VeganAwake

We are just like the grass growing and the salmon spawning, just like a wildfire or disease spreading. It's not crucial or important. It just happens. It doesn't matter if it continues or stops. It doesn't matter if reality is understood or not, or if you keep trying The fame and fortune won't matter or eating healthy and exercising. The meditation, yoga and spiritual practices neither. Nothing will save us, not knowing, not enlightenment, not not knowing It's totally hopeless, but in this understanding there is also a sense of relief, a relaxation glimpse, a sense of unconditional freedom maybe. An invitation to inevitable hopeless freedom

Then that's what's being experienced there! It's whole, complete and perfect. There is no issue here with that or what anyone else you mentioned believes or has said 🙏

Because I was trying to poke at the self-illusion over there.......👉, trying to get it fired up.....make it more obvious. The self and ego you are describing is the same illusion. The ego runs deeper and is more prevalent than you're giving it credit. It's that which is shaping the perception there.

The "self" is that Breakingthewall character that believes itself to be all of reality. That which places certain spiritual figures on a pedestal to idolize, and simultaneously disregards others that dont seem to match its parameters of belief. Its that character that feels threatened when it's belief system is put into question and then doubles down to secure its foundational delusions of grandiose. Circular logic is one of its most used survival strategies. It sounds secure enough in its beliefs, but it is actually deathly afraid of looking inwards and recognizing its own unreality. It's that which feels its got so much to loose because of how much spiritual knowledge it believes it has gained over the years. It believes itself to be fairly high up on the spiritual ladder and is deeply invested in identifying as that character that knows.

Sincere misunderstanding due to partial or incomplete awakening experience. If the survival strategy/identification game of the self illusion isn’t recognized clearly, I would describe it as incomplete.

I would guess it probably just started off as a story, but then after gaining some popular belief, it was realized it could be used to manipulate and control behavior.

What sometimes seems to happen during a mystical experience is the energy used to uphold the "self identification construct" temporarily collapses and seems to dissipate back into everything. When this occurs it creates an intense feeling of freedom, wholeness, all-inclusiveness or "being everything". But eventually this "energetic self identification" returns, but with the misunderstanding of being everything now instead of just the small limited body/mind. This phenomenon is often referred to as the spiritual ego, and it's almost impossible to be seen through. It really just ends of being an incomplete enlightenment experience.

Yup, and that process feels like a slow rebalancing of energy distribution. The self character isn't forgotten. It’s been at the forefront of the mind for a very long time and there are long-term habits/preferences still intact. Some of those things change rather quickly and some don't. The things that did change quickly seemed to be directly tied to that conditioned self character.......for example the self guilt about desperately needing to advance my rank in the military to keep up with the competition, that almost dropped immediately. Also my fitness goals changed really quickly. The entire concern about upholding my overall professional image dropped basically. As far as the acting out roles thing.....its similar to an actor/actress playing a fictional character. The actor knows the character isn't real, but when they are playing the role, it's almost as if the body's energy brings it to life. Something that wasn't expected was how clearly the understanding is of how this sense of self becomes so prevalent in each body/mind. It's like everything changes and nothing changes. I didn't stop being a father, in fact it's much better because there isn't a me trying to play out my hopes and dreams through my boys. It's easy to tell what they are interested in......just have to pay attention to them!

Frustrated narcissism coupled with little person syndrome: I'm everything, i'm not insignificant in the big scheme of reality. Why? Because I said so and that proves it. Behold my powers and witness my infinite intelligence. See those clouds and lightning over there.......im doing that!!! Prove me wrong!!! 🤣

There doesn't need to be another pov. The freedom is not knowing. Leave it empty please

I see, Interesting because it wasn't actually obvious right at first. You caught that lol. At first, it was still assumed to have been there for as long as I could remember, even though it had become obvious that it wasn't currently real. It was quite possibly somewhere around 18 months later, when it became totally clear that it was never actually there from start...... it had just seemed to be there. The self character isn't totally forgotten. In fact the body can still play the role of that character almost perfectly because there had been identification as that self for so long. The difference is that character is completely understood to be fiction, so things aren't taken so seriously, there is no loger getting stuck in that drama play. It's freedom from the seriousness of that identification, but for nobody. Like energy just acting out roles. Certain memories can get fuzzy though, as if the recognition effects them a bit. Definitely not like amnesia or anything though 🤔

I've definitely closed some gaps in my day

It's definitely an interesting belief system. What is the key takeaway if there is one? What is the importance of recognizing: "the self is not the reality, it's the reality expressed as a self, knowing that it is: What does it matter and whom does is matter for? Is there any benefit to this apparent realization, or is it just truth for truth sake?

"Uneasy lies the head that wears a crown" - William Shakespeare

Who knows it? What exactly is that which claims to know these so-called facts? I just wouldn't describe it as knowledge. It's more like a description of reality after all the conditioned beliefs, concepts, stories, assumptions crumble away. But I can understand how that would seem like a knowing of sorts. I would admit a master auto mechanic has the knowledge about the total functioning of certain vehicles. It's happening directly in front of him, he can see everything live in action as it happens. But I don't actually know reality, & I'm certainly not the totality of it. It was here doing its thing long before this body learned its human name and how to go pee pee in the toilet without splashing everywhere.

Totally agree 🤙

I stumbled onto his videos on YouTube while looking for someone who had a similar experience around 2019 At first I thought the guy was crazy. It sounded foreign or something, but I could hear the sincerity in his voice and see it in his body language. After a little bit of getting used to his language/articulation it was like : "holy shit, this guy is describing an almost identical situation to mine here, but using different verbiage" It's a trip!

Yeah, it's all of those things and I suspect its a little different for each body. That lived sense of self will never dissolve entirely, it's energy flow is to habitual, but it can seem to loosen up and feel lighter. Here it wasn't anything physical initially. It was seeing/realizing this sense of myself wasn't as solid as it had once seemed to be. Like a glimpse at first, then little by little, over a period of a couple days, it started to become obvious that it wasn't actually there or real. Like the sense of self went from a sturdy brick house to a wobbly house of cards in days. And at a certain point, it became obvious that it never was. Everything felt lighter and less serious almost immediately. The energy put into the clinch of this self illusion is incredible, and weirdly only really noticeable after it relaxes.

That logic sounds very circular and smells of buddhism. One of the reasons awakening is so radical is because it completely disregards the knower as real and credible. The knower there, being the Breakingthewall character and everything that identification believes it knows or has acquired since young age. That's why it's often referred to as unknowing. It's rare because this identification is so solid and habitual it's damn near impossible to see through it.......some say nobody ever sees through it!......that the seeing through it is simultaneously the end of it!

Yeah, I totally get what you mean, there's only so many words that seem like they match best to the situation. Probably sounds like a copycat. The sense of self doesn't actually break or die because it's not real. Those are just the words attempting to describe how it seems. At least here, it was a clear recognition that carries with it the ability to slowly strangle/deflate the self illusion. Writing a long example about yourself is kind of like an exercise to reveal how much of its concept is just assumed and in the head. Interestingly here, a lot of the "sense of self" was descriptions heard from other people over the years and just assumed to be a me.

Is it more that just an identification with thinking? Does it create a physical experience in the body and what is that experience?

Unknowing is similar to not taking a position on a topic but still being engaged. Similar to watching the NFL without having a team. It allows a big picture focus instead of getting tunnel vision on teams and players. But its also not denying the role of the players and teams. We aren't trying to crucify or demonize this "sense of self", we are just watching it, seeing how it labels and takes ownership. Shining a light on it to see if it's actually real