Emerald

The reason why I think this is because of the fact that you made this thread in the first place, and seem to be very adamant about defending your decision to eat meat... even against people who didn't directly tell you that you shouldn't. So, this indicates to me that there is perhaps a guilt about eating meat, because you're trying really hard to defend it even against people who aren't directly challenging you on it. So, you seem to be projecting some guilt and then trying to absolve yourself of that guilt.

How did this confirmation happen? Did you watch images of animals suffering with an open heart, and truly feel okay with it? Or did you begin and end in the mind, while using certain rational defenses for why eating meat is morally defensible because of a desire to protect your self-image as a "righteous person" from your own personal judgements? And then did you work backward from the idea "I'm a righteous person", and then find a way to continue identifying as a "righteous person" by using mental gymnastics to find ways to justify meat-eating on a public forum where you can convince others (and thus yourself) that meat-eating is a defensible action and that you are still a "good and righteous" person? My guess is the latter. So, my question is... Why does eating meat make you feel so guilty?

I think astrology is really interesting. It's a lot of fun. Birthday: 4/26/1989 Sun Sign - Taurus (leader of the Earth house) Moon Sign - Capricorn (Earth sign) Ascendent - Virgo (Earth sign) Also, in the Chinese Zodiac, I am year of the Snake which is an Earth sign because of the snake's close proximity to the Earth. And I am specifically an Earth snake as each twelve years the signs change from one element to another. So, my husband is also year of the snake, but he is 12 years older than I am. So, he is a fire snake. But there are also water snakes, metal snakes, and one other type that escapes me. Also, the vast majority of my extended chart which has about 20 or so constellations to it, consists of Earth signs. And all the chart that doesn't directly relate back to the element of Earth are water signs with just two Air signs thrown in there and no Fire signs. If you want to check your extended chart, here is a link to a great website for it that one of my subscribers shared with me - https://astro-charts.com

So, you're believing in what Nisargadatta says just because he's an enlightened master? Why does he know better than you what's right for you?

Seek first to understand why it is that you want that and accept the reasons why. Then, once you see your motivations at a deeper level, you'll be able to see if it's something that you should or shouldn't pursue. But brutal honesty is needed as your motivations may not be as straightforward as they seem at face value. Meaning, that it may not simply be a desire for sexual adventures, it may take root in something deeper... or it may not. It may literally just be a desire for sex. If you feel like you want to do it because you feel like you need validation, then be honest with yourself about that and realize that there is a reason why you crave validation that can never be solved on that level. And then, you'll need to explore that need for validation. Or it could be some other motivation as well.

I was considering saying something very similar to this. Spot on!

This is why the mind is a beautiful servant yet a terrible master. You can justify any form of devilry with a little mental gymnastics. It can create all sorts of castles in the sky to live in and cling to. And those who decide to live in a castle in the sky of their own making, totally forget that there is no ground below them. To truly make wise decisions, you must build your castle on the solid foundation of the heart. Right now, you are bringing the analytical mind into matters of the heart, to avoid what the heart has to say. The open heart will tell you clearly what is wiser if you dare to listen.

It is frustrating to me, so I would like it not to be this way. But to be clear, I don't have an issue reaching orgasm. I can't do it through sex because sex doesn't stimulate me enough to achieve orgasm. But I can experience pleasure, and I can climax in other ways. But this is not really the issue. The issue is more-so that when I experience sexual feelings it feels better if I just take time to feel them on my own without even engaging with physicality and definitely not trying to orgasm. I am most sexually fulfilled when imagining a sexual scenario and being able to experience the erotic emotions that come with the fantasy. But once it becomes physical, it loses like 85% of its charm. And I end up feeling less sexually satisfied by doing more work once sex becomes real, regardless of the pleasure I feel (which itself is usually pretty mild). And oddly enough, I prefer the mild pleasure to orgasm as well. So, it's just a lot of mixed messages and a promise of sexual fulfillment that has never panned out.

He's definitely Green with some Yellow, if I peg him anywhere. But, it doesn't really help. Yet again, he isn't the most romantic guy. I tend to have some pessimistic ideas about the experience of sex for a woman. I don't know if they're true in general, but it's been true for me. My pessimistic idea is that since the purpose of sex is toward reproduction it only requires the man to be satisfied sexually because it is the male orgasm that enables sperm to get to the egg and not female orgasm or sexual satisfaction. But in a human species, where we have the capacity for high intellectual thinking and noticing things like unfairness, there also has to be a motivation to have sex for women. So, our mind spins this projection of a sexual scenario onto reality where it feels really good to engage with that fantasy projection... and it is the projection itself that beckons us into a sexual situation where there is no actual sexual fulfillment to be had. It just feels good to feel the feelings associated with the projection, and there is an illusion that making that projection real will intensify the feelings of the projection that we crave. But then, when we actually get in the situation, the desire for the satisfaction promised by the projection doesn't get met. And this leaves us with a desire to seek it more (leading to more babies) and to avoid sex unless there is a really strong and emotionally alluring projection over the experience (nature's form of birth control and thus population control). But that's just my pessimistic idea about it, because that's been my experience. I don't know if all, most, some, or no other women are like this. Now, a romantic guy is really skilled at creating that illusion... That's what I think romance is. But I still have my pessimistic doubts that that illusion (no matter how skillfully created) will ever actually translate to the sexual satisfaction that the illusion and the desire for the illusion seems to promise.

I side with Teal on this one, because I do believe that socialization is necessary for the vast vast majority of people. So, unless a person is living a life of renunciation as a monk or hermit, then abstaining from socializing altogether is incredibly unhealthy and is a denial of our natural drives. I see a lot of people on here who are already socially avoidant, further solidify their tendency toward social avoidance because they start thinking it is a sign of virtue and higher consciousness. But it actually keeps them from addressing their needs from where they're actually at because they may even repress their needs and desires toward human connection. So, my view on this is that a person who is not specifically living a life of renunciation, where renunciation is the spiritual practice in itself, should not abstain from the basics of life. So, a person should eat normally, sleep normally, hold a job, and have friendships and relationships. It's important to meet our human needs. Our humanity is not a mistake to be sloughed off, but is a valid part of this experience. And belonging to a social group is a natural outgrowth of that, and need not be transcended.

I honestly don't think it has to do much with the guys that I've been with. Both my ex-boyfriend (who I was with for four years) and my husband (who I've been with for almost 9 years), were/are very focused toward wanting me to have pleasure. So, I've never been long-term with a guy who was oblivious in that way. I think the issue is that no matter what they did/do, the physical experience of sex just isn't a very satisfying experience for me. What is satisfying is to actually have erotic emotions and thoughts... but the physicality feels like a distraction from that as opposed to something that flows with the experience. The peak of my experience is always the moment before anything starts, and then once it begins it's all downhill from there. So, it sucks. But it doesn't suck because of some other person not doing something right.

It's not like that between my husband and I because he doesn't pressure me to have sex. But because I know that he wants sex and has a relatively high sex drive, the incongruence makes me feel pressure regardless even when he's not pressuring me. I know he would probably have sex everyday if he could. And I would feel enough desire to genuinely want to have sex maybe once in every two or three months. So, I've been with my husband coming up on nine years, and I want him to feel satisfied with his sex life. So, I don't feel like it's a good idea to abstain for three months and essentially make that decision for him too simply because sex isn't all that exciting for me. So, I try to at least go for once per month... but mostly for him because sex is pretty boring and banal to me overall. But I'm not shy toward sexual exploration. Funny enough, I do actually have a high sex drive as I can feel really deep desires toward sex. It's just that the reality pales in comparison to the fantasy of it, and over the years I've realized that (in terms solely related to my own pleasure) it's not worth the effort. It's a bit like imagining eating a really good piece of chocolate cake and having a strong desire to eat it. But then, every time you go to actually eat chocolate cake, the taste and texture is that of wet crumpled up paper that's been soaked in cocoa powder and sugar and formed to look like chocolate cake. Then, you learn that the closest you can get to the satisfaction you crave is to imagine it, because the actual experience of thinking about eating the cake is better than actually eating the cake. So, thinking about sex is actually significantly more pleasurable than having it. So, it's a bit of a dilemma. But I've done a ton of self-exploration relative to this topic, and nothing really ever changes. This has always been the way it's been. I've just gotten more honest with myself about it over the years and stopped striving for something that's seemingly just the way things are for me.

My point is that the idea of 'all egoic drives being invalid' can be a huge ego trap that causes a lot of repression and increases self-judgment and shadow. It is only the ego that wants to be free of ego, so it resists itself and doesn't want itself associated with egotism even though it is indeed an ego. This is called spiritual ego. And it creates suffering and keeps a person from really embodying their humanity. I see it all the time on this forum in people who paint themselves into a corner as to what they're allowed to feel because it undermines their identification with spirituality and especially spiritual superiority. But it really just causes them to be very judgmental toward themselves and others and makes them unaware of this pattern in themselves. So, it creates this huge blindspot where they learn to lie to themselves about how they feel because they want to feel more spiritually advanced than others. So, in order to maintain the identity of being "more spiritually advanced than others' in their own eyes, there is a need to self-deceive and become selectively conscious toward the contents of the internal landscape. And they won't be able to be aware of certain aspects of themselves or reality since their identification is so strong and they're afraid to undermine the ego structure. For example, if an emotion comes up recurrently where a person feels like they want a lot of attention, there is a valid psychological reason for that... and that emotion is also an extension of being itself. But if a person is identified with a resistance to ego, then recognizing that genuine emotion becomes a threat to the ego structure of the spiritual ego. So, the person finds a way to lie to themselves and ignore that feeling, thus relegating that feeling to the shadow which is totally unconscious to them. But the desire for attention doesn't go away, it just comes out in more convoluted ways that the person is not aware of. So, they may begin unconsciously seeking attention by becoming a hypochondriac, which necessitates that other people pay attention to them. Or they may self-sabotage and make themselves late for things, so that they are noticed when they walk in late. And none of that would be a conscious decision. So, if the front door is locked, the desires just go to the back door. And if the back door is locked, they sneak in through the window. So, it isn't like ego goes away if you ignore its drives. People get their ego fix by repressing these egoic drives because they can pat themselves on the back for it being a good boy or good girl. So, even when people are self-congratulating about being freer from ego for their renunciations, it is still strengthening their ego and fortifying that chains that hold them back from liberation. So, my point is to avoid falling on the other side of the horse to the scenario that you mentioned... You can be a fake business guru who only follow their egoic needs and get so wrapped up in that identity that they become unconscious and end up with lots of shadows and unconsciousness. But you can also be a spiritual person who renounces all the drives toward worldly success and popularity, in judgement, resistance, and reaction against "fake business gurus who only follow their egoic needs." And you'd pat yourself on the back for your superiority to those fake business gurus and repress away any similar drives... because (of course) your spiritual ego is better and more pious than their business ego. And you end up so wrapped up in that identity that you become unconscious and end up with lots of shadows and unconsciousness. So, the only difference in these two identifications is the window-dressing. So, you must begin with dis-identification with the emotions and a really clear perception of what your emotions are regardless of what they're telling you and your associations with that thing. If you desire popularity. The issue is not that drives toward popularity have come up. And the issue is not in exploring toward those popularity drives. The issue is in over-idenfitication with thoughts and emotions and making them mean something about your identity and resisting, self-deceiving, ignoring, repressing, and becoming unconscious to those thoughts/emotions to preserve a desired identity because of some moralization and judgment about how wanting popularity makes a person lesser. Can you see how this would strengthen the illusion of ego and create a situation where you'd have to judge yourself and others and be unconscious to quite a lot of things, simply to trick yourself into believing that you're beyond ego because of a desire to be superior to others? The ego is a sneaky devil... yes?

It will probably be illegal once lab-grown meat becomes more prevalent and is cheaper to produce than the raising and slaughtering of animals. But I don't see more than a fifteen percent of people decide to abstain from meat-eating because most people are too attached to it. But in the meantime, Vegans and Vegetarians are creating the demand for the abolition of animal agriculture.

I've read you post similar statements in other threads relative to the practical details of life. Do you believe that you have to avoid your humanity to transcend your ego?

I did read your entire conversation. And my impression was that you were trying to shame the OP out of his desire to be popular by saying that his desires were "stinky" and a sign of "spiritual poverty." Then, he seemed to get uncomfortable and started trying to reframe his desires in a way that was more acceptable to you in order to feel more acceptable in your eyes and the eyes of others who have adhere to a similar belief in the invalidity of ego drives. But my impression was that it wasn't genuinely seeing his desires from a different point of view to get in touch even more with what he wants. It was just reframing the desire to be popular in a more socially acceptable way to avoid judgment. And this is shame, because he may then start to lose consciousness even of his desire to be popular and it will come out in a way that's even more steeped in shadow because it's a repression on top of a repression. And this is why I said it's important not to judge others, because they will learn to repress and selectively ignore aspects of themselves simply to fit a more socially acceptable mold. And notice how you were able to go into your dance shuffle inspiration without the fear of it being ego driven. This enabled you to actually explore that desire in real time without resistance. But if you had the inkling that your desires toward this were invalid and you had someone ten years older than you echoing that idea and calling you "spiritually impoverished" for such egoic desires, then you may have avoided that desire altogether. And you wouldn't have learned what you learned.

The only way to question them is to... 1. Realize those desires are there and valid 2. Actually go toward them and explore your response to them in real time So, to be moralistic and avoid a desire simply because of the belief that "This is egoic and therefore invalid.", is repression. Again, repression is not transcendence. You have to be careful, because you can lie to yourself if you keep deciding to not want what you want because you've chosen simply to decide something different and ignore what's there because of the egoic fears of seeming egoic. So, if the OP feels like he wants to be popular, that's simply where he is. And he has to take the journey from where he is and not where he thinks he SHOULD be.

When you're following your emotions and not repressing them, then this is very positive. So, being able to be in touch with your emotions and not resist them is most healthy, and that's probably why you can do your best work then.

You're allowed to just want popularity, if that's what you want. Your desires are valid. Accept them for exactly what they are with no judgment.

Truly, this is quite moralistic and judgmental. People are allowed to have an ego if that's where they are, and there is nothing invalid about it. And you shouldn't try to shame a person out of their desires by criticizing them for it. If a person wants popularity, then there's definitely a psychological reason for it. There may be some deep-seated emotions and traumas incurred early on in life that makes a person crave popularity. Or it could be about a deeper desire put through the filter of a belief system picked up earlier in life. Plus, wanting popularity doesn't actually harm anyone. So, to say it's "stinky" or accusing a person of "spiritual poverty" is misguided and will only create more repression within that person, making it harder for them to address their shadow and be honest with themselves. It makes people feel like their desires are invalid, despite the fact that their desires are inherently valid as an extension of being. I recommend going for it since trying to be popular doesn't actually harm anyone. And going toward that desire will enable the OP to explore those desires in a more extrapolated way, which will put them in a better position to actually understand why they want what they want. And this is the stuff that true transcendence is made of. But if a person comes to judge themselves as spiritually impoverished for their desires, they won't even be able to accept that they have them anymore. And those desires will rot inside of them, and they'll never be able to transcend them. So, this is why it's important not to judge and be moralistic.

It is wisest to listen to what your emotions are telling you. And this is why... Let's say that the OP decides that "Trying to be popular is egoic. So, I shouldn't do it." Then, he's going to still want it but repress the fact that he wants it. So, the desire to be popular won't go away, it will just become unconscious. And he will leave the door open for repressing anything that he considers "egoic." And this is a real problem for someone who has an ego as LITERALLY EVERYTHING is egoic for someone who has an ego. But let's say that the OP decides that, "I know this is egoic. But it is indeed what I honestly want. So, I'm going to do it." Then, he will be able to explore that desire in real-time and see what makes it tick. And he can notice the ego in action as he won't be repressing his ego... he'll be noticing it there. And from there he is in a much better to actually transcend his desires for popularity. So, again, repression and transcendence are not the same thing. You can decide to refrain from egoic pursuits for egoic reasons, and all it will do is tie your hands and create all kinds of moralizations in you, which will actually strengthen the ego because you're taking yourself too seriously. And all you'll be doing is making yourself small. Ego transcendence requires unconditional love and acceptance of what is and COMPLETE non-resistance. This means complete love and acceptance toward ego, and completely non-resistance to ego. So, if you notice that your emotions are saying "I want to be popular", than it hurts no one to go toward that end. And you can really see what that desire is made of. But if your ego reacts against the thought, "I want to be popular", and the ego says "That's too egoic." then your ego will create a blindspot by dimming the awareness and relegating the desire for popularity to the shadow. This is what resistance does. So, always work from exactly where you're at, and don't judge yourself for your desires no matter how egoic they are. You can only be exactly where you are.

She was probably just reading your energy and saw you might line up with that fate. It is possible that psychic phenomenon is real, and they talk about reading life path potentials and how your vibration/energy attracts and creates particular scenarios. So, she may have seen this genuinely. But then she was being greedy and trying to get you to buy a service from her... which is automatically suspect. My thought is that if I had the ability to read people's energy and see their life path potentials AND I saw that a person was lined up for a car crash, I would just offer to do it for free. Heck, I'd pay them $5 to let me do it, because that's potentially a life-threatening situation.

I'm a life-coach and a YouTuber for the lion's share of my bread and butter. But I also do some substitute teaching here and there.

I'm more in agreement with Godin's perspective, and this is how I've grown my coaching business. And it goes more along with my personality and my branding as a result. As life coaches, you and I are valued for authenticity and being personal and accessible. So, if you create a ton of ads to get people to you, it feels "salesy" and inauthentic to younger generations. This is especially true because in the age of the internet the more authentic you are the better. But if you give away a lot of content away for free, and then mention that you also offer some paid content, your bigger fans will likely want to partake in those services. And it doesn't feel salesy or pushy to do so. That said, if you're selling some product where you wouldn't be creating other content in relation to it, then you'd need to employ ads. For example, on my FB, I get a lot of ads for clothing and period products that pop up on my timeline. And they don't really have a lot to share in terms of free content that they could give away. So, for those products, it's more appropriate to use Eben Pagan's view. But when you yourself are the brand and the service you're offering relates back to yourself, people will only want to interact with you if you're authentic. And if you get too "advertisey", it will feel inauthentic and it will drive away a lot of quality clients.

If you feel a motivation toward a redemption story, go ahead and follow that story line. Don't resist how you feel and go squarely into whatever enlivens you, even if you know it's all about the ego. Before you transcend the ego, it's important to develop the ego and work toward individuation. Ultimately, you're going to have ego anyway, so slough off ego concerns for now and go toward what you want without talking yourself out of it. Suppression and transcendence are two totally different things. So, take your desire for a redemption story with a beginner's mind where nothing is off-limits as right now belief in the invalidity of the existence of egoic drives is getting in the way. Allow yourself to potentially make a mistake. Be innocent and go into the experience you want to experience. But be mindful. I'm sure you can see this is motivated by ego. But humor your ego. There is a reason why you want what you want, and it all leads into the desire for transcendence. So, if a redemption story is the story you want to live, let yourself live it and see what it gives you and doesn't give you. But again, be mindful.