Salvijus

No. There is logic behind it. Certain smells open your body up and have many health benefits. And certain smells can be like posinous to your health. Same with sounds. Music is very harmonious and in tune sound collection. If you play out of tune sounds it will be jarring to the ears and it will give a headache to the body

🥱We should wrap this up because it's time for me. I enjoyed this conversation tho regardless of the outcome.

Does a corpse prefer apple pie or cherry pie? A corpse does not care. Only ego does.

Because certain smells are better for the body. And certain foods are better for the body. That's how preferences are made. Certain things are better for the ego survival as well. That is another category of value making. But from the ultimate point of view. Nothing is better or worse. Everything is equally meaningless/valueless to pure awareness.

Let me add one tiny thing. Yes meaning is imagined I agree. And when all imagined meaning is gone, it does not change the value of what exists. Yes. And that value is total zero. Haha

Mmmm... I don't follow you here. For me value and meaning are literally the same. Okay. I have a good example I believe that will really help. Here's a question. Of what value is sweet or bitter to a corpse?

You see. This is beautiful. @Osaid If we look from the body's point of view then there are things that have more value then others. Like water will have more value then poison to the body. To the ego, survival will have more value than anything else. But from the perspective that you're not the ego and not the body suddenly nothing means anything anymore.

Sweet and bitter can have different effect on the body. But to pure awareness both sweet or bitter means nothing at all. Just a temporary passing thing.

You see. Maybe we just have different English. Because for me these two words are synonymous haha. I believe you're trying to say that there is an existential effect that the element produces. Yes. But what I'm trying to say is that the effect is ultimately meaningless to pure awareness. To pure awareness it just another element that is not more important than the other elements in the world.

Or in other words, to pure awareness, all phenomena is a neutral event. Sensations just come and go, energy is dancing, forms come and dissolve and it all means nothing at all... Maybe that will land better.

Thank you for the effort to be on the same page. Yes I realized the world neutral means to you "without effect" or smth. But what I was trying to say "all effects, big or small ultimately have no value only if you give it value. If you don't give it value. It has no meaning. And it is the ego that determines the value of things"

There are only two options. Either everything is sacred and beautiful. Or everything is meaningless. If you're in between. You're in suffering. But I don't want to touch that subject right now.

There is one other motivator to be alive that I consciously not bringing it in into this convo because I feel it would unnecessary complicate the topic. Everything else I say is fully logical still.

Relax relax Let me explain more then and to clarify. Yes. Food will have a chemical reaction to the body. No disagreements here. What I'm saying is this. Every event, every change that happens in the body, every sensation that arises, all of it is ultimately meaningless, or neutral event. I hope you can make a bit of effort to understand what I'm trying to say 🙏

I could also add. All chemical reactions are a neutral event aswell. It means they have no meaning at all. Only ego ascribes meaning to things.

Shift in focus. Yes. And how is that different from say, losing all interest in survival when it becomes clear you're infinite and can not die?

When you taste smth bitter there is a chemical reaction with the body yes. But there is also a psychological reaction to the substance. "I like bitter food, I don't like bitter food" is an ego reaction. Body doesn't care at all how things taste only ego does. And here's an interesting thought. If the likes and dislikes of the ego are gone. Then suddenly... All events become neatrual.. Or all sensations become meaningless in other words. Wow. Did you see how it all connects?

Maybe it wasn't the best explanation. The explanation with a video game makes my point better I believe

I would politely disagree here. And here's why. A taste of vanilla has no value. It's just a sensation. Pain has no value. It's just a sensation. All sensations are neutral and without meaning ultimately The only reason we prefer some sensations over other is becomes of ego. Ego is what puts some things as more valuable than others and it does so to serve its survival.

I'm done. This makes too much sense.

The example I gave earlier could help to explain this. It's like when I play video games(just as an example) , during that intense period I forget all about my life problems, hunger, pain, plans about my future, relationship problems, everything is gone from my experience. Most gamers should know that feeling when they forget all their bodily needs suddenly. And when the game is finished they remember "fuck I forgot i was cooking food and now it's burned" That's how it is with someone with zero interest in the ego. Nothing that is related to survival matters anymore to them. And with that pain of 50.years is nothing to them aswell. Not something that they would even notice. Or pay attention to.

Yep "Always" is a strong word. There are various cases would be a more accurate thing to say maybe .

And so pain is no longer more special sensation than pleasure. Both are just sensations. Everything becomes neutral. Nothing matters anymore. Ego is gone. And with it all the meaning and values it has ascribed to the arising phenomena is gone. Goooooshhh this makes so much sense broooooo..

It's not about excluding the body, it's about giving it no value. It is only ego that gives value to the body. Pure awareness sees everything just neutral event. Neutral energy.

Because... Imagine there is a glorious beautiful blazing sunset and on your left there is poo on the ground. Then I will ask you. Which one are you going to pay attention to? A sunset or a poo? That's how it is with someone who has lost interest in serving the ego. His attention is so absorbed on bliss of creation that a sensation of pain is completely not worth paying attention to. Please tell me this makes sense...