Faceless

Interesting Can a technique, ”of the movement of thought” or ”an invitation/motive induced movement” move to an area free of thought? Or can a finite movement approach that which is infinite? Can the part capture the whole??

@robdl Is that teaching a movment of thought? Did you perceive truth without ever accumulating that teaching?

If there is a ”motive/movement of volition” of any kind is this meditation free of the movement of thought??

But if thought is asking that question can thought disguise itself as being other than thought?? Is thought saying I am not thought? Is thought then exceeding it's very limits?

Until thought ends actually for us we are always bound by it's movement. Every direction thought takes is moving away from what is. @Mikael89 The first thing I would start with is... What is fear in relation to pleasure. This is how I would inquire.

@Preetom

Don’t worry about what is possible. That is also of thought.. Explore the nature of thought/ego. Start with that. Don’t make it a goal. Just learn about it. Learn about fear, sorrow, anger, belief, and so on. All the movement of thought that we experience in consciousness and how they interrelate.

Until there is a cessation of the movement of thought talking about nothingness is of thought. Learn how to identify when thought is in motion. Learn the nature of thought. Its processes and structure. What im saying is until thought is understood you will not know when you are deceiving yourself or distorting what is. Until you do just assume every moment is a movement of thought. So actually to you thought is all there is. Do you understand?

Are you sure thought isn’t in movement here?

If I have imposed on you such a burden I am truly sorry. You use thought ‘the accumulation of knowledge and experience from memory’ to investigate don’t you? @Mikael89

Are you sure? Is that an idea “abstraction” you got from someone/somewhere?

We are meeting then

So who is asking who am I once a thought enters?

What do you mean you meditate after the question?

To tell someone mind is real or unreal is meaningless. It is actual in the sense that it’s experienced to them and it is an actual process taking place. It may be correct or incorrect but it is still actual. So one must go into mind/thought. That is conscious work. Then once you understand its nature, structure, processes then you have a basis to observe ”consious work”..Otherwise one will remain caught in the matrix yet attributing certain thoughts as being independent of the matrix. Classic deception/illusion. Until one sees ”actually” for themselves the unreal will remain real to them. This realization in the form of an idea won't help anyone see. They have to see it in themselves as a fact. This is why not gathering theories, conceptualizations is important. To say you are nothing to one who is not no-thing, ”empty of the conditioned consciousness” is an abstraction to them. If one's mind is not free then they are not nothingness. Until consciousness is empty it's all theory, non fact. Part of the matrix. But If one disregards all the conditioned content that has been accumulated from the stream of thought ’past knowledge’ and sticks with the fact of ones own conditioned inward content, then one will avoid all the illusion and deception. The point is to empty the mind not fill it. Only an empty mind ”consciousness empty of it's conditioned movement/content” can see what is.

So anything that thought thinks about right? I just want to see if we are on the same page

What would be an example of the unreal? And what would be an example of real? Are you using real as in independent of thought?

That's all you do? You ask who am I and then fill in the blank with an idea that you acquired from the stream of thought?

Doesn't it seem strange that some employ the movement of mind to try and capture ”reality”?? They want to end the mind yet they try and use the mind to do so. Doesn't that seem to be contradicting? If we say the mind is not, then why does one stress the importance of practicing techniques, methods, and accumulating knowledge to see what is. Those are all part of mind. Do we see that all those attempts are futile right from the getgo? I mean this just seems so obvious. If we know the mind is the barrier to what is, why do we insist on cultivating thought to perceive truth?

Can one be compassionate when consumed by fear? Can someone seeking enlightenment be truly compassionate? What has to happen for there to be actual compassion?

Hehe you still haven’t figured out what thought is yet. It makes sense man. You just don’t understand. Until you understand this you will never even be free of the self.

thank you Is the way I write the reason you don’t understand or is it because you are incapable of thinking differently. You don’t seem to be a free thinker. I seriously doubt my English skills are preventing one from understanding what I share here. It goes much deeper than that. Just like the other night when we were talking about what thought was. You sent me a definition of thought. Like that explains the what thought is and how it comes about. It seems you can not get passed the conditioned mind. I’m sorry. I don’t know what to say man. ??‍♂️

Or do you mean you have so much to unlearn about reality?

We know what he meant. It’s his second language. Besides I thought your goal was not to think ? One who is unbound by time doesn’t get embarrassed.

An open mind is an empty mind, and an empty mind doesn’t seek enlightenment. Until there is emptiness openmindedness is not. ??‍♂️