughts. And it build up slowly. I tried to ignore it. At night I laid in bed , very tired, and the loops seriously started. There the thought "I am dying" and the sensation I connect with that from earlier, other lsd trips, appeared. Here again I was scared of freaking out. My heart pounded crazy. In these situations I feel like there's sudden adrenaline shot into my veins. I had to get up in the middle of the night and go running. Then, while walking around, I was doing "The Work" from Byron Katie on the thoughts (Mainly: I am dying, I am losing control, I have to do something against the thoughts, I have to control, I can't trust myself, I am in danger, I have to do something against this, etc.). This was also very helpful, even though it took a while and a lot of focus. I also used a mindfulness technique on the walk, where I simply named all the stuff I saw with simple words. The techniques I have used for help were just sudden ideas, I don't know why they "came" to me at particular moments. I have used lsd many years ago excessively and then had a disastrous, traumatising trip. Afterwards I have taken, just a few times, psilocybin truffles in small, but not micro, doses. With truffles I have not yet had bad trips, which confuses me, as it is still quite similar to the lsd experience. I have also used lsd a handful times with microdoses, up to 30 ug, and had no bad trips. You might wonder, why the hell would I take it again after a very bad experience? I think the memory of the badness from the bad trips back then on lsd has somewhat faded and my thought was, since its such a low dose (before my bad trips only started at 500 ug and up..) and I have someone experienced there with me, it won't be an issue. Well, jokes on me I guess. I am attached to the positive experience I had on it, apparently enough to forget the bad stuff. Im wondering if it's the length of the lsd trips that trigger me at some point, as all the bad stuff on my trips has always started in the last third of the trip. Since truffles have shorter duration, maybe that's one reason for why they haven't triggered me. The thing is, I don't have these panic attacks everyday. But there is this background anxiety often. And I am scared that it is a sort of macroversion of the whole loop. You know, the loop starts with mild anxious thoughts and discomfort. And then, after a while of it not getting better, it starts to get out of control, becoming "I must get out". And the shift is then very sudden. It goes from 20 percent fear to 100 percent fear. And the 20 percent slowly build up first. That's the micro situation. What if that's happening on the macro-scale now. I feel this sense of discomfort and anxiety. And I am scared of the flipping point. Sometimes life then starts to feel like a trip and I feel incredibly stuck. I also just feel very "wobbly" all the time, like I can't balance myself properly. It's weird how I want to go back to my sober state how it was before the trip, as I was kind of miserable then too. But my misery had nothing to do with fearing for my life. I guess suffering is relative. I had to write it down and post it somewhere that's already helped. Perhaps someone has a similar experience and has something helpful to share. A part of me is quite scared to have permanently fucked myself up. Though I still have hope that things will quiet down. Thanks a lot for reading and have a good day.

@Oppositionless Oh cool I didn't know there was a forum! I only know book version Jed McKenna. Where can I find the invisible guru forum jed mckenna? Why do you think he presents a nihilistic perspective in his books?

I think Jed McKenna would say that self actualisation (or growing up into human adulthood) is what everybody wants. Waking up, awakening, is what nobody wants. Because you don't gain anything from it. He say's he only recommends it to those who are so sick of falseness that they literally can't do anything else. Based on how you phrase the question, it would seem to me like self actualisation is what you want. It is important to a person to grow up. It is not important to the person to awaken, because that's the end. I feel like both are important and can be done simultaneously. If truth is what you truly care about, focus on awakening. If you want happiness, the good life, a meaningful life, focus on self actualisation. Self actualisation seems to me more like a scale or a spectrum. It may not ever really end. So once you have grown up enough at some point the desire for truth may arise. Its not like you end the actualisation part and then move onto awakening, I don't think. Plenty of growing up to do after awakening, if the developmental models are right. Look at your life and it will probably become obvious what should be the next step.

Hmm a few things come to mind.. - Something creative that doesn't use analytical brain power, like light drawing and painting. - Wood carving - Meditating - Singing - Spending time with friends or coexisting around each other - gardening or taking care of house plants - stretching - Chatting with ChatGPT There are literally infinite options. Ask your intuition and then let it go and wait for what comes up

Beautiful! Good luck to you

Byron Katie

@Vibroverse No, I'm not sure. Right now they are both images in my awareness. But its still practical to make the distinction, otherwise I would constantly talk to people about things we did in my dreams, which they wouldn't remember.

Haha, you've got good points. That's why I separated them in my post (dream Leo and waking Leo). I know of course they're not really connected. But perhaps it shows how my subconscious thinks of him as a guide, which is why it placed his image in the dream instead of someone else. I didn't thank waking Leo for what dream Leo did. I thanked him for education about psychedelics. I would not thank the torture dream Leo. It would make me wonder what my subconscious is thinking of him to put him in that position in the dream.

Hi guys! I have a difficult relationship with psychedelics, specifically lsd, ever since a horror trip a few years ago. Yesterday night in my dream, I was visiting dream Leo for some time and he offered me lsd. I find it interesting that he was the one who challenged me in the dream to face my fear of lsd (but then again he brought me onto psychedelics). He was super friendly and kind btw. I took it and became very nervous (I multiple times checked in the dream that I had my emergency benzo just in case, and I did. in retrospect I love how the dream allowed me to have this safery net, instead of pushing me into panic). The nervousness was however very bearbable compared to the usual anxiety attacks I get from real psychedelics in waking life after taking psychedelics. I think its because I didn’t really feel bodily sensations in the dream the same way (heartbeat sensations always trigger me). Nothing much trip wise happened for a bit, but then something fascinating happened. I was talking to dream leo about something unrelated, when suddenly I woke up. But the waking up from this dream was different than usual, in that I was never before so aware of the transition between dream and waking state. I completely felt the shift in consciosuness. The waking up was quite sudden. I could describe it like the way when you’re waiting and suddenly you feel the psychedelic kick in and raise your consiousness. I think I partly understand now why people call spiritual insight ‚awakening‘. The feeling reminded me so much of mystical trips in the past and also the way leo describes it in his video ˋwhat does awakening feel like‘. I really wonder how it works that the waking up felt so different from usual, as I didn’t take anything outside of the dream. I just felt like sharing that story. Feel free to share your dream psychedelic experiences too, or other strange beautiful dream experiences! Also thank you dream leo for taking me on a trip! And if you read this, thank you waking leo for opening me up to psychedelics. Its a difficult journey for me but even so I am very thankful for the experiences it has given me.

I have a solo meditation retreat planned, in case I won’t make it through the waiting list of the vipassana retreat. Aaand hopefully backpack a little bit in France hehe

Its so beautiful!

Byron Katie

I don’t know how it is compared to Chile, but Germany actually isn’t that expensive compared to other western european countries (especially food). Eg dutch peope regularly cross the border to buy groceries (although especially alcohol). The place matters a lot of course (If you stay in Munich it will get very expensive). I couldn’t imagine the war stretching as far as Germany. When it comes to dating I would say the opposite of @NYMPHAI, its a good opportunity to get skills maybe especially because people come off a little cold. If you can do it there, you’re good. Also if you’re in a nice place there will be plenty of young, open and friendly people.

Hi! I'm a student with a lot of flexibility, which often leads to me procrastinating and losing sight of my vision. With infrastructure here I mean anything that lies in your area of control but that, once set up deliberately, functions to help you without or with little of your deliberate action (your home set up, your devices, your social circle, your place, where you live, etc.) What are your ways in creating an infrastructure at home to ensure you are keeping on track with your goals and aspirations? Where do you keep your technology and how is it set up for maximum productivity and minimum distraction? In what ways did you change your environment to stay on track with your vision for your life? Do you use automatic reminders? Sticky notes on your walls? Arranged phone calls with self actualisation friends? Or do you rely solely on your own psychology to always keep you on track? If so, how did you program yourself to be that awesome? What is a gadget/tool that helped you create a good infrastructure for your self actualisation? What is your general opinion and tip on infrastructure building? What other valuable questions concerning this topic could I be asking but didn't think of yet? Thanks a lot!

@ExistentialMuse Hmm okay interesting. You say that if the past and future is illusory, then God experiences every moment as the first and last one… I see a duality here. To have a first moment there needs to be a last moment. The concept of “first” or “last” sort of already implies time to me. I might be wrong but I think I’ve heard Byron Katie say that in the end only the present moment exists, but then she goes further to say that even the present moment is a story in a way. Because it can’t be held onto. Its already gone. I’m making sense of the finitude question in this way: I think actually all things that are “finite”, are imagined. Which would mean that there are no actual finite things, there is only one infinite “thing” that appears in different forms. You said something about “all moments of eternity”, but if there are mutliple different moments thats a duality again. It makes it seem like there are these seperate temporal entities called “moments” that are distinct from each other. When I’ve looked closely before, “moments” didn’t seem detached from one another but just flowed, “they” were one. Eternity may be just one moment, so to speak, not multiple moments. But to say “moment” doesn’t really even make sense, because its a never ending moment with no beginning. From this perspective I would agree that god has not and will not experience all moments. God is being one eternal moment. these are just personal thoughts, no guarantees