Kid A

Here's Claude's summary of it: I'll provide a medium-length comprehensive analysis of Russian disinformation warfare against Ukraine since 2004, with fact-checks confirming false narratives. The Orange Revolution Era (2004-2008) The Poisoning and Initial Protests When Viktor Yushchenko was poisoned with dioxin in September 2004, Russian media launched a multi-pronged disinformation campaign. They first denied the poisoning occurred [FALSE: International toxicologists in Austria, Switzerland, and Germany independently confirmed TCDD dioxin levels 1,000 times normal], then claimed he was an alcoholic who damaged his own face [FALSE: Medical evidence clearly showed dioxin poisoning], and finally suggested it was staged for Western sympathy [FALSE: Nearly fatal poisoning documented by multiple specialists]. During the Orange Revolution protests (November 2004-January 2005), Russian state media and affiliated outlets created an alternate reality: Protesters were allegedly paid $50-100 per day by American NGOs [FALSE: No evidence ever produced; millions participated spontaneously after fraudulent election] George Soros and the CIA orchestrated a coup [FALSE: While Western NGOs supported civil society, the protests were indigenous response to election fraud documented by OSCE observers] "Trains of nationalists" from Western Ukraine were coming to attack Russian speakers [FALSE: Protests included massive participation from Russian-speaking regions; no ethnic violence occurred] Orange color was deliberately chosen to provoke associations with Ukrainian nationalist movements [FALSE: Simply Yushchenko's campaign color with no historical connection] Post-Revolution Destabilization Campaign (2005-2008) After the revolution's success, Russia established institutional disinformation infrastructure. The "Institute of CIS Countries" coordinated information warfare, while "anti-orange" youth movements like Proryv received Russian funding. During the 2006 and 2009 gas conflicts, Russian media portrayed Ukraine as "stealing European gas" [FALSE: Contractual disputes over pricing; Ukraine was paying below-market rates per existing agreements]. Russian-funded media promoted the "Novorossiya" (New Russia) concept, claiming eight Ukrainian oblasts were historically Russian territory [HISTORICAL MANIPULATION: These territories were ethnically diverse, including Ukrainians, Jews, Greeks, Tatars, Germans; never exclusively Russian]. They organized pseudo-academic conferences declaring Ukrainian statehood "artificial" [FALSE: Ukrainian national identity, language, and culture developed over centuries independently]. The Yanukovych Interlude (2010-2013) Soft Power Infiltration During Viktor Yanukovych's presidency, Russia shifted to subtler influence operations while preparing for potential escalation. Russian businesses acquired major Ukrainian media outlets through proxy oligarchs. The "Russian World" (Russkiy Mir) foundation expanded cultural centers promoting civilizational unity [IDEOLOGICAL MANIPULATION: Soft power tool to justify future intervention]. Anti-EU Association Campaign (2013) As the Vilnius Summit approached, Russian media intensified disinformation about the EU Association Agreement: Economic catastrophe predictions claimed Ukraine would lose $100 billion [FALSE: Manufactured numbers with no economic basis] EU membership would require legalizing same-sex marriage [FALSE: Association agreement contained no social policy requirements] Polish farmers would buy all Ukrainian farmland [FALSE: Land moratorium remained in place] Ukrainian products couldn't meet EU standards and would be banned [FALSE: Agreement included transition periods and assistance] 70% of Ukrainians opposed EU association [FALSE: Independent polls consistently showed majority support] Euromaidan - Information Warfare Escalation (November 2013 - February 2014) Phase 1: Minimization and Dismissal (November 21 - December 1, 2013) Russian media initially dismissed protests as "a few hundred students manipulated by Western grants" [FALSE: Hundreds of thousands participated within days]. After Berkut special forces brutally beat students on November 30, Russian media claimed students "provoked" police with "extremist actions" [FALSE: Video evidence showed peaceful students attacked while sleeping]. Phase 2: Demonization and Fear-mongering (December 2013 - January 2014) As protests grew, Russian propaganda shifted to presenting an existential threat: All protesters were labeled "Banderovtsy" (followers of WWII-era nationalist Stepan Bandera) [FALSE: Protests included diverse political views; far-right represented tiny minority] "Armed militants from Lviv" were supposedly seizing government buildings [FALSE: Protests remained overwhelmingly peaceful despite government violence] Protesters were allegedly given drugs and alcohol to maintain aggression [FALSE: Maidan kitchens famously served tea, not alcohol; no evidence of drug distribution] "NATO instructors" were training extremists in camps [FALSE: No evidence of any NATO involvement] Plans existed to ban Russian language immediately after victory [DISTORTION: While Parliament briefly considered repealing 2012 language law, it was quickly dropped; Russian was never banned] Russian Channel One created fake witness testimonies about "trains of Galician extremists" coming to kill Russian speakers [STAGED: Multiple "witnesses" identified as paid actors]. Life News produced segments showing "terrified Kyiv residents fleeing the city" [FAKE: Actors performed in multiple videos with different identities]. Phase 3: The Sniper Massacre (February 18-22, 2014) When government snipers killed over 100 protesters, Russian media immediately launched multiple false narratives: Opposition leaders ordered snipers to shoot their own supporters for sympathy [FALSE: Ballistic evidence, videos, and investigations confirmed shots from government-controlled positions] "Georgian mercenaries" hired by the opposition were responsible [FABRICATED: "Mercenaries" who "confessed" on Russian TV were actors; Georgia officially denied involvement] Shots came from opposition-controlled buildings [FALSE: Forensic reconstruction proved trajectories from government positions] Bodies were "theatrical mannequins" [GROTESQUE LIE: All victims identified by families, documented by doctors] Crimean Annexation - Hybrid Warfare Blueprint (February-March 2014) Manufacturing Consent (February 22-27, 2014) Russian media created a false crisis to justify intervention: "Trains of Right Sector fighters" heading to Crimea to massacre Russians [FALSE: No such movements occurred; Right Sector had minimal presence even in Western Ukraine] Crimean Tatars were preparing terrorist attacks against Russians [FALSE: Crimean Tatar leadership explicitly called for peace] "Secret NATO documents" revealed plans for base in Sevastopol [FALSE: No such documents or plans existed] "Seven buses of armed Banderists" approaching Crimean border [FALSE: Complete fabrication; no evidence of any such groups] Russian media showed "spontaneous self-defense forces" emerging to protect locals [FALSE: These were Russian special forces, as Putin later admitted in April 2014]. The Occupation and Referendum Theater The "little green men" were presented as local self-defense who "bought uniforms at military surplus stores" [ABSURD LIE: Professional Russian special forces with Russian-exclusive equipment]. Putin personally denied they were Russian forces on March 4, 2014 [DIRECT LIE: He admitted the truth in documentary "Crimea: Path to Homeland" one year later]. The March 16 referendum was portrayed as free and fair with 96.77% support and 83% turnout [MASSIVELY FALSIFIED: Russia's own Human Rights Council accidentally published real data showing 30-40% turnout with 50-60% yes votes]. "International observers" validated results [FAKE: Real international organizations (OSCE, UN, EU) refused to observe; "observers" were far-right European politicians and extremists]. The Donbas War - Denial and Deception (April 2014 - February 2022) The "People's Uprising" Fiction (April-August 2014) Igor Girkin/Strelkov, a Russian FSB colonel, was presented as a "local reenactment enthusiast" [FALSE: Active FSB officer who later admitted "I pulled the trigger of war"]. Other Russian military intelligence officers were given elaborate fake backstories as "former miners" and "local activists" [FALSE: Most key figures were Russian citizens with no connection to Donbas]. The capture of military equipment was portrayed as "trophies from Ukrainian army" [FALSE: Modern Russian equipment never possessed by Ukraine appeared, documented by NATO and OSCE]. When Russian paratroopers were captured in August 2014, they were "lost on training exercises" [ABSURD: They were 50km inside Ukraine with full combat equipment]. MH17 - The Disinformation Firehose (July 17, 2014) Within hours of shooting down MH17, Russian media produced constantly changing narratives: Ukrainian Su-25 shot it down [PHYSICALLY IMPOSSIBLE: Su-25 maximum altitude 7,000m; MH17 at 10,000m] Ukrainian BUK aiming for Putin's plane [FALSE: Putin's plane nowhere near Ukraine that day] CIA filled plane with dead bodies for false flag [INSANE AND OFFENSIVE: 298 real victims with grieving families] Ukraine used captured Russian BUK [FALSE: JIT investigation proved BUK came from Russia's 53rd Brigade in Kursk] Russian media created fake Spanish air traffic controller "Carlos" and fake Ukrainian pilot "Voloshin" who "confessed" [BOTH FABRICATED: No such persons existed in those positions]. Years of Denial (2014-2022) Major battles involving regular Russian forces were systematically denied: Ilovaisk (August 2014): Russian armor columns described as "volunteers on vacation" [FALSE: Entire battalion tactical groups don't vacation with tanks] Debaltseve (January-February 2015): Russian artillery support denied [FALSE: OSCE documented cross-border shelling] Russian military deaths: Soldiers who died in Ukraine buried secretly, families silenced [COVER-UP: Cargo 200 (military dead) hidden from public] "Humanitarian convoys" (70+ from 2014-2019) brought "baby food and medicine" [FALSE: OSCE spotted military equipment; Ukraine denied inspection rights]. The Inter-War Preparation Period (2015-2021) Gradual Escalation (2015-2018) Russian media normalized occupation while denying involvement. They promoted "civil war" narrative [FALSE: International conflict with Russian forces] and demanded Ukraine negotiate directly with "rebels" [MANIPULATION: Forcing Ukraine to legitimize Russian proxies]. Passportization and Annexation Preparation (2019-2021) Distribution of 800,000+ Russian passports in occupied territories was presented as "humanitarian aid to abandoned people" [ILLEGAL: Geneva Convention prohibits occupier from changing civil status]. Claims that Ukraine "abandoned" these citizens [FALSE: Ukraine couldn't provide services due to Russian military occupation]. COVID-19 Weaponization (2020-2021) Pandemic disinformation included: US biolabs in Ukraine creating ethnic-specific bioweapons targeting Slavs [SCIENTIFICALLY IMPOSSIBLE: No such technology exists] Ukraine deliberately spreading COVID in occupied territories [FALSE: No evidence; occupied areas suffered due to Russian healthcare failures] Western vaccines were "genetic weapons" [FALSE: Anti-vaccine propaganda while Russia promoted its own Sputnik V] Putin's Historical Revisionism (July 2021) Putin's 5,000-word article "On the Historical Unity of Russians and Ukrainians" became mandatory reading for Russian forces. Key false claims: Ukraine was "created by Lenin" [FALSE: Ukrainian national movement predated Soviet Union by decades] Ukrainians and Russians are "one people - a single whole" [FALSE: Distinct languages, cultures, and national identities] Modern Ukraine is "anti-Russia project" [FALSE: Ukraine's independence isn't about Russia but about self-determination] Full-Scale Invasion and Beyond (2022-2024) Pre-Invasion Crescendo (October 2021 - February 2022) Russian media prepared the population with escalating false narratives: "Genocide in Donbas" with 130,000 refugees fleeing to Russia [FALSE: UN documented ~3,400 total civilian deaths over 8 years, mostly in 2014-2015] Ukraine preparing "Operation Storm" to retake Donbas [FALSE: No offensive preparations or capabilities] Discovery of "mass graves of Russian speakers" [FABRICATED: No evidence provided] Ukraine developing plutonium-based nuclear weapons [FALSE: No nuclear program, no plutonium] Ukraine planning false flag chemical attack [PROJECTION: Russia preparing narrative for potential chemical weapons use] Invasion Justifications and War Crimes Denial (February 2022 - Present) "Special military operation" for "denazification" [ORWELLIAN: Full-scale war against democratic country with Jewish president]. When war went badly, narratives constantly shifted: Bucha massacre: "Bodies appeared after Russians left," "satellite images faked" [FALSE: Satellite imagery, phone records, forensics all confirmed Russian atrocities during occupation] Mariupol theater bombing: "Azov Battalion false flag" [FALSE: Russian airstrike killed 600 civilians in clearly marked shelter] Kakhovka dam destruction: "Ukrainian sabotage" [FALSE: Dam under Russian control; flooding benefited Russian defense] Grain theft: "Protecting grain from Western exploitation" [FALSE: Systematic theft of Ukrainian grain documented] Key Disinformation Strategies and Techniques The Firehose of Falsehood Russian strategy involves overwhelming audience with numerous, often contradictory narratives. MH17 generated 15+ different explanations; Bucha massacre had 8 different denials. Goal isn't coherent alternative truth but destroying concept of truth itself. Projection and Reversal Consistently accusing Ukraine of what Russia itself does: calling democratic Ukraine "fascist" while exhibiting fascist characteristics, claiming Ukraine commits genocide while conducting genocidal actions, accusing Ukraine of aggression while invading. Manufactured Evidence Creating fake witnesses, documents, and recordings. Hiring actors to play refugees, victims, or "concerned citizens." Producing fake "intercepted communications" and "secret documents." Historical Weaponization Rewriting history to justify present aggression. Denying Ukrainian nationhood, claiming territories as "historically Russian," invoking WWII constantly while distorting its history. This comprehensive disinformation campaign represents the most extensive information warfare operation of the 21st century, combining traditional propaganda with modern digital tools to justify aggression, confuse international audiences, maintain domestic support, and attempt to destroy Ukrainian national identity. The scale, sophistication, and persistence of these operations demonstrate that information warfare was not auxiliary to military operations but central to Russian strategy against Ukraine.

After 20 years of Russian disinformation warfare, that is.

Good point.

I think this is a strangely absolute position to hold. Do you mean this about all invasions of sovereign states? Do you think, for example, that it was evil of the Allies to invade Nazi Germany and that they shouldn't have done it?

Roughly as little as the Kurdish, Kuwaiti, Shia, and Marsh Arab civilians who were killed by the Iraqis under Saddam. Like I said: «the US of course shouldn't have invaded Iraq.»

Yeah, even though the US of course shouldn't have invaded Iraq, it's pretty unfair to compare Ukraine to Saddam & co. What bad has Ukraine really done, other than trying to protect themselves from this exact "denazification" which is going on at the moment?

Soul>>>>>>>>blood. I welcome you 🇳🇴

@Daniel Balan Interesting reading! Horrible to read about your childhood experiences in the other thread btw. I've also had my black metal period after developing a distaste for religion. Nothing like what you experienced, but growing up as the only atheist in my circle during a time when the Norwegian school system was still very Christian, was a little lonely and frustrating experience.

*Vi døde ikke Nice to see a Norwegian being quoted here for a change! Too bad he's a Nazi and a murderer, but it'll do...

The favoring of masculinity over femininity (clearly exemplified in the low salaries in care work and overrepresentation of masculine women and female roles in entertainment).

He's Scandinavian, right? I think pretty much all places are easy compared to here.

Nice! Here are some sources: https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2013/07/drinking-coffee-may-reduce-risk-of-suicide-by-50/ «Drinking several cups of coffee daily appears to reduce the risk of suicide in men and women by about 50 percent» https://examine.com/research-feed/study/1rEBVd/ «In cohort studies, the highest category of coffee intake (compared to the lowest) was associated with a 11% lower risk of depression. A dose-response analysis indicated a 4% lower risk of depression for each 240 mL per day increase in coffee intake. Similarly, higher coffee intake was associated with a 22% lower odds of depression in cross-sectional studies.» https://www.inc.com/jeff-haden/decades-of-research-shows-coffee-makes-you-healthier-happier-but-if-you-want-to-boost-your-energy-level-memory-theres-a-7-day-catch.html «Coffee can reduce your risk of cancer up to 20 percent, your risk of type 2 diabetes by 30 percent, and your risk of Parkinson's disease by 30 percent. A study published in Circulation found that coffee can reduce the risk of stroke by 20 percent. A study of over 260,000 people conducted by the NIH found that people who drank four or more cups of coffee a day were nearly 10 percent less likely to become depressed than those who drank none.» I can't advise you to start, but I don't think you should be afraid to try.

I don't think coffee is very comparable. Those who don't drink coffee have a higher risk of depression and suicide than those who do, and if you force ChatGPT to answer yes or no on whether coffee is healthy or not, the answer is yes. Enjoy your coffee without guilt, I say!

Winter Sleep (Kis Uykusu): https://www.imdb.com/title/tt2758880/ About Dry Grasses (Kuru Otlar Üstüne): https://www.imdb.com/title/tt13231544/?ref_=nm_flmg_job_1_cdt_t_1 Amazing movies by director Nuri Bilge Ceylan. AI has really opened up a new world of cinema for me. I discovered About Dry Grasses through a conversation with ChatGPT where I was trying to get to the bottom of why I hate superhero movies so much when so many people love them. This is partly because I score very high on the Big Five trait "openness to experience" and have a very strong need for cognitive complexity. I was then given a list of movies that should suit my personality well, and thus I've had a wonderful introduction to Turkish cinema!

I'll just tell you this: You really underestimate how dirty that fuel tank already is.

It's when I see your avatar, combined with posts like this, that I realize that gathering people from across the globe and cultures to exchange ideas together is a much more beautiful thing in theory than in practice...

I actually suspect that no one makes better first impressions than psychopaths/sociopaths.

Hollywood is in such a dark place now that among relatively high-budget films, I almost think there's more room for creativity and originality in sequels and franchises. The original films from Hollywood I've seen in theaters in recent years are so generic it's unbelievable. They're so defensive and really try to appeal to absolutely everyone. If there's satire in these films, for example, it's at such an obvious level that even the dumbest 18-year-old in the world can follow along. For instance, the Trump-like antagonist in Mickey 17 had supporters with red caps...

If you had read this entire page, you would have known that Russians aren't white, so... MAGA people can't be white either btw, since it's only whites that there's nothing ever wrong with on this forum.

The point was that China isn't Marxist, despite pretending to be.

That's only in language and symbolism today. China is one of the world's most unequal countries. Don't fall for the propaganda.

The reason Kamala became Vice President in the first place is largely because she is a black woman. The fact that she became the Democratic presidential nominee, when people were more tired of woke and identity politics than pretty much anything else, says a lot about what is wrong with the Democratic Party. Want to beat fascism? Just choose to read the room a little bit.

Still more feminist than certain parts of the Muslim world today. I find that so fascinating. As a Scandinavian, I mostly think you really hit the nail on the head here btw!

It’s hard to imagine that the people you’d have to field a 80-year-old presidential candidate for in order to get them to vote Democratic and not Trump are the most evolved…

Unfortunately, more and more people will realize this and exploit it to the fullest. There's a reason why, at the moment, I'm more afraid of social media and algorithms than of nuclear war, even though it might be a little irrational.