How Strong Is The Mind?

[governor]

hey,  I normally would "run like hell" from any forum talking about "emotional " crap, but this place does seem a little different...so...

 could I ask something-I'm going to try to make it short and clear...  (and btw I understand anxiety and honestly hope at least some of you can work that out-I know it's difficult).

only a few points of me matter in my question - I  have daughter who is so called "mentally ill" and is hospitalized. (not the fun kind of "ill"-the never ending, tricky,     violent kind)

- the father has issues (water on the brain-he's had surgery, but...) he thinks he needs to do "justice" to me for my daughter (because it's always got to be someones fault) - he's violent

-I supposedly have abandonment issues from childhood-a belief I need to be strong, and make it on my own, complex trauma ,ptsd, ocd, bla,bla,bla. it's freaking

ridiculous- the most non-productive load of crap I ever heard.

so a few years back I started meditating and seriously working on fixing this crap in my head on my own -there were no other options.

I am a "master" of dissociation, but its become very non-functional. I am briefly working with a trauma counselor, who says "no one is this strong"...I argue "everyone has the potential to be that strong"--

here's my question (finally) I hope it makes sense...is there a way to somehow use the mind in some way to be able to suffer, but not be affected? for example-

could a person somehow live inside this unstable ,always changing, "world" of mental illness- and yet not be affected by it? 

anyway... thanks...Idk

[Mal]

@governor

Hi,

To be direct

When you're done with it you will wake up. That's it really. In a nutshell. 

You have got to come to the end of the road with it. 

The therapeutic perspectives are true, they put you into deep suffering just so you can climb your way out again by your fingernails. 

That's the reality of it.  You're on your own 

See you on the other side ...

Mal

Edited June 23, 2016 by Mal

[governor]

well-it is true everyone is on their own-don't care about that. irrelevant.

it's a very proud, controlling thing for me to say this but...over the past thirty some years I haven proven anything is possible if you just find a way...

every time "they" say you'll won't be able to accomplish this - "they" always end up down the road saying wow, something seams to be working for you.

they say it's impressive...I try to tell them it's only desperation... I can't fail my children...not an option...no matter the cost...wow, that's messed up when I write it!  

anyway... I will find a way ....maybe you will see me on the other side...we'll see...but only if I get off this stupid internet and stop wasting time .

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Mal]

@governor

What I mean by on one's own is there is nobody there to rely on, when thoughts and feelings of mental illness become "old" then we decide to just stop giving it any reality.

This is the ultimate realization, there is nothing to be done except live life.

Yes, you are having the same ideas as me, getting off the internet, I've had enough of it here and I used it for my own ends.  I've never asked a question here because I know nobody can give me anything, I must do it all myself.

I asked a question once, but it was just somebody's take,  it can never really do anything.

These insights don't come for free, they must be discovered.

Therapy is nonsense, "high consciousness values" is nonsense, enlightenment is even more nonsense.  There is nothing to get, and it's about having gone through the path and nearly killing ones-self trying.  Then you just realize that it's all just mind doing what it does best.

One of my favorite teachers David Deida says we will never be free of neurosis, so he recommends living life as "art", live as a yogic practice and entering the moment of in spite of the "therapy stuff", it's all there bubbling and it's a never ending pit of misery which will never be resolved.  Anybody who thinks the "damaged self" can be resolved is telling us lies.

The cosmic joke is on us!

 

Edited June 23, 2016 by Mal

[governor]

 well- be careful out there--   all I know is the sunshine feels good and I definitely like that ....that's all

I appreciate your time .  

[charlie2dogs]

6 minutes ago, governor said:

 well- be careful out there--   all I know is the sunshine feels good and I definitely like that ....that's all

I appreciate your time .  

you said: could a person somehow live inside this unstable ,always changing, "world" of mental illness- and yet not be affected by it?  the answer is yes you can,  

[charlie2dogs]

1 minute ago, Piotr said:

@governor I think @Mal said rightly that we're always on our own. And I agree with you there is always something you can do even if you hear you can't. Have you heard about Complex PTSD by Pete Walker? 

It's really a painful process, but you can deal with this stuff, I used to dissociate all day running on autopilot, I could hardly differentiate one damn thing I did from another. In a matter of few months of applying the book and Leo's videos I can experience some peace now and feel good.

Read this book if you can, I think you can get in on Amazon or Kindle.

 

its only painful, if you are attached to the pain body, and function as the human identity. but then that is the only way that most will ever know.

[Mal]

@governor

Thanks, 

Beware of the snake oil salesmen 

@Piotr

That is a really good book for advanced cases of dissociation.  Kudos

[charlie2dogs]

4 minutes ago, Piotr said:

@charlie2dogs The thing with dissociation is that you don't even want the pain-body in you awareness, so what you're talking about is on the opposite spectrum of acceptance. In other words one has to become the pain first in order to let go of it.

im not talking about dissociation,  its not about the pain body being in your awareness its about functioning from the core where there is no pain to deal with.

[charlie2dogs]

2 minutes ago, charlie2dogs said:

im not talking about dissociation,  its not about the pain body being in your awareness its about functioning from the core where there is no pain to deal with.

you have two choices to experience the pain and misery of the human identity and its physical body or be something other than that.

Edited June 23, 2016 by charlie2dogs

[governor]

28 minutes ago, Piotr said:

Have you heard about Complex PTSD by Pete Walker? 

I have not-but thanks I'm sure I will take a look at that....I am glad for you (honestly)---

 

[governor]

3 minutes ago, charlie2dogs said:

you have two choices to experience the pain and misery of the human identity and its physical body or be something other than that.

I'm guessing this "something other than that" is whatever you make it to be? or am I not understanding what you're saying? 

[charlie2dogs]

Just now, governor said:

I'm guessing this "something other than that" is whatever you make it to be? or am I not understanding what you're saying? 

most humans function as the human identity, the vehicle that they exist in, the identity with its programing, false belief, creates a lot of consequences that involve pain and suffering. to rise above that one must become something other than the identity with its pain body.  you are not the body but humans believe they are the body.  your first estate was one as a being of consciousness, that which created this body for you to plan in,  when you are one with that, the identity body and its pain has no hold on you any longer.

[charlie2dogs]

2 minutes ago, charlie2dogs said:

most humans function as the human identity, the vehicle that they exist in, the identity with its programing, false belief, creates a lot of consequences that involve pain and suffering. to rise above that one must become something other than the identity with its pain body.  you are not the body but humans believe they are the body.  your first estate was one as a being of consciousness, that which created this body for you to plan in,  when you are one with that, the identity body and its pain has no hold on you any longer.

its called liberation

[Mal]

Liberation or dissociation?

 

[charlie2dogs]

28 minutes ago, Mal said:

Liberation or dissociation?

 

your question says that you have not experienced liberation or you would know the difference, seek liberation its never about disassociation

 

[Mal]

@charlie2dogs

There have been a lot of self-realized masters who had addictions and problems associated with the physical body.  Liberation does not fix anything.

I mean, Ramana Maharshi let his body rot.

I know what's coming next... none of them were self-realized, only you are, some random guy who won't reveal his identity but spends all day transforming the lives of the posters here?

[charlie2dogs]

Just now, Mal said:

@charlie2dogs

There have been a lot of self-realized masters who had addictions and problems associated with the physical body.  Liberation does not fix anything.

I mean, Ramana Maharshi let his body rot.

I know what's coming next... none of them were self-realized, only you are, some random guy who won't reveal his identity but spends all day transforming the lives of the posters here?

 

1 hour ago, governor said:

I'm guessing this "something other than that" is whatever you make it to be? or am I not understanding what you're saying? 

if you look at things from the right place of being, you can turn away from those things that dont serve you well and they will have no power over you.

[governor]

to be honest I don't agree or disagree with any of you at this moment...but

1 hour ago, charlie2dogs said:

most humans function as the human identity, the vehicle that they exist in, the identity with its programing, false belief, creates a lot of consequences that involve pain and suffering. to rise above that one must become something other than the identity

 

19 minutes ago, charlie2dogs said:

if you look at things from the right place of being, you can turn away from those things that dont serve you well and they will have no power over you.

on the surface at least I had also thought this sounds almost like controlled disassociation. but then again so does the big mind technique.  idk . could it be that a person could use the disassociation to actually be a benefit? but the again it would have the potential risk of becoming unmanaged again.

 

[charlie2dogs]

7 minutes ago, governor said:

to be honest I don't agree or disagree with any of you at this moment...but

 

on the surface at least I had also thought this sounds almost like controlled disassociation. but then again so does the big mind technique.  idk . could it be that a person could use the disassociation to actually be a benefit? but the again it would have the potential risk of becoming unmanaged again.

 

dissociation will fail eventually, it takes a transformation of the human being from the human identity to a being of consciousness which is their true and first estate.