Inliytened1

@purerogue @David Hammond Gotchya - it focuses on the body to attain Enlightenment because it's so much harder with the mind because it's nearly impossible to quiet the mind. But you can't escape the mind really, as much as you want to. Regardless this is just a method, I didn't have a problem with the method, i just had a problem that he was promising people 48 minutes or whatever and that's all it takes. As far as switching between God and Ego at will, well .....if he's referring there to the Budhi which i refer to as higher consciousness, that's not the same as the Absolute. It might take a mystical experience for him to grasp what i'm saying there... But that's not to criticize him. Just my take.

@David Hammond Hi Friend Note to Mods: this is a friendly discussion - not an argument. "Enlightenment is also a process if you look at it from a different way. It's called the noble path. I speak of that a lot. But as far as being nothingness having an ego as opposed to being an ego with a memorable non dual experience, the difference is permanent enlightenment and intellectual understanding. Bodhi is intellect, and in a Buddah the bodhi is also awakened. That's because intellect is needed in being able to see through what causes separation. Without the development of bodhi you are basically pissing in the wind with your practice because you cannot get to permanent realization without understanding the steps. And that requires practice. " Basically our views are the same here - we're just speaking it in different words. You are referencing Buddhism, and I am not referencing a particular religion. Bodhi is consciousness. With Spiritual practice, time, experience, you gain Wisdom. Wisdom comes with an increase in consciousness. The buddhist's concept of permanent enlightenment is the same as mine. After a mystical experience, you become much more conscious, because you have tapped into the consciousness of the Universe, which is your true self. I believe Buddhism speaks of the no self in certain sects and this basically means that small self is an illusion, and in truth there is only the large self, consciousness. After a mystical experience in which you become conscious of the Truth, and in my case I became conscious of all facets, your intellect is awoken. The Bodhi is awakened, in other words..it's the same thing. I have tapped into Infinite Intelligence. So at this point you are permanently awake, as you are viewing the world thru a non-dual lens. You're back as the small self, but forever changed, and Awoke - conscious. (we can drop the whole word Ego if it makes you uncomfortable). Buddhism is very aligned with the Idealist Paradigm - which I subscribe to after my Awakening. It means that consciousness is not happening inside a brain, but the brain, and the "ego" as people call it, is happening within consciousness. Consciousness is equal to Absolute Infinity. This is formless, and contains absolutely everything, which has to include nothing. Therefore it is groundless. So you can think of reality as a Giant mind, and within that mind is the idea of you and me. So we agree that the ego is an idea. The term Enlightenment is relative - it has to be - because reality is an Absolute Relativity. There is no objective world out there. Where I believe someone is Enlightened after they have a non-dual experience - or in Buddhism the NO self. Becoming pure consciousness and becoming conscious of what is really going here. That's what happened to me. I think what you are trying to say is that you do not need a mystical experience to become enlightened according to your definition of enlightenment - which is Awakening of the Intellect. If that's the case yes you can raise consciousness without a mystical experience, but it's not quite the same thing. I believe you need to incorporate both in order to be fully Awake. Also notice the memory of the becoming the Absolute is not the same as Becoming the Absolute. It's a memory, something completely different. So don't confuse the map with the territory. But then once permanently enlightened as you like to say, you can embody Truth in your everyday life, and everything including suffering, which is the topic of this post, becomes effortless because you have complete and full acceptance and understanding of it.

@Preetom LOL we are all GOD just amusing himself.

@Preetom Self Inquiry is what REALLY awoke me actually. Deep self inquiry and also practicing no-mind/do-nothing. When A mystical experience happens your direct experience literally becomes BEING. (the you is no longer there - can call it death/ego/ these are all words we can use interchangeably) You become Being itself, which IS conscious. So you become conscious of Truth. In my Awakening i became conscious of the fact that reality is a giant mind - Consciousness is not within a brain, the brain is within Consciousness or Being. I also became conscious of Absolute Love, and Infinite Intelligence. It is the most amazing thing you will ever experience in your life. Not only that - things you thought were real before will be recontexualized and literally just MELT away before your eyes. One of those things is the fact that the substance of reality - and you - is absolutely Nothing, and that's kinda mind blowing and leads to ego backlash afterwards. Even now as i'm typing this I can feel Being. Once you have Awoke you are opened up to it.

@Shiva I really resonate with this as well. There is something that transcends both. I have studied Spiral Dynamics via Leo's teachings, I have not gone outside yet and read other books on it - so I have a question on it for you guys. I think someone on the forum (Ponder, I believe) mentioned that Stage Coral is swing back to individualism, but incorporating Turquoise' collective thinking into it. Is that the case? Leo's episodes didn't talk much about Coral, maybe because it is not considered one of the actual stages? My question on this as to how it relates to politics, is this: I believe personally i have shades of orange, green, yellow, and turquoise in me. I have Awoken, and see things much more holistically now. But there is still a part of me that believes the Left is too Left, and the Right is too Right. We need to somehow transcend this where we have something that emerges from both Socialism and Capitalism. Thoughts and how this might relate to Stage's Turquoise and Coral?

@Shin Self deception at it's finest...it's "Total..Total, Total, Total." Love those words from Leo's self deception episode.

@Shin true...and you need a break from the real work. Too much of anything can be counterproductive...Need a balance. Can't spend so much time here that you ignore the work.

@Ponder i think i might go back to physical masturbation..its much less exhausting

@cetus56 @cetus56 agreed. I say we take Mandy's advice and all go out into nature for a while Unfortunately i have to work so i have to wait until later.

@cetus56 i don't believe i was arguing or fighting with him. But if someone is self deceived and is going around deceiving others (perhaps even unconsciously) that they can become enlightened in 48 minutes and stating that they themselves can go between God and Ego at will i think needs to be pointed out for the benefit of some of the other people on the forum. That's all we are trying to do here. No one is is saying he is a bad guy or anything..we all love him.

@David Hammond that's good. But notice our posts above. Saying you are jumping between God and Ego at will is the Ego disguising itself as God. If you have truly had a mystical experience - a non-dual experience in which you became conscious of Absolute Truth or various facets of it - then you shouldn't lie and say you can jump between states at will..that's nonsense.. The only way that happens is the Ego disguising itself as the Absolute. Its fabrication. But of course the irony is you are not even conscious that you are deceiving yourself. You actually believe it. Your caught in your own deception. Otherwise it wouldn't be a successful deception. It's Total.

@Shin Yes what he is describing by jumping between God and Ego at will - that is artificial enlightenment which is his Ego the entire time deceiving itself. But hey - if in his perspective it works for him then let him be happy. It's all good in the hood but let's not confuse it with the Absolute. Its ego disguised as the Absolute. See how tricky this stuff is.

@kev014 It melts the heart when it happens. There is nothing else. Everything else pales in comparison

@zeroISinfinity don't waste your time. He can't answer basic questions about his own direct experiences because he hasn't had any.... His breathing techniques could help, but you can't put a time on when enlightenment happens. Embrace the unconscious with Love.

@Nahm it's in there somewhere

@David Hammond no it happened without psychedelics....i wouldn't think Leo's experiences were any less valid though...a mystical experience is a mystical experience. Mine was a lifetime in the making...

@TheAvatarState i doubt it. Pretty sure he is a materialist. If he had a mystical experience and actually awoke to the idealist paradigm than he would probably also be a lot more conscious..to where staying at stage orange would ultimately be impossible...he would naturally evolve out of thinking money and success is happiness. I'm not saying enlightenment automatically propels you to turquoise but nevertheless it would elevate his consciousness significantly.

@zeroISinfinity Yes you felt your chakras opening up and you felt Being. Its a wonderful feeling even when it doesn't turn into a mystical experience. But your ego doesn't want to go there again because you already awoke. It doesn't want to die again. So its much more difficult to Become the Absolute again because this time your Ego isn't being blindsided.

@abrakamowse i think that was a different one but yeah..we were coming from a place of Love but he wasn't open minded to anything and that's fine this stuff is delicate and cant be pushed on anyone. As you probably know It can't be communicated only pointed to.

@abrakamowse It was more of us trying to help this guy Lister find Truth, he was trying to push his religion on us, so it wasn't really non-duality vs non-duality. There is only one Absolute Truth, so in Truth there is no such thing as Non-Duality War.

@David Hammond ok but if it takes 49 minutes i'm fucking you up "homie" all in good fun

@David Hammond yes i want to see what reality is...please please!

@David Hammond "If I tell you you will make it into a belief" OMG man you are too funny. So how much is this product? Or did you say it's donations?

@David Hammond LOL, I'll give you this, you are a good salesman But a little light on the substance of what Enlightenment is...maybe that's what you read in a book somewhere

@David Hammond So what actually happened when you did it? Not " i just became Permanently awoke" - i mean can you provide some details as to what happened?