abrakamowse

Maybe the universe is sending you a message, like a wake up call???

I want to discuss, I am not saying this is it, or this is not it... I want to share and know opinions and different points of view. www.wildmind.org/blogs/on-practice/with-no-effort-or-practice-whatsoever-enlightenment-is-here

That's why he says we can do something about it, we are consciousness. If "you" is consciousness, you can do it.

@Leo Gura and @Sri McDonald Trump Maharaj watch the video, if I didn't understand wrong he says the contrary. He's against those who teach "you can't do nothing". When he talk about us or you... he talks about consciousness. He says we are consciousness. Another thing is I think the approach, if you meditate just because of the act of meditate, that's the true spirit of zazen. Maybe I am mixing things, but I am looking for my way... IDK. Any ideas?

@Dustin Dustbin just begin to investigate, you can also check those theories about time in traditional science... Einstein for example. If you are a bit skeptical it will surprise you that science has proven a lot of things that have been said thousands of years ago by philosophers. "People like us, who believe in physics, know that the distinction between past, present, and future is only a stubbornly persistent illusion." - Albert Einstein

Lol

@Leo Gura Thanks for watching it! hehehe... and thanks for the website, forum, etc, etc...

I'm working on it.

Thanks Natasha, yes... I like to draw.

Yeah Ashleigh!!! You know what? I didn't notice the quote was wrong... lol

@ashleigh thank you!!!

This one for Leo... @Leo Gura

I was reading again your writings @charlie2dogs and I think this is what I needed to understand " If the identity body is able to embrace this and seek to experience the real part of itself it will lead to self realization." and this: "work at being in the moment, there and aware, and work at being quiet and still and experiencing the life force within you" I will work more on being still and quiet and follow the life force. Thanks a lot!

The problem is how we label things and how we interpret them. If I say God for example, people tend to think in the moralistic God that punishes, etc and maybe I can be speaking about reality. The same words have different meaning and deep depending on the reality that the person has created by experiences, etc. And I don't think that there is a possibility that we have misinterpreted Leo, I think that FOR SURE WE MISINTERPRETED HIM. That's our work, try to clean our "filters" to see reality the way it is and don't have those misinterpretation problems. We can not know the meaning of the words of others until we reach enlightenment or self-actualization because each of us interpret reality differently.

Cool... great idea @Neill

@Neill I tell you that guy is awesome. This is the second Suzuki, the one we talked about at Zendo is Daisetz Suzuki, this one is Shunryu Suzuki. "Daisetz Suzuki brought Zen to the West single-handed. Fifty years later, Shunryu Suzuki did something almost as important." I want to read books from both of them

Sorry, something came to my mind. I came here to this forum more to try to improve my business and make more money and now I am feeling that that's not important at all. Thanks again.

@charlie2dogs Thank you very much! I really appreciate a lot the time you took for the explanation. Thanks, I am really grateful because of your very detailed explanation, it really cleared my mind in a lot of things. My ego part wants to say things about experiences that I had, but I think it will ruin the thread hehehe... that's more maybe for my journal in the journal area of the forum. I am here more to be quiet and listen, learning from everyone, thanks again Charlie. Very much appreciated your help.

Your pixels look good hehehehe...

I think I'll pass

hahahaha

I forgot to mention, I agree about the belief. I have a lot of limiting beliefs. I was thinking in personal growth as a way to eliminate some of those limiting belief and in that way maybe I can "see" better and understand what enlightenment is about. Thanks again!

@charlie2dogs Thank you very much for your response. Very rich and it makes a lot of sense. There are like 2 schools of thought (or that I heard) that one says you have to do nothing to become enlightened, because we are already it, but we can't perceive it. And another one which says you have to make the best effort until you realize that there's nothing you can do and you surrender really (not your personality surrendering, like a fake surrender) and when you really surrender you get enlightenment. What do you think about that, I really would like to know what to do, or not - do. Thanks for your time! I appreciate it.

Maybe this extract from Suzuki's book can be of help to understand better. "If you discriminate too much, you limit yourself. If you are too demanding or too greedy, your mind is not rich and self-sufficient. If we lose our original self-sufficient mind, we will lose all precepts. When your mind becomes demanding, when you long for something, you will end up violating your own precepts: not to tell lies, not to steal, not to kill, not to be immoral, and so forth. If you keep your original mind, the precepts will keep themselves." Suzuki from "Beginner's Mind Zen Mind"

@charlie2dogs Interesting. Is it possible that people call that way when you begin "walking the path" like "levels to enlightenment" but they are not really levels?