Zigzag Idiot

What is Love? Are there different kinds of love?

@tsuki I don't think it applies the way you laid it out but I agree with what you say and that it does often apply to many. I'm saying this just as an objective third party who's read @flowboy Journal pretty consistent. I liked the book ThE Superior Man by David Deita also, he recommends I liked both those videos. The warm guys understand about finding third force. They left out Fonzie, when they listed the cool guys, though..

I think the ability to create metaphor and allegories to communicate requires 3 centered awareness. I went to go google about what that ability requires or signifies 2 hours ago and got diverted. After a google search I got diverted again reading the best explanation of Platos cave, that I've ever read. https://laney.edu/humanities_philosophy/allegory-of-the-cave-a-modest-interpretation/ While in the shower I realized the Georgia guidestones are not a Manifesto for an evil world government. That just shows the amount of negativity in a lot of peoples subconscious if you YouTube the subject. Instead they're a Legominism as well as a prophesy of an age where humanity awakens and we shut off mechanical baby making. There's too many people for this planet with our current technology. I don't know if what I just expressed is true. I just pulled it out of thin air. I think I'll go read again what the guidestones actually say. It's been a few years Hope there's something relatable. I got diverted, then after going off on a tangent, turned down a side street, I don't cook or do math.

In Talks on Beelzebub's Tales, Bennett distinguishes four types of suffering - Unnecessary Suffering, Unavoidable Suffering, Voluntary Suffering and Intentional Suffering. The first is Unnecessary Suffering. This would be the type of suffering that we incur because of our unreasonable attitudes and expectations towards others, from our ill-will, hatred and rejection of others, from doubt, possessiveness, arrogance and self pity. In other words, suffering arising from our self-importance. The second is Unavoidable Suffering. This would be the type of suffering that comes to us by accident or from events beyond our control, such as interpersonal conflicts, war, disaster, disease or death. Third, we have Voluntary Suffering. This would be the type of suffering that we take upon ourselves in order to accomplish a personal aim, such as an athlete who disciplines himself to win a race, or a student who labours to get good grades. And finally we have Intentional Suffering. According to Bennett, this would be the kind of suffering that we take upon ourselves in order to accomplish an impersonal or altruistic goal, one that is directed more towards service to others or to the Work, and not for any personal gain. Bennett assumes that this is what Gurdjieff meant by Intentional Suffering.

I'm not disagreeing with what you say. I would just argue in there being also this personal aspect of essence which is the cleaned up version of the false personality that the Fourth Way speaks of and realizing the nothingness of it. All the passions of the Enneagram within oneself transformed into the virtues on the flip side of the specific energy.

Being a Human Being and Still Being the Absolute The development of consciousness has to do with living in this life from the perspective of the Absolute. The Personal Essence, the Pearl Beyond Price, has to do with being a human being and still being the Absolute. If you’re just the Absolute, you are not a human being. But you live in this world, you have a physical body and a mind, you have work and relationships. You need the Personal Essence in order to be able to live personally as a human being and still be the Absolute. So the development of the personal aspect has to do with integrating all of these things that are important for our life into the various levels of consciousness, and then into the Absolute. This is an actual process that has to do with the metabolism of the Absolute into the Personal Essence. Although it is rarely mentioned in spiritual literature, the integration of the person into the Absolute is vital because we live in the world and not in a monastery or cave. Integrating the person into the Absolute is more difficult than experiencing the Absolute. Integration requires that you deal with and metabolize your unconscious and your personal history. You have to really let all of the unconscious come out, to face all of your specific issues and areas of conflict and ignorance. Many traditions don’t care about integration but strive only to reach the Absolute. They don’t care about the personal life. The point for them is to know the Absolute and leave. In other traditions, and in our work, the point is to know the Absolute and live in the world as an expression of it. So how can you live a human life from the perspective of absence? That is the realm of development, change, and transformation within consciousness. Diamond Heart Book Five, pg. 145 Development of Essence from Being Impersonal to Being Personal Unlike other aspects of Essence, this personal aspect (the pearl) goes through a process of development, growth, and expansion. Here the concepts of development and growth can be seen in their true and literal meaning. This true personality of the being is born, fed and nourished. It grows, expands, and develops in a very specific sense. It is really the development of Essence from being impersonal to being personal. Others might call it God becoming a human person, an individual. Essence with the Elixir of Enlightenment, pg. 163 Experiencing the Pearl Beyond Price The pearl beyond price, the incomparable pearl, the personal aspect of Essence is central for many important reasons. It is actually the true essential personality. It is the person. It is experienced as oneself. When the individual finally perceives it, the contented expression often is "but this is me!" The sense is of oneself as a precious being. There is then a fullness, a completeness, and a contentment. It is as if the individual feels full and complete, realized. Nothing is lacking. No more search, no desire or wanting anything else. The person feels "now I have myself. I am a complete individual. I am full. I am fullness. I am complete. I want nothing else." Essence with the Elixir of Enlightenment, pg. 161 It is Possible to Experience Egoless Beingness Thus it is possible to experience egoless beingness, to be, as a substantial presence that is not a mental construct, and still live a human, personal life, in which love, work, knowledge, creativity and accomplishment make sense, a human sense. This true existence, this presence, this being beyond time that makes sense of human and personal life, is the Personal Essence. It is the reality of which ego is only a reflection. It is the truly integrated and developed human being. This is the beautiful presence that the traditional literature of work schools calls the “pearl beyond price.” The experience of universal impersonality of ultimate reality occurs when the separate individuality is transcended, when the separate individuality is seen not to be our true self. But this is the result of transcending the personality in its totality. Something different happens when we investigate the personality’s manifestations in more detail, exploring the hidden essential truth within it. The ego is a reflection of this true element of Being, the Personal Essence, and exploring the characteristics of the reflection can lead us to the reality being reflected. By isolating and understanding the elements of the false, we can begin to approach the elements of the real. Pearl Beyond Price, pg. 32 Knowledge of the Incomparable Pearl is Rare The knowledge of the Incomparable Pearl and the process of its development is rare even in the most complete spiritual teachings, and the traditions that know it do not speak much about it. This is why the overwhelming impression one gets from most spiritual teachings is that the goal of spiritual work is the realization of impersonal Being or the realization of the Soul’s relationship to it (as in the Christian tradition.) The literature regarding the Pearl is sparse, and when it can be found, it is usually couched in metaphorical and symbolic language. Sometimes the language is more direct and descriptive, but it appears metaphorical to most people, because they lack the direct experience. The story, “The Hymn of the Soul,” in Chapter Eight, is an example. There are very few direct references to the Personal Essence in the literature, and these are found mainly in old books not in circulation. In this chapter we will describe some of those references; although they are rare, they tend to confirm and support our own understanding of the importance of the development of the Pearl. Pearl Beyond Price, pg. 115 Relating Without Object Relations The Pearl beyond price can relate in a personal way without the need to activate past object relations. So its capacity is not only innate but also natural and spontaneous. Pearl Beyond Price, pg. 172 Station of the Pearl The station of the pearl beyond price is so significant because it is not a matter of a state of consciousness or a state of being; it is rather the condition of the actualization of one's realization in one's life. Being becomes personal being, a complete human being living fully the life of objective truth. Essence with the Elixir of Enlightenment, pg. 166 The Essential Structure that the Soul Develops as She Metabolizes and Transcends her Ego Structure The pearl can also be seen as the essential structure that the soul develops as she metabolizes and transcends her ego structure. Ego structure gives the ego-self the sense of being an autonomous and unique individual. But this structure is constructed through fixed mental impressions in the soul; hence it both dissociates her from her essential ground and limits her development because of its rigidity and fixation. The essential pearl provides the soul with a sense of individuality and personhood that does not depend on fixed impressions, but on spontaneously arising forms of essential presence that structure her experience of herself and give her the capacity to function as a person. The soul matures and transforms into a person of essence. However, the qualities and actions of this person are quite fluid and flexible and are objective responses resonant to the needs and inputs of the environment. The Inner Journey Home, pg. 223 The Pearl is an Ontological Presence The pearl is the real, complete, balanced, and rounded personality that psychologists believe they are talking about when they are discussing the ego. We must remember that the ego is a structure, or structured process, whereas the pearl is Essence, which means the pearl is an ontological Presence. We call it the Personal Essence because among all the essential aspects it alone is personal. It is experienced as having a personal flavor to it, in contradistinction to impersonal. All aspects of Essence, even love and kindness, are impersonal. But the pearl is personal. And this is its miraculous quality, totally unexpected and unfathomable. Essence with the Elixir of Enlightenment, pg. 162 The Pearl is the Actualized Individuation of Your Soul When you are who you are, when you are just precisely yourself, you are your “point.” Just that. This has nothing to do with any qualities, functions, capacities, and skills you may have. It has nothing to do with your status in the world, and nothing to do with living this life in a body or not in a body. It is your nature. The Pearl Beyond Price is the connection between this genuine center and all the capacities, skills, and understanding that are a part of your growth as a human being. It allows your capacities, functions and accomplishments to develop in a genuine way as an outgrowth of your spontaneous unfoldment. It is the result of living in the moment, living in a way that is true to who you are. This is your genuine personal life, your own development, your own growth. The pearl is the actualized individuation of your Soul. So the personal essence is connected with your unique function, your unique work in this life. To actualize your particular unique work in this life means to be your personal essence. It is the essence of all that you have developed and integrated in your soul as you live a real life. Everyone is born with the true self, with the point. Although we feel that the point is unique in each of us, the quality of the point is universal. Then how do people become so different in their personal lives? This is due to the particular development of their personal essence. Diamond Heart Book Three, pg. 66 note: Almaas refers to the soul with the feminine pronoun 'she'.

This is just a small piece from Black Elk's vision he had as a boy. The whole thing is fairly cryptic and some have compared it to Ezekiel's Vision in the Old Testament. Joseph Campbell studied on it a lot. The first sentence here is powerful. And while I stood there I saw more than I can tell and understood more than I saw; And while I stood there I saw more than I can tell and understood more than I saw; for I was seeing in a sacred manner the shapes of all things in the spirit, and the shape of all shapes as they must live together like one being. And I saw that the sacred hoop of my people was one of many hoops that made one circle, wide as daylight and as starlight, and in the center grew one mighty flowering tree to shelter all the children of one mother and one father. And I saw that it was holy. Most agree that the definitive book is titled Black Elk Speaks.

The Heartmath Institute talks about a balanced resonance that the heart gets into. There's an entrainment with the prefrontal lobes that occurs simultaneously. The actual electromagnetic waves produced by the thumping of the heart create a field that they have measured out at around 10-15 feet away from the body. They claim when we're are in a balanced state, our personal electromagnetic wavefield expands. Itzhak Bentov was a European genius who was writing books about this stuff in the 1970's. Stalking The Wild Pendulum is one of my all-time favorite book Titles. With new studies and increasing technological sophistication, Joseph Chilton Pearce pushed the ideas further 20 years later around 2000.

It's both funny and sad. One of Robin Williams first movies.

This movie had a lot of extreme currents in relation to issues of femininity. It might make a good frame of reference for discussion. Have you ever watched it?

@wallada You may need to return to the home or store tab and see if your logged in. Then click on my account.

I'm a little rough on books. I bought mine in November of 2016. For 2-3 years before that I consulted their older book The Guide to the I CHING

Cool!!! ?? Good way to put it. I'm tickled you picked one up. Lots of good to be found also in the Appendices including a Glossary. My copy is beginning to show a little bit of wear.

You also know it, not thru conceptual knowledge but by BEING it. Through emotional energy put into dance. This is going to be a better grounding through the body than the average person gets. Better grounding opens up higher mind. Intuitive mind. Emotional Intellegence.

This guy has to be in 3 Centered Knowing. Amazing,,, I think maybe he is a Mercury Saturn. He's also manifesting from his Kings. King of hearts/emotion, Clubs/instincts, diamonds/thinking, spades/moving to be in such a flow. The playing cards amount to another typology based on the bodies 4 'centers' which can be added to the personality and essence/endocrine typology. For more nuance. The instinctive and moving centers are combined to create the belly center. Four becoming three. The basis for Gurdjieff calling humans 3 brained beings.

I've had to work against this tendency myself. So I've practiced being more mindful when I start the timer and know for sure that it started. This has seemed to help some. I had to work with this issue a few months ago. I always have plenty of thoughts to let go of and daydreams to get out of. Ive developed the habit of 'taking a snapshot' right when the timer goes off ending the Centering Prayer Meditation. The snapshot telling me if I was daydreaming, in the middle of letting go of thought, or in objectless awareness. I appreciate reading about your observations and techniques. It reminds and helps me with my practices.

Maurice Nicoll Maurice Nicoll's The Psychological Commentaries on The Teaching of Gurdjieff and Ouspensky is a five volume 1760 page set that is a treasure for understanding the Work, and for many is a joy to read unlike Gurdjieff's ALL AND EVERYTHING. The influence of a Fourth Way teacher early in my discovery of the Work convinced me to buy the set which, at the time meant picking up used copies as encountered on the net for around $40 to $60 per volume. About $300 for the whole set. The stack looked so intimidating that I put off reading them for about 6 years but when I did, I feel in love with them. Being the written transcripts of Nicoll's weekly Gurdjieff group lectures, they are extremely readable. So much that when I finished I immediately reread the 1760 page set. An online Fourth Way acquaintance shared this 130 page condensed summary of the Commentaries this last year. For serious students of the Fourth Way ideas, it's a treasure twice over,,, L https://inner-world-books.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Gems_of_Wisdom.pdf Ouspensky decifered and articulated The Fourth Way better than Gurdjieff but many, including myself, gain the most understanding from reading Maurice Nicoll. One of my favorite humorous quotes from Nicoll's Commentaries about how we are often unable to quiten the mind: Nicoll psychological commentaries page 683. Have you got sufficient inner observation? Have you cleared and well dug a big space in your mind through the practice of inner attention and put a hedge round it and a gate so that you can hear the click of the gate and watch this darling little thought coming up the drive all ready to say: “Oh, how tired I am,” etc.? I fancy that once we let it in very far every thought gets hold of us and wrings us, takes our blood, makes us react, talk, behave, in a certain way, and then, satisfied with having dined off us, it retires for a time.

On the Essence or endocrine typology, going by your picture and the nature of what you write, I also typed you as of the Solar mars type. If your drawn to it, it would give some added nuance. The two typologies add to one another. Personality is more fixed by conditioning and alterable. Essence is in the genetics and is more fixed. I paraphrase crudely sometimes,,, http://destinyclemens.com/Destinyclemens/Gallery_3/Pages/Mars-Solar.html i don't agree with this site in that he has an "Earth" type. It's an altered form of what I've learned. It's the only site I've found with pictures of Essence Types, though. Most everything else other than that, of the Earth type, is right on.

30 Years ago a friend and I were staying drunk for a week sitting around a campfire while everyone else was out trying to murder something in the woods. One of the young hounds wandered back and layed down and started licking himself. I looked at the dog and remarked, " I wish I could do that." My friend without hesitation said, "You better pet him first." So naturally that witicism with me in the middle of it got repeated far and wide for years. One good thing about getting older. The torture of hornyness isn't nearly as intense as it is in younger years. Regarding your gaming traits as a player and your self described tendency to over analyze makes you sound like a counter phobic type 6 or maybe an eight on the Enneagram of personality. Have you typed yourself in any typology?

I forgot. Oliver Cromwell is in my family tree on my Dads side. Regarding my next trip. It's just a matter of sourcing, pretty much. lts good to hear you didn't enter any dark territory and it sounds like some good integration is coming out of it. I told you in direct message about my one trip on dmt about 18 months ago but I've never mentioned it on the forums. I think I mentioned to you that it was very unpleasant experience. It was 4 hours of a sound similar to Tibetan horns, rotating geometric shapes and everything red in color,,,,with a sense of heaviness. Me and a friend happened onto someone who offered it. Just by sight he put some in an emptied out supplement capsule. One for each of us. He told us we had to snort it. My friend forgot and later swallowed it and got nothing from it. I followed instructions and tripped really hard for four hours and about 4 hours of comedown. It exhausted me. I was stupid about it. I don't even know what kind of dmt it was. One reason I want to investigate is seeing that so many are doing specifically 5 meo dmt and are really getting something out of it. In the meantime I've read Rick Strauman's DMT The Spirit Molecule. So, my curiosity is involved again. Not to mention what Leo is saying.

Pondering "Questioning makes one open, makes one sensitive, makes one humble. We don't suffer from our questions, we suffer from our answers. Most of the mischief in the world comes from people with answers, not from people with questions." (Jacob Needleman) "Good Lord, help me avoid the pitfalls of judging, knowing, finding and concluding." (Paul Beidler) BEARING UNPLEASANT MANIFESTATIONS “One sign of Being is the capacity to bear the unpleasant manifestations of others. Why is this a sign of greater Being? The answer is that you cannot do this unless you have seen in yourself what you dis-like in others...When you have just criticized someone, go over what you said carefully and apply it to yourself. This neutralizes poison in you.” V. 1, pp. 168, 176 “It is impossible to endure one another’s unpleasant manifestations in the right sense of the meaning of the word unless we see our own unpleasant manifestations and know them and accept them...(We) begin to realize our own helplessness, so we can endure the helpless- ness of others.” V. 3, p. 832

Shamanism speaks about the coveted state of having no personal history and also the practice of erasing personal history. It sounds like an experience of inner quiet concerning self identity by definition. I've had a taste of that feeling affected cellurlarly in a mysterious way out of nowhere, but not as intensely as you describe. Interesting,,, One time I was so hungover, I couldn't remember what butter was. This was a different kind of erasure though. Just something funny I thought of. I think sharing with others about this stuff and self Inquiry in general is a good way to help ground ones experience. Thanks for sharing.