Toby

Is there a link or video where he says that?

@hansrogn yes I made that map. Well, I don't know him personally. Asked him a couple of questions online or watched his online meetings or his DVDs (with his interviews with other teachers) though. I guess he is quite ok as far as I can tell but as with every teacher I'd recommend looking them up on youtube and see if you resonate. Otherwise might be a waste of time and money.

Adyashanti in UK (registration already closed I guess?) http://www.adyashanti.org/index.php?file=retreatsschedule Isaac Shapiro in Germany, Netherlands http://www.isaacshapiro.org/index.php/schedule3

This is what Adya is handing out on his retreats for the meditation sessions and is kinda fitting here: https://www.adyashanti.org/index.php?file=writings_inner&writingid=12

@Martin123 I don't know. There are even studies being done with narcissists that show that they themselves are - contrary to what psychologists thought - aware of their perceived unworthiness. And this kind of "narcissistic rage" can only happen if someone really feels unworthy and the image / constructed personality of superiority is threatened. Eckhart Tolle also talks about inferior and superior egos and shows that inferior egos have superior tendencies as well; and that superior egos have inferior tendencies as well.

@Martin123 Well, what you say about narcissists feel "off" for "my" ego structure. But never the less I can find also patterns to wanting to be superior or narcissistic or egocentric in me. And I also found that a person I knew (which I am pretty sure is a narcissist) was very very sensitive to any kind of perceived withdraw of attention or "love" leading to rage... which would be very hard to happen if they really felt good or superior about themselves.

@Martin123 but aren't narcissists driven by the feeling of unworthiness and therefore overcompensate? And are because of that very sensitive themselves to so called narcissistic injury leading to narcissistic rage?

@Martin123 I haven't explored Matt Khan so I have a question: isn't also the "inferior ego" narcissistic? I mean, doesn't have everyone narcissistic and egocentric behaviour and patterns - even the so called sensitive people?

1: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00A2UQUXY/ 2: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00LOQR37C/

He only says that the two things are different dimensions. So you can work on both, one or none. It's up to you. There is not really a rule or correlation what you have to do first.

You could get familiar with the concepts of "waking up" and "growing up":

You could try Byron Katie's "The Work".

Sounds like everything is really fine but you're dramatizing a bit. But I guess you will find your way. No need to fight with yourself or buy into every concept your super-ego has.

Neither good or bad. Slightly good but overall not that interesting.

Why would you do this even in the first place? The setting as such is supposed to be relaxing with little distractions.

@Ascend Yes, Mooji and Gangaji and many others too.

@Ascend from the ones alive and "international" I like Adyashanti and Isaac Shapiro. Other than that more local ones that I won't mention here by name. But of course Isaac is a disciple of Papaji and Papaji is only at 520 or something at Hawkins scale. Basically this should be proof enough that he is no good...

@Ascend Well, I had the sense you were referring to it when you were talking about Osho. Well, I don't see anything wrong with it. What's wrong is what people make out of it.

@Ascend could it be that you read David Hawkins and now compare everything according to his scale?

@Ascend well, we can assume that I don't know anyone on the level of them today either (might be a projection of course). Doesn't mean that there aren't some valuable teachers out there.

@Ascend ok then give historical figures of the last two centuries.

@Ascend well, there is no perfect human being and no perfect enlightened being. That is just the mind. Of course you could compare two teachers regarding depth or your own personal opinion but if you cannot name any teacher or any example it's pretty clear that you compare teachers with you own idealized version of what a teacher should be. No one can match this of course.

@Ascend lol, if you don't know anyone that by your definition is enlightened, why are you comparing teachers and gurus?

@Ascend well, if you cannot see that byron katie is enlightened - even if her teaching method is not that direct - then I guess there is nothing to talk about "enlightenment" or "not enlightenment" imo.

@Ascend totally mistaken. People have different personalities. Eckhart Tolle wouldn't write in an online forum because he knows nothing about computers. If I remember correctly he even said he doesn't know how to write an E-Mail. The one, who was running a forum (and was working as a programmer before) is an austrian guy named OWK Edgar Hofer. Besides that there are many many people - actors, musicians... - that are interested deeply in spirituality. And my guess is that at least some of them are very conscious. I mean, Jim Carrey had his glimpses. Also there are a lot of people that appreciate Tolle's work: Susan Sarandon, Meg Ryan, Russel Simmons. Other musicians: Leonard Cohen, John Frusciante, Brandon Boyd. There are also musicians that are very close to Ken WIlber's work like Billy Corgan, Serj Tankian or the producer Rick Rubin. Another very famous producer (Ross Robinson) is even the son of Byron Katie. There are so so many that it is only logical that at least someone would be enlightened without "us" knowing anything about "their" enlightenment.