An young being

Welcome! ?

There is nothing to know, but many things to experience. How do you come to know there is nothing to know? Sorry, but I like to remain anonymous. Thank you for trying to help me anyway!

When you put yourself second in things, it means your ego is weakening, apart from the pleasure it gives. ( Unless you consider yourself superior because you are helping lots of people). It may become problematic for your own survival, but it also pulls you closer to God. Instead of sitting and meditating for hours, without eating well and putting yourself to suffering, helping others by putting yourself to second or trying to be selfless, is a better way, in my opinion.

Everything we do is based on experience and knowledge. What do you suggest to get closer to the truth?

It's not about correct or wrong, but being closer to the truth. Reducing the egoistic mind, especially that of spiritual ego which many people get trapped with is advised my many spiritual traditions to get closer to the truth. I can only assume things based on my experiences and knowledge. Deciding what is good for you is upto the individual.

One time I had a dream where both of my hands turned into letters and disappeared. PS: I saw the matrix movie long long ago.

I feel that the title was a bit too intense, although it achieved its purpose of creating a debate. When it comes to communication, English is my second language, so basically I am weak there. Also, I was half asleep, so that might have played a role there. It's not me helping others to realise something, it's me giving new perspective to things that are well established like a rock in other people's minds. I enjoy doing that, that's why I do it, even if it's my dream. Coming to helping other people, it gives me joy when someone benefits from my thoughts or actions. So, you can call it a selfish act.

People who are undergoing extreme suffering, like physical pain without medications, hunger, thirst,fear of survival etc. suffer more compared to regular human beings. For them, even the things which seem common and doesn't matter to us, like a glass of water or a short relief from pain, brings extreme happiness. Our mind has a way of balancing things out, so that nobody undergoes only suffering throughout their life. If they undergo such extreme suffering for longer durations, they mostly die by nature or of their own will and are relieved of their suffering. Thankfully, those days don't exist anymore. Now, we have medicines to reduce physical pain, and we can atleast survive by begging if we don't have the resources. The point is, we can't escape suffering entirely on the events of heavy physical or mental pain, but during that time, we should remember the nature of impermanence and wait for our mind to adjust to the new standard conditions. If we lose hope during that initial period, you may lose the will to live. But if you strengthen your mind to move beyond it, you can live a peaceful, if not happy life.

@Harsh BagdiaTrue. Jumping straight into such advanced concepts may be addictive, but not good for their well being. It may even lead to them taking extreme measures. Regarding Adiyogi, I love the statue, but the same can't be said about Sadhguru. I neither have a positive or negative view upon him. I am happy that you have learnt a lot from your negative experiences. Most people suffer not because of their present, but recalling unpleasant memories of the past knowingly or unknowingly. It's important we learn from them instead of clinging to them and wondering why it happened to me, although it is easier said than done.

Even now, you have many possibilities with all these limitations. You have the choice to work in a job of your choice or become a beggar, become a monk, cure your disease with the help of medicines, etc. You assume that you are suffering more than being happy. But you always have the choice to be peaceful, which was your original state of mind. Everything else is an added bonus. Look back into your life and see if you have always suffered more than being happy. Remember that nothing is permanent, even in infinity, in case you are suffering more than your older self.

I would say being peaceful is more important than being happy. That doesn't mean happiness is not important. Trying to be always happy is. Here are some things I found that can bring happiness into anyone's life: Don't overdo anything, including being happy. Mix different activities together instead of overdoing a single activity. Be open minded to new experiences and don't come to conclusions before trying them 1. Loving kindness , compassion and gratefulness meditation 2. Exercise 3. Sleep 4. Stop comparing yourself to others who are above you. Compare yourself to people below you. 5. Have a pet 6. Enjoy a walk in nature 8. Give what you can towards orphanages, old age homes and poor people 9. Plan a vacation 10. Be mindful 11. Spend money on experiences ( food, movies, games, vacations) rather than materials ( big house, big car, dress etc. ) 12. Limit your desires.Stop chasing desires that are unlimited and have less probability of attaining. 13. Spend more time with family and friends 14. Smile 15. Learn to say no 16. Reduce expectations 17. Accept death 18. Don't consider yourself as special, mingle with community 19. Learn to be humorous 20. Be humble. Don't act like being humble

That mostly happens only if you blatantly attack them for personal reasons without any valid points. If you are making logical and valid points, others will also support you, and that automatically forces them to bring down their spiritual ego. It works only if you are aware of how your own ego is getting affected in that process. You may be strengthening your own ego while trying to attack others. In such case, it creates a viscious, never ending cycle of hatred. It works best against those who are not being open minded and not ready to look into others' points in addition to their own.

Thank you!

There is none. Ha ha!

@Harsh Bagdia I am also talking about the ego that is of selfishness but also of superiority. Being selfish is what has kept the world running, including all the technological Marvels that has taken place. But, when it comes to your own individual welfare, being selfish is good only when it concerns your survival. Beyond certain point, the individual has to move towards less selfishness, for his own happiness and well being. Also, being selfless doesn't mean you should ignore your well being but to add others well being as your own. It is to move beyond what you call as your body.

True. When you are open minded, you can find some good even during your worst experience and something useful even in the ridiculest of all ideas. We are not talking about the flower here, but the stubborn rock on the top of the barren mountain. It needs a hard pushing to roll down the mountain, to see the fields and the river.

@Larry KaulI agree that beliefs need to be broken to discover in any field, especially spirituality. When it comes to burdens, deflating our ego helps to reduce attachments to our burdens. The only time we can be free of ego completely is during ego dissolution, even then we are just expanding our sense of self to include everything that ego reaches infinity. It didn't disappear but it becomes so big that we are not able to see it. By hurting or reducing ego, I simply mean becoming less selfish and feeling humbler, and not necessarily stopping to take care of your own needs. There are so many definitions of ego that it becomes easy to get confused.

All such cases are possible, but still there are some cases where people are completely broken. They might get back to a better life as time passes but very slowly and it becomes even worse when medical or spiritual help is not available to them. But still, I have never experienced how their mind feels when they are broken, whether they are sad throughout their life and undergo immense suffering. All I can do is guess. The only thing I am sure is what I have experienced, and as for as my experience goes, the mind has the capacity to adjust itself to intense suffering, meaning that it is only intense for a short duration, and after sometime the suffering becomes less intense even though the pain is same. As long as that is valid for everyone, suffering is acceptable.

Ok, I have learnt my lesson here. My post clearly shows how generalising something and being open about it with less words is not good. Let me tell my understanding about the spiritual ego ( I mentioned just ego because I assumed most people here claim being awakened and so mostly spiritual ego will be involved) and how stepping on it will be beneficial, according to me: Spiritual ego: You have discovered something new based on your experience or understanding and you try to establish it as ultimate truth, denying everything else as false. You feel superior as a result of it. So, there are two ways to deal with such ego of others: 1. The flower way: You try to deny them with kind words and try to establish your points step by step, hoping they will understand your points as well. This will work for people with an open mind, but doesn't work for those with a strong ego. 2. The lion way: You strongly oppose their points, by giving them a slap in their face, with the hope that they might realise that their points are not the only right ones. This doesn't mean you should attack them personally or use similar tactics. It simply means to prove their points wrong with strong valid points, but not worrying about whether they will be hurt in the process, hoping that it will be good for them in the long term. I was talking about the second way here.

Noted. Sounds like an interesting idea! Your points make sense and sorry if you were offended. But, if you are interacting with someone who keeps repeating their points of understanding without being open to others ideas, I believe hurting their ego definitely helps.

That's why many Spiritual traditions putforth being a good human as important with skills like compassion, forgiveness, unconditional love before everything else, including enlightenment. In fact, being a good human is essential for Enlightenment. The heart chakra needs to be strong if you wish to be stable after ego death.

See, this is working right now. You are trying to hurt my ego and so I have to rethink what I have said. If you are not aware that you are hurting others' Spiritual ego, your goal here is not to help them but to strengthen your own ego. Doesn't it need some hammering?

This is applicable to people who are suffering and see Spirituality as a way out, and I agree it will hurt them, but I am talking about people who have firm beliefs regarding Spiritual concepts (and I believe that constitutes most of the forum members) and hurting their ego is for their own good. Sorry that I didn't add the word Spiritual before ego. If you are not aware of that, your own ego is in need of a similar hammering. Why not? PS: By ego, I meant Spiritual ego, the ego you get because of your knowledge on Spirituality.

That's why it's important to watch out for our own ego levels when crictizising others. An open mind is a good place to start. True. We are not trying to destroy the ego, but enlarging it as much as possible. Enlarging ego doesn't mean being more egoistic, but to include everyone and everything around you as a part of yourself. When I include your ego as a part of mine, I don't have any hard feelings in crictizising or being crictized, because I am just crictizising myself for fun!

Oops, sorry I didn't read this post and the Last post was meant for everyone, including those not in this forum.