Consept

'Love' has been marketed really well in the western world, so what happens is it builds expectations of what love is. These expectations are usually why less and less people feel satisfied, just because they expect so much from it. It's sold as the answer to everything pretty much, what's funny is that in most films, the film ends as the couple get married, so that in people's minds is the ultimate goal, whereas relationship wise it's still the beginning. Love I think is something first and foremost you have to experience within yourself, at that point loving someone else is an expression of that, but it is important not to look to outside influences to guide what your love should be, you have to take it as it comes and not rely on it to cure you of everything you're worried about

This is really a practice and if you do it consistently you'll notice improvements across the board. So when you interact with someone you'll notice your ego kind of takes control sometimes, this is because you're aware that someone is listening and potentially judging you (most likely they're not and they're worrying that you're judging them). So the mind will start going into the mode it's been used to, this could be things like trying to prove to the person you're what you want them to think you are, whether it's smart, business like, spiritual whatever. Your intention is to prove to the person your that thing and not to just relax and have a conversation with them, so what happens is you don't focus on what they say too much just about what you say. This is just one but there are loads of things your mind might do automatically, you may find it more pronounced say with parents as your mind is used to reacting to them in a certain way, it could be that you want sympathy, praise, even negativity from them because thsts the dynamic you're used to. So the practice is really to be aware of all these things your mind might be doing and just watch them without reacting. Once you become aware of what your particular mind habits are, it becomes easier to not react to them in the situation. Also be aware that you are interacting for the sake of ineracting and being in that moment, not to get whatever your mind/ego wants from that person.

Your friends in this situation are really only the catalyst for how you feel inside already. So the fact that you can't stand your ground woukd suggest that your ego is scared of being rejected for maybe saying the wrong thing or that it wants to be liked. So really it comes down to you improving your self - esteem and having trust in yourself so that you can express yourself as you want and need to. At the moment it sounds like, even on a sub - conscious level, that your stuck trying to improve your self esteem by acceptance from external factors, in this case your friends. It's good that you have then there so you can practice and improve staying true to you in their company.

Admittedly apart from listening to a few songs here and there I hadn't really paid too much attention to Prince, mainly because he was big before my time. But having listened to him in interviews and clips since his death he really comes across as a completely liberated individual that just did things that were part of his being rather than following trends or what society or labels would've wanted from him. I actually feel really inspired by him, I feel he lived to the maximum of his being and was a completely self actualised person. We should not only learn from yogis and speakers but I think we have a lot to learn from people like prince also. What you guys think?

@charlie2dogs Ok but, Eckhart Tolle for example had a sudden realisation (according to him) when he was about to commit suicide, he was not aware of what this was on intellectual level and actually researched a while afterwards. For him it was a switch in thinking but he was not aware of what exactly had happened, but didn't care as he was just being. So it literally did happen by accident for him as he wasn't specifically aiming to be enlightened as he didn't even know what that meant

@charlie2dogs Why is it impossible? @Isle of View Yeah its hard to tell, I think in general true artists would be more in tune with that 'source' or whatever you want to call it. I wouldn't have thought of the question for many other well known artists, there's just something about his non-conformity and also how he comes across in terms of the music being the most important thing, some ones might be Bob Dylan, Bob Marley and John Lenon, funny how they always die young. Thanks for the book recommendation, I'll check it out.

@Isle of View Exactly, I never said he was enlightened I just said he reached self actualisation, as in the definition of something like Maslows 'psychology of being'. This in itself I believe has value, if you've read that book you'll know what I mean. But here's a question for you, if he lived every second of his life fully in the moment and completely being who he truly is, (which maybe he did maybe he didnt), even he's not conscious of it on an intellectual level, isn't this in itself enlightenment? It would strike me that if hes not actively desiring to be enlightened, thats at least one less desire. Also the manifestation of his enlightenment if he is, is not ours to define, it could easily be the manifestation it was, music etc. There are a couple of interviews where he's talking about not being attached to anything he does or owns, this is a very transcendent attitude in itself. I do get what you're saying, enlightenment is beyond self but my point is this could be achieved in many different ways

Overall the reason why I say he was self-actualiized as a person is that he seemed to be uncompromising in who he was, meaning he just wanted to make music, whether it made money or not (there were a few albums given out free to fans). He didn't seem to be bothered with fame in the later years and didn't really care about labels, politics etc. @charlie2dogs Being liberated to me means being who you are regardless of any societal pressures, in general there's a huge amount of pressure even on normal people to conform in various ways, dress, opinions etc etc. I say prince was liberated because he seemed to just do things he wanted without any consideration of societal norms, I would imagine as a famous person there would be even more pressure on him to conform which he didn't seem to have felt. I mean for a staight, black male in the 80s to wear make up and the clothes he wore was pretty much unheard of, let alone fashionable. @DirtbagDakota I get what you're saying but I think it's a bit presumptions to say he was deluded or was not in touch with something deeper. I think a lot of truly creative people are in touch with something deeper and are able to tap into stillness to come up with creative ideas. Many musicians speak about this, when they try and write it doesn't come to them but in moments of stillness it feels like it almost comes out of them. Also your desire to experience what you want to experience is no different than any desire to experience anything, you still have desire there and an assumption that enlightenment is the goal as oppose to just being. So your salvation is still in the future rather than right now, meaning you'll always be chasing. I also don't believe he was distracted by material things to a great extent, he seemed to be very about the music. Also it's come out now after his death, that he spent a lot of time doing charitable works, in fact a lot more than you'd think, but he specifically never talked about it. With regards to religion, yes organised religion is not something I buy into personally, but it's a bit arrogant to say that you can't tap into a certain spirituality with some of its messages. For example a lot of what Jesus said was similar to the buddha, and in fact if you take out the dogma and look at the bible as symbolism and metaphor (as i believe its supposed to be interpreted) there's a lot that makes sense. So you don't know how he saw the religion, obviously he wasn't strict on it or preached it publicly. My whole point in this post is that within self-actualisation or spirtuality in itself can become quite dogmatic, as in you can only be enlightened or self actualized if you do certain things, ie meditate, read books from yogis etc. To me I think it's very possible for someone to be self-actualized and not even actively work on it because they're too busy just being, whether that's as prince or pauper (see what I did there).

Just interested in what people think. There's a divorce rate of over 50% now in the US and UK (not sure the stats of other countries) and from an anecdotal perspective there's not many relationships I know where the people involved seem happy, it either feels like they're trying to convince themselves of it or they've just given up and are just going along with it cos they're scared to break up. I'm talking about long term relationships or marriages btw obviously the first year or so is usually smooth. I've heard genetically that we're disposed to be attached for 3 years or so which is enough time to procreate and start raising the child. Also if you think about it, we're in one of the first generations to be very strict about monogamy in terms of cheating, most generations before us it wasn't really a big deal and was one of those things where it was kind of accepted but not spoken about. https://youtu.be/w8SOQEitsJI Anyway check out the video and let me know what you think, I'm not really for or against either just think it's an interesting topic

Love that!

In a broad sense they don't really matter (although they might help you know the difference between affect and effect, joking). I dont believe they'll stop you from doing anything you want to do, obviously they need you to think they otherwise they become pointless. But the real answer is it depends, it depends on what you want to do, so if you want to be a doctor you will need certain grades and qualifications for that, you do t necessarily need to do it at school but it's a lot easier and cheaper to do it that way. On the other hand if you wanted to start your own business you can learn everything you need to from other sources. Even normal jobs where qualifications are preferred rather than required, if you have a good understanding of psychology and what people look for or really food experience you'd still have a good chance. So really it's about using school as a tool rather than the be all and end all

@Newpaz I get where you're coming from and I did notice that comment from Leo myself, which I don't think I'd agree with also but that's his perogative to do that and doesn't affect me really, point being don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. The other thing I noticed in your comment is where you said 'answer for life'. Enlightenment (I don't really like using the word) isn't an answer for life, life doesn't need an answer it just is and so it's the realisation that life just is. I would see it more as the full acceptance of life and your position in it which is as part of a bigger whole.

Rich dad, poor dad's good and 4 hour work week. Just some general advice there's a lot of ways to make money online, do a bit of research and find one you think you'd be able to do

Something I'm battling with at the moment and because I work for myself and I'm not really motivated by money or material stuff, I'm finding it hard to really push myself and get out of these procrastination habits. I literally thought to myself a few mins ago I should right down some targets to have something to aim at as that's helped me in the past. Also I used to write what I'd want to get done the night before each day for that day, that also helped. But I'll check out the video and I'm interested if anyone's got any other tips

To be honest I've never really taken to him. His message is good and he's positive, good energy and all that but the delivery isn't really for me, it doesn't really seem authentic, but that's just me I know a lot of people like him. He also doesn't really seem to delve into topics like I'm used to with people like tolle, sadhguru and Mooji, it always seems like he says a lot of words but doesn't really get to the point. Just my opinion though that's why it's good to have a variety of teachers out there.

Yeah you're probably right, I've had poor communication with the so called friends with benefits situation, so it's never turned well at least not for the girl anyway. So I want to change that and get it on the right level so yeah ill take your advice, cheers mate @Lynnel

Some rsd stuff is good, I really like school of life, Mooji, Sadhguru, Osho (loads of old material), Alan watts

Have been thinking a lot about desire recently and how it can be a barrier to enlightenment. Most of the time we talk about material desires, money, cars or even relationships, wanting to be liked etc. But another desire is the desire to be enlightened or even the desire to be content. If you've got a desire to be content then that literally will cause discontent and until that desire is dropped you will never content and then obviously never enlightened. A lot of the posts a see on the forum are about how to get enlightened, how long it takes etc, all of which scream of a desire to be enlightened. As long as this desire to be enlightened is there then the path will always be blocked. It's literally no different than saying once I get £1 million I'll be content, either way you don't know if it will or want so all you're left with is the belief that it will and therefore the desire and want to achieve that goal. The very nature of having these goals will cause discontent and living for the future rather than the now. Stop even trying and just be present as much as you can in every day life. Don't meditate with the goal of marking off another day you've done on the way to enlightenment, it negates the whole point of meditation. Don't do anything with the intention of becoming enlightened, just do it because you enjoy it and even if you don't be present during it. This enlightenment thing is like chasing your tail, the more you want it the harder it will seem to get it

@JevinR They're not necessarily good or bad, in the same way a cloud passing by isn't good or bad, it's just the labels that you give them. It's up to you whether you give them power and strength over you. You don't need to prove them wrong because that itself gives them power over you, that means you're doing an action just because that negative thought is there and not necessarily because you want to do it. Take away it's power by fully facing and accepting it. It's like if you're a kid at school and bullsy are teasing you, they will continue as long as they see fear in you and see that it's affecting you, if you're not bothered at all by it and just let what they're doing be eventually they'll stop. So your fighting or running away from your thoughts only prolongs them, better to see then as not a threat at all and just noise that's there and will pass if you let it

@JevinR Only if you give your mind that power over you. By disliking your thoughts negative or otherwise, you're creating an inner conflict because you don't want them there, the problem isn't really the content of the thoughts it's the fact that you have this inner conflict because you believe these thoughts are you. For example I could get really stressed because a song I don't like keeps playing in my head, if I didn't get stressed it would eventually just fade away. Your l ego is very tricky so it creates thoughts it knows you will think you need to get rid of so it can create conflict and thus exist. Only way around it is full acceptance

Really you can't get rid of negative thoughts, the only thing you can do is fully accept them and see them for what they are, which are just thoughts that without your fear of them are harmless

@Socrates Yes I agree it is attachment to desire, that's really what I meant in the post. I think buddha said if you end desire you end suffering or words to that effect. Would you say you are enlightened?

@Philip Lol yeah I know what you mean I've had similar thoughts, it's a balancing acceptance and being. The whole search for enlightenment is a paradox in itself like you alluded to, if you don't have a desire to be mindful what will motivate you to be mindful? But then this could be said for anything, making money, having a relationship etc all are motivated by desire and this is why most people on this spiritual path will say they're are fruitless. But what makes these desires different from a desire for enlightenment, in both cases the person striving believes these things will give them peace and in both cases the very thing stopping them from achieving peace is only the belief that they need these things. So the issue that is blocking your path is desire itself, you can fill in the blank with whatever you want, until desire is transcended enlightenment would be impossible. Also have a think about why you even want to be enlightened, or put another way, why do you not want to be where you are right now? Is it because you want to be more confident, happy more often, more fruitful, doing a job you like, not caring what people think, all these are posdibly the roots of your desires for enlightenment. Enlightenment is just an idea at least at the moment to probably all of us on this forum, so really there are other motivating factors behind that we think enlightenment will solve for us. Essentially these are the desires we really need to drop. Just to add as well if you ask any enlightened person they will tell you they became enlightened as soon as they stopped trying

Well you'd have to be enlightened or ask someone who is to get a real answer

I started reading or rather listening to the audio book a few years ago, before I got into spirtuality. At the time I was very put off by it, it seemed really harsh and my thinking was if I needed to do all this stuff to get what I wanted it just wasn't worth it. Now looking at it, it makes sense in that if you think transcending the ego isn't an option or possible, then this works in strengthening your ego. The idea that everyone's playing a game and you just need to play it better. In a way until you let go of yourself you are just playing a game. But I would say definitely take the book with a pinch of salt, it can be useful in that you can see the inner workings of how ego works and maybe even see stuff that you don't realise you do. How to win friends is kind of similar but I think that's more based on giving rather than power which is based on taking, for both there is manipulation involved, but I wouldn't say they're the same tactics