Zigzag Idiot

Is Stage Green A Weird One for Men (Spiral Dynamics)? Being a nerd hillbilly in a red - blue hillbilly culture, it wasn't a simple and easy unfolding sort of thing.

Leaving aside any claim of enlightenment,,,, Maintenance. If I don't boss my Automaton into sitting still in Centering Prayer twice a day, it has a runaway.

A month ago I finished a group reading and study of Beelzebub's Tales To His Grandson. This Law of three is connected with us being what he called 3 brained beings or 3 centered beings. Intellect and feeling, grounded in sensation of body. The human condition Gurdjieff taught is that we are unbalanced and always rely on our strong suit,,, our comfort zone in terms of how we exist when we're on 'autopilot'. Either overweighted in intellect, emotion or preoccupied with the physical body. If we don't channel kundalini through a balanced 3 centered awareness, the result is (Kundabuffer) imagination run amuck. We get all big eyed and full of shit about everything, especially oneself. I wish I had known of Leo's - Mankind Is The Bullshitting Animal, to share with the other members of the reading group, which I watched this morning. Leo describes perfectly what Gurdjieff was trying to teach. For whatever it's worth, my formula at the conclusion of 'The Tales' - Kundalini = chi = Prana = Kundabuffer = imagination Kundalini + 3 Centered Awareness = Holy Prana Holy Prana leads to higher understanding. Gurdjieff used the term Holy Prana in 'The Tales' but he composed the book in a confusing and difficult style to read forcing the reader to work at untangling it all.

I like a lot of things Maurice Nicoll said in his Psychological Commentaries On The Teaching of Gurdjieff and Ouspensky. One of which was: "We have a right not to be negative." It meant for me that I don't have to take something in a negative way. Even something considered very unpleasant. It also means I can communicate unpleasant things and not be emotionally negative.

Drawing on fuzzy memory of the wording of a good one liner I heard years ago, I think it goes,,, One's relation to paradox is a barometer of one's enlightenment.

Slipping past the collective ego as a universal heretic We Have to Risk the Aloneness and the Terror of Being Totally on Our Own To have a free mind is to be a universal heretic. You don’t believe in the ultimate reality of any concept. You can assume any belief you find useful and attractive, but you don’t need to hold on to any of it. Without being captured by your beliefs, you are strong enough and confident enough to throw away any and all beliefs and perspectives, each and every philosophy and story. You can stand totally alone, completely independent of all that comes through the mind, through time and space. This station of realization is difficult and rare. Most of us don’t have the nerve to lose our minds. Although terrifying, it is necessary for true freedom. We have to risk that we may be wrong. We have to risk the aloneness and the terror of being totally on our own. We have to risk cutting all of our supports, burning all of our bridges, destroying all of our boats. They are all ultimately and fundamentally concepts that come from hearsay or, at best, from our own past experiences. Even the concepts and knowledge that have come from our own immediate experiences cannot be relied on. That knowledge is like Buddha’s words—old, unless corroborated in this moment. Maybe a week ago you had an experience of realization, but how do you know that will be the same today? Who said that God won’t change or that self-realization should continue being the same today? In other words, we cannot hold on to any concept past our direct experience of it; otherwise, what we’re doing is believing a story. Whether someone else’s or our own, a story is a story, not true reality here and now. To be truly independent and autonomous, we need to be free from the concepts acquired from others as well as our own past experiences. Diamond Heart Book Five, pg. 63

You got a point there. I always overlook the obvious,,,

As a westerner, I can say this. Were mostly a bunch of undisaplined,shallow, entitled, materialistic, complainers. Trump is possibly a subset of Hopeless Idiot, the objectively hopeless idiot, because he was been consumed by his own egotism. I don't think Trump is capable of putting himself 'in another's shoes'. He's cut off from his Conscience.

@benny That's a good point. Awakening is painful. As a hypothetical- Whats laid out in Beelzebub's Tales To His Grandson is that kundalini feeds our imagination and this very customized thing keeps us asleep. When we really see "the terror of the situation" we can never sleep comfortably again. Kundalini has to be processed through 3 Centered Awareness for it to become it's rightful substance - "Holy Prana" From a Egyptian Sufi named Dzoû’l Noûn, who lived in the 12th century: “All men are dead, except those who know. All those who know are dead, except those who practice. All those who practice are dead, except those who act. All those who act are lost, except those who act with righteous intent. And those who act with righteous intent, are all in grave danger.” @Sahil Pandit How late is too late?

Great question! First off I think the west is tilted more into the pathological masculine and are more cut off from their feelings and subtle intuition. It seems to me western culture really encourages men to repress their feelings more. Especially in the past. The west is too neurotic, thinking dominated. Mostly shallow thinking and too much glibness.

In my inquiry I've noticed that complaining just perpetuates itself. I used to be a world class complainer until I realized how much 'good' it did. Complaint just perpetuates negative emotion. My endocrine type (adrenal-mars) are people who see the glass half empty. But there is a difference in that and expressing negative emotion. Adrenal types are often people who can't sit still for long especially if they are moving centered,,,,, oops that's adding in another typology. It was touched on in the 5 Fools YouTube though. When I first started doing Fourth Way self observation, I typed myself as an Intellectual type. But further down the road when the emotional pendulum was really gettin it, I thought I must really be a person with a center of gravity in the emotional center. We all have a psychological blind spot. Be horrified,,, it's true. My blind spot kept me from seeing that my center of gravity was in the instinctive center as it's called in 'The Work'. The instinctive center is subdivided into physical instinctive-sexual-moving (how we move;coordination ) Fouth way work involves a lot of sucky information like psychological blind spots. People get offended when you point out evidence of their own spiritual sleep. Being able to refer to oneself as an idiot or a fool is a way of working on self importance. Being self important wastes a lot of energy. Most everyone reading this already knows that. Complaining is a form of self importance.

You say the hill's too steep to climb Chiding! You say you'd like to see me try Climbing! You pick the place and I'll choose the time And I'll climb The hill in my own way just wait a while, for the right day And as I rise above the treeline and the clouds I look down hear the sound of the things you said today Fearlessly the idiot faced the crowd, smiling Merciless, the magistrate turns 'round, frowning and who's the fool who wears the crown Go down in your own way And everyday is the right day And as you rise above the fear lines in his brow You look down Hear the sound of the faces in the crowd You'll never walk alone,,,,,

It is safe if both parties are striving Fools. Those who are working on themselves. A perfect Idiot is a Realized Idiot. Realized Idiot has awakened Conscience and is not concerned with appearances of being self contradictory. A striving fool or a Perfect Idiot will walk into the street and point at a sign and say, "That sign is crooked."

Martin Butler began his Corporeal Fantasy channel anonymously but revealed his identity a few months ago. Here is a little more of is foolishness.

Through self observation and inquiry becoming aware of deep and life long semi- or unconscious defense mechanisms of a schizoid splitting off as well as adoption of different forms of Grandiosity to compensate for insecurities. Both are very common though. The schizoid splitting off is that -stick your head in the sand like and ostrich- tendency. As well as the -pretend it didn't happen- kind of behavior. Grandiosity beginning in early childhood with adopting the Persona of Movie Heroes or Protagonists. Default return to pretending I was Captain Kirk or Spock from about age 6 onward. Star Wars came out when I was 10. Lots of mileage from it,,, Luke, Hans and yoda. I enjoyed pretending that I was Grady from Sanford and Sons also, for some reason,,, It was painful and humiliating to integrate and process how far into adulthood these unconscious mechanisms went.

@tsuki Thanks! I,m listening to and enjoying the Alan Watts YouTube.

A few centuries ago, the Greek word idiotes referred to a simple or private man and derived from the word idios which means to be "of one's own" or particular or special. "To be declared an Idiot is a compliment of the highest degree - it means that one is not sharing the common illusions which sedate us all but rather has found his or her private, unique individuality." - From Bruno Martin. The word fool has also been used interchangeably by a few attempting this path since Gurdjieffs death. link to fragments about Science of Idiotism and a little about Gurdjieff https://selfdefinition.org/gurdjieff/quotes/science-of-idiotism.htm Will Mesa's contribution to this Idiocy,,,, https://willmesa.wordpress.com/2015/04/18/on-idiocy-and-idiots/

Ok, I made a couple of wrong assumptions. I understand better, thanks.

I like Adyashanti on YouTube. Haven't read any of his books yet. Two very readable 'spiritual classics', Robert deRopp's THE MASTER GAME https://www.amazon.com/Master-Game-Pathways-Consciousness-Classics/dp/0895561506 Chogum Trungpa's Cutting Through Spiritual Materialism https://www.amazon.com/Cutting-Through-Spiritual-Materialism-Chogyam/dp/1570629579/ref=sr_1_5?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1545284975&sr=1-5&keywords=chogyam+trungpa

Coleman Barks reads 12th century Persian mystical poet Rumi "Where did I come from?" "What am I supposed to be doing?" "What is the soul?" "If I could taste one sip of an answer, I could break out of this prison for drunks."

Good and very relevant question! A. H. Almaas's Diamond Approach was born partly out of his very intense early Gurdjieff group work. He describes 'basic trust' as a crucial element in one's realization of Being. From his online Glossary I picked out one of his book excerpts on basic trust and pasted below. The Innate Sense that Life is Fundamentally Benevolent The presence of basic trust indicates that you have the innate sense that life is fundamentally benevolent, and that benevolence exists independent of you and your actions. You will have this sense to the extent that your grounding in the universe has not been disturbed. The relative presence or absence of basic trust is a belly quality, something one’s whole being is either grounded in or not. The disturbance of basic trust is a significant factor in ego development because the perspective of ego is diametrically opposed to the sense of basic trust. The ego’s perspective arises out of a lack of this trust. It is based on distrust, on paranoia, on fear, on the conviction that you're not going to be adequately taken care of and that the universe is not there to hold and take care of you in the ways that you need. This conviction causes you to believe that you have to engage in all kinds of manipulations and games to get your needs met and to make things work out. Facets of Unity, pg. 25 From Almaas's Glossary page of his book excerpts about Basic Trust https://www.diamondapproach.org/glossary/refinery_phrases/basic-trust

I like this song. Reminds me to let go and see through the eyes of my inner child.

I've received some good help through a self study of the Diamond Approach in regards to shame. The book excerpt I share below may seem harsh but shame which comes mostly from super-ego attacks is dealt with head on. Dealing with shame as one of the first things in work on self frees up a lot of energy that can then be applied to further horizontal and vertical growth. Working with Shame Let's suppose a man feels ashamed every time he feels tenderness toward another person. The superego attacks him with shame and belittling, according to the judgment that tenderness in a man means he is weak and feminine. To begin work on his superego, first the man needs to be aware of the attack, its content, and the content of the judgment. Then he needs to understand the judgment psychodynamically. For instance, he might remember that his father had the attitude that men should be tough, that tenderness belongs to girls and women. Here he understands that he introjected his father's attitude and made it part of his superego. He usually responds to this attitude, which is an attack on himself, with shame and repression. Now, in applying this method, he envisions his father and tells him, in his mind: "Daddy, go to hell! Who cares what you think of me?" Here he is dealing with his superego in a way he could not have dealt with his father in his childhood. He was not able to defend against his father because he believed him, was scared of him, and needed him. This method might not work the first time, but if it is done repeatedly, it will bring out the man's aggression, and he will be able to assert himself and separate from his father's attitude. The defense needs to be intelligent to be effective. For instance, if the man responds with: "Father, it's not true I am feminine and weak. Tenderness is good and does not mean weakness or femininity," then he is being reasonable with a superego that is not really rational. Also, he probably has tried this response many times but without success because in this response the man is on the defensive; he is trying to justify his feeling and to account to somebody else for its being okay. Any justification already implies some guilt, and so it won't work. The response of "Daddy, go to hell" is effective because there is no attempt at explanation or justification and thus no implication of unconscious guilt. The man just throws back the attack and refuses to listen to its content. He completely disengages from the superego and does not give it any power over him. Essence with the Elixir of Enlightenment, pg. 138 More excerpts about shame from A H Almaas Glossary https://www.diamondapproach.org/glossary/refinery_phrases/shame Getting more to the heart of it, excerpts about superego https://www.diamondapproach.org/glossary/refinery_phrases/superego I just recently discovered Leo's good work. I'm betting he's got a video related to this (super ego attacks) that I don't know about,,,,,

Me too. I'm a counterphobic type 6. These folks have described the enneatypes with each level of Spiral Dynamics. Type Six: The Questioner/The Trusting Self. In the Yellow level of consciousness, Type Six, the Questioner, is able to trust himself for the first time. The Trusting Self transforms rigidity and inconsistency into solidity as faith is embodied. From an understanding of the need for adaptive, flexible systems, the Trusting Self can operate under external authority when needed, or can serve as the authority. “Authority can be authorities because I’m the authority too, and I trust myself” (Ooten, Unpublished; Ooten, 2010). From: http://www.consciousdynamicsllc.com/home/levels_of_consciousness.html Connected with one's dominant endocrine gland and the enneagram are essence (body) types. I'm a Solar Saturn-Mars. http://destinyclemens.com/Destinyclemens/Body_Types.html