Azrael

@Prabhaker I love your Osho quotes. Always an interesting perspective.

I'd say that strictly from a neurological and physiological standpoint - yes, because in your youth your brain still forms and rewires and sets in. If you take this time to work on yourself and to set in not the normal bullshit world view, it might make things a lot easier. But of course you need the motivation and practice hours and most teenagers or even young adults won't go with that.

Yes. But the point here is that I don't try not to filter anything from sticking, but that the one who once did disappeared. So I'm not even aware of any fight or disturbance or resistance, because it is not present any more. When I feel inside as I read this question nothing comes up. I'm not fixed any more to any specific goals. I don't try to make one side of myself buy into some concept. To give an illustration of this. You always try to sell your opinions to yourself like "I will really work on my life purpose", "I meditate for the rest of my life", "I'm a good kid" etc. You do this to a very large degree. This mostly stopped for me. I have an intuition and a strong feeling of my way. I personally "believe" that there is a way laid out for me that I'll just go. And that this will happen independent whether I'll fight it or don't. I "know" this to be true for me because it felt like that from the very beginning of my existence. But that's a belief, a strong one. So, to answer your question. I don't have a terminal goal that drives me that I know of consciously. I have a way that I go and that way follows certain patterns and routes that make me learn stuff that I should learn. I don't decide on that consciously, but I do "super-consciously."

Well, yes it surely feels like a low dose of shrooms trip on a day to day basis, but that's a symptom. As your thoughts go down, it'll naturally be like that because your awareness now shines more on different things. The main difference is that if I look at the shelf e.g., I can honest to god not feel or recognize a difference to what we would call myself. And that comes with a lot of implications. And the low shrooms trip state of being is one point of that. But keep in mind that states are only temporary. I might feel that way as a basis, but for example when I'll get into an argument or a fight, or if I do something very different, I will feel and perceive the world differently. As you wake up, you tend to not want to be in one state or another any more, because it really doesn't matter. That's the beauty.

Yeah, I can spot that in others and myself, too. I've spotted it yesterday in @Huz when we skyped to elaborate on what the ego really is and how it works. But more importantly I can spot and differentiate it in myself from my normal self. The "Self" with a capital "S" is your authentic character. It is the way how you are. What you like, how you speak, how you think, etc. This is not bad at all. This is your expression in this world. Don't try to get rid of that. I see a lot of people confusing that with ego. The ego is the suit that I talked about in my post. It resists parts of your authentic, spontaneous arising character to keep it in place. It's like a guardian that makes sure you don't get too crazy. Well, there's always a cost of having that kind of 24/7 security.

You cut the contact to 100% of your friends because you didn't want to drink? Dude, have a fucking drink.

Everything that was worthy to me before. My life purpose (talked about it in more detail in this post), my friends, family, travelling, my hobbies you name it. Why shouldn't it be worth while doing?

Yessssss. I don't do self-inquiry formally. I always did and do "Do Nothing" + "Strong Determination Sitting". I did contemplate a lot and did self-inquiry throughout the day. But I don't do it any more. Self-Inquiry especially is a tool that looses its power when it succeeded. It is there to get in and get in only. BUT, there is a but. Remember that self-inquiry is one special case of contemplation in general. And you'll not run out of things to contemplate for a bizillion life times. I still do that. I love that. I live that. I contemplated from the first very minute I was alive. This is me. A azzy L. So, this'll never go. I'm curious and naive like a little child. I'll always ask: But what is ... about? Yes and no. When it comes to the mere realization and recognition of who you are, then I would say no. This is a binary step. In or out. But, as I said in the post, this'll then throw you into a big fucking ocean and away from your path. So it's a different level in a different world. Lot's to find out here. My understanding will never go to an end state, it'll always re-arrange itself and find more suitable models to understand the world. My experience will also never get to the point where I am done with this. Everyday I learn and experience new stuff. But the main difference is, that I don't seek for understanding or experience any more. I don't sit down to meditate to get somewhere. I don't think about a concept to hold the moving fish in my hand. This is more like play now, like a very good play though.

Don't make it too hard for yourself too early or you'll leave self-actualization behind for good. Think strategically. You know what you like and crave. Contemplate what you like, dislike, want to have in your life and what not. Don't construct an ideal self-actualized prototype and try to fit that. Implement little practices like meditation and let the realizations you'll have cut away the stuff that you aren't authentically wanting at any given time. There are two kinds of approaches here. The first one is to build a prison around you, the second one is to let realizations design your life. So what do you do? To take the best of both and balance them out.

No, I don't. That's why I opened this thread. So that you had the chance. That's an interesting question. Hard to say though. I don't have too much entertainment in my life, I guess. Or let's say in the regular way. I don't watch TV. I am in front of a screen most of the time though. Mostly because I'm a programmer and I study. And I love it and I am addicted to it. That's why I take walks, do meditation, little sport routines etc. to get a balance for that. It's not a problem for me though. I don't do entertainment to get away from myself. I can sit in the train and just enjoy the situation. I love to be alone with myself and just think about crazy stuff, talk to myself and contemplate ideas and stuff out of my imagination. If you would see how I behave when I'm at home alone, you'd come to the conclusion that I'm a crazy person. For sure. But that's how I like it. I put some music on, dance. Talk to myself out loud, involve myself in my own dramas. That's my entertainment, I guess. I love watching documentaries though and I limit the amount of series that I binge. Because I very well binge if I watch one. I get completely emotionally invested and it takes away all my time. That's why I just watch the best and not too much. I'm pretty fine with this. I work a lot - too much probably - because this is my entertainment (as well). Right now, everything kind of feels like entertainment because it feels good. So I cannot really draw the line. It comes very naturally to me what I do and how much I do of it. I don't restrict myself and I consciously go into low-consciousness behaviour sometimes because I love it. I need the balance. But yeah, I don't know.

@I Am That, good example! I will have to make a few distinctions before we can explore the dynamics of my claim that you are very well able - if not more prone - to rape someone when you are enlightened and you were like that before it. Well, let's start by clarifying that that being able to recognize the source of your nature + having an integrated ego in the sense that you stop physiologically resisting your authentic character by sensations, feelings and thoughts is completely distinct from a moral position you might take on in our life. How can that be? How can someone who recognizes himself as everything and nothing could still harm an aspect of himself e.g. rape someone? How could that be? The beginner and the intermediate practitioner who has had enlightenment like experiences is likely to project that enlightenment is something similar that one experienced maybe in deep meditation. Full letting go, merging with awareness... that kind of stuff. This'll automatically lead to the false assumption that you could not harm anything in that blissful, expanded open state. Makes sense. Well, enlightenment isn't like that. What I described here is an experience and enlightenment is not an experience. You might feel very calm, blissful, open and expanded when you are enlightened, but this'll be a symptom of the recognition and integration that took place. Also note, that you'll still live your normal life with challenges, hopes, fears etc. That'll still hugely direct your consciousness in a very pragmatic way. But more importantly enlightenment sets free your authentic un-resisted character. This character may result from societal / parental conditioning, circumstances, predispositions (whatever you think it is - doesn't matter). But as the ego relaxes and let's this un-resisted character shine through, it'll present itself in every facet with every of its attributes. That's why if you were for example naturally prone to rape women or something happened to you that made you belief that you need to to that or however you came to the conclusion that this is your thing to do, you'll still do that after you are enlightened. You'll still do that even if you feel open, relaxed and expanded. You'll still do that if you feel that you are the very thing that you rape. Just because, your character chooses to do so, just as you as a moral defender choose to judge the one who does it without seeing the whole picture. Moralism is as any set of opinions and beliefs something that a character type might take on or might not. This will hugely depend on the culture, conditioning, circumstances etc. Non of that is God-given or Truth. it's one way to do stuff.

I don't get quote on quote lost in it any more because when I think and I am aware that I do so, it's a very pleasant experience. But compulsive thoughts are not around very much. Even in stressful situations, my mind is mostly calm and it never feels bad to think. That is the main difference I'd say. Before it was often very painful and disturbing to get lost in it. Right now, it feels like a tingeling sensation in my head when I think, not a tension or pressure as it did before. Yeah, you rest in Being automatically without going there. You too, just that you are torn out of there more because of resisted thoughts and feelings that seem to you that you have to "do" something right now to get out of your current situation. That stops, and you feel you are there. Through that, everything relaxes and returns to default. And Being is default.

Nope, again the recognition of the self has nothing to do with that. Your real character will shine through. A rapist that'll become a enlightened will be even better in raping women after he is enlightened. Because the resistance to his raping will probably be mostly gone and he can freely rape. Unconditional love comes from "visiting the places" for years and decades, not from knowing that they exist.

There was nothing holding me back, I just took a no-breakthrough dose. I wanted to get into the feeling again because I hadn't done it for a while. No big experience. Nothing to report on.

Not very much. For that kind of resilience you need to actually "visit the places" as I mentioned in my metaphor. You need years of training and discipline. It's one thing to be not additionally attached to emotions and sensations because of the integration of the constructed self, it's another to be 100% resilient towards natural bodily reactions.

If we define a self-image issue as an automatic subconscious resistance in form of a thought + feeling with the context of not being able to accept a certain property of the self-image, then yeah. I don't fuck with myself no more. Insecurities still exist as a raw phenomenon, because there are still things I learn and am not very good in. The attachment to a certain insecurity is - depending on the context and how important I think it is - mostly gone, so I don't care. But I still have all my weak spots and they can still be triggered. It's just that my body doesn't react in an emotional way to it any more. My mind might think about it, but my body feels no negative self-resisting emotions. And that's like watching a horror movie with friendly music in the background. Not to be taken that seriously. Feelings of incompleteness and lack of fulfilment are gone. That's probably one of the major things. Throughout the day, you don't lack anything any more. You are complete and through that fulfilled. I do experience a lack of motivation because of that. I do. I do less shit and live even slower. But that's just the beginning. So that might be a phase.

I handle teachers / teachings / perspectives on that whole topic / discussions in general in a very specific way. For me it comes very natural to see the context in which somebody is arguing. The whole world-view and perspective that he is trying to express - underneath the actual thing that he is saying. Because of that - especially when it comes to spirituality - I use the things that I hear as tools and I categorize them in certain categories. To give a specific example. In my opinion @Leo Gura is very able to take a normal human being's perspective and slowly debunk the false beliefs one is operating from. Then he presents a set of methods and perspectives to give you the opportunity to work on your own case. I haven't seen so far a better collection of deadly weapons to go about this journey. My own subset of this collection consists of Strong Determination Sittings Do Nothing 5-MeO-DMT to name a few. These alone are so powerful you could write at least a few books about every one of them. I'd actually like to do that some day when I am more experienced with this stuff. Now, a Rupert Spira for example has a complete different setting he presents to you. He is very able to show you your real nature just by listening to him and working with his metaphors. He can very much take you to yourself in a 10 minute video if you are open minded and willing to listen. That is a very different skill set and way of approaching the whole thing. Alan Watts - to name a third variant - will complete reform your world view if you pay close attention to his speeches. He will go into all the aspects of life and free them of the normal false beliefs that we connect them with. All of these three share one important point. And that is that they are pointing to the truth. All of them are (or in Alan case were) through their character and own personal history at a different point on their journeys and will present you different pointers. It's your task to see where they overlap and what they have all in common. Then extract that and use the techniques and world views that resonate with you for your own way. I don't know @Leo Gura any better then you and cannot say how his journey really goes. I watch every Sunday the same as you do. I make my own projections, as you do. And they are neither very intriguing nor any relevant to share. I think there is a clear distinction when it comes to this topic that is widely misunderstood. Before I go into it, I wanna share a metaphor to illustrate it. Go back to the time when you were a young kid. As a young kid, you didn't now that there was a world around you. You weren't yet conscious of the fact that there are places and how to orient yourself in these places. Something that is quite basic to you right now. As a young kid you just didn't now. Through the journey of growing up you went to more places and suddenly at some point in time you became conscious of a whole world being around you. Of different continents with different life forms. Different cultures. Different planets in different solar systems. When you realized this it was clear to you. And without being on every continent you get this part of reality. However, someone who has actually been to a lot of these places, studied cultures and places and lived this literally will have a way deeper understanding of the very same realization. The realizations that there is a world. Now, the same applies to enlightenment in my opinion. If you have the realization you see and recognize the truth instantly. And that realization is whether had or not had. To which degree you deepen it and experience it in all of its facets, will be another question. And that's really the journey that we are on. And in that matter, I've scratched the surface. I've been blown into an ocean and from my path into a new world, and I have to now figure out how it goes around here. And I'm thrilled to find out. I do a lot of consciousness work every day. But in a different way now. I am right now in the phase where it actually becomes a change in your whole physique. My sense of self was always located in my head. Now, that this is gone the bodily awareness comes much more into focus and I experience certain things in a complete new way. That's why spirituality is not a topic in my head right now. Because I experience it now differently. There is no realization that I want to have right now. I'm thrilled with different dynamics. However, I still fall for certain concepts and like to think about them of course. For example the System Thinking thing is something I did unconsciously for a long time without knowing that thing has a name. Now, it's even more interesting to go into. I realize though that this is phase I go through. I might get heavy into the intellectual understanding of spirituality some time later. But right now, there just isn't something I can get from that. It's not that I watch a Mooji video and don't get what he is saying. I do. That's why I wanna experience it deeper with meditation and just living it.

That's not so easy to answer. From the outside it might seem like a good question because you are always pondering whether something is true or not. As soon as you are on the inside, the concept of (outside/inside) disappears and through that this question of "Do you know now what is real? Are you sure?". In some sense I could tell you "Yeah, I can know and recognize at any point in time who I truly am. That is true." But also I could tell you "That I can never be certain about anything at all. Not if I talk about it. Because as soon as I do, I get away from the real thing." If you could be certain about it, there would be a way to make an object out of it and then show it to other people. Well, that's not possible. To understand this paradox ask yourself this question: "How can you know that you are here right now?" You are able to say with complete confidence that something is happening right now at your place. Your sight, sounds, experiences, thoughts. But you can never say with certainty what it is that makes you so sure about all this. You cannot reduce it to the the minimum. But you can recognize it.

That is a real thing one should keep in mind. First off, if you are psychologically ill or on any kind of medication, don't do it unless you talked about it with a doctor / do it with a doctor. When you are on the journey and you use it, expect to have horrifying experiences. You will. That's a phase. I had several very dark shroom trips and one I had to end because I couldn't handle it. In this time I purged a lot of stuff and I am someone who will even take psychedelics in that phase to get it out. But then, as I said ... stuff happens. Be careful, look how far you can go. In my experience one is still able to function with distorted thoughts - although its of course not fun. But you'll have them anyway if you are on the journey and are integrating your ego. So, you should think about that in general whether this is cool for you. With psychedelics, they will probably make them worse for a time but then they'll leave sooner because they purge out more effectively. This is who it went for me. But that's a question that is highly subjective. Be wise. And careful with this one. No, I study right now. So I can set my schedule myself. I believe in Leo's minimalism approach like a fanatic. I just leave enough space for personal development, sleeping long hours, work (working as a software engineer a few hours a week) and of course being with my friends and vacations. Strategic thinking and planning is required here. I love it. Thank's for the share. Sounds interesting!

I did 5-MeO-DMT one week ago. But just a little dose, because I hadn't done it in a while. I will use psychedelics for a lot longer. I love them. Also, I feel like there is endless depth in these experiences. And you can basically decide how fast you want to progress on your journey through psychedelics (especially 5-MeO-DMT). So, I'll still use that and shrooms... and all the other goodies. But I haven't planned any trip right now. We'll see when the next one happens. For me it mostly happens in phases in which I'll do it a few times for lets say 2-4 weeks and then I'll let it all soak in. But right now, I got a lot of stuff coming up and no real need to do it that much.

Just as before. I guess I care more deeply about them now because my unconscious agendas mostly dropped and I just like being with them and enjoying myself.

I'd say the difference between an sexual orgasm and a non-dual state is way higher. Ever been in an samadhi state, 5-MeO-DMT experience, something similar? Even if you have sex with the woman you deeply love and desire, I'd still say the difference is higher. Because it's so deep. But I wouldn't call it pleasure. That's probably also the reason you can't really compare it to other stuff. Please is a sexual orgasm. A non-dual state is a more of a shift in perspective. And more of a release then pure pleasure. Way more relaxed.

@dice, thanks for the lookup! @zunnyman, I think we interpret my quote here differently. First of all, I would still say the thing that I said in that quote. That feels totally true. It especially did right after the 5-MeO-DMT experience. The difference for me between "life being a lie" and what I said there is, that I just couldn't believe what I had actually done to myself. When you do the substance you all see that you super-consciously do everything yourself. That this unknown that you face all the time is actually yourself. When you recognize that you'll actually become it. It's like the wall you always punched against suddenly disappears because you see that you are it. What I meant when I said this simply is that I couldn't believe what kind of a wall I built in the sense that it was so damn crazy and good. But recognize, you still built that wall to fight with it. To grow by it and to unify yourself with it then later. So, nowhere in this process are you really lying to yourself. You as one part of the whole have just a limited perspective for some time until you see it in its entirety. I understand your point though now. It's pretty nuanced and depends from which perspective one sees it.

If you just wanna feel good I'd suggest hooking yourself up to heroin. (I've heard that'll do the job.) If you think that spending time getting enlightened is a waste and that you can just punch your way through it in a few years if you just do enough meditation, self-enquiry and contemplation be warned to wake up the devil. All the good you feel if you are awake, is hardly comparable to how fucked up you had to feel to get there. You'll have to face your unconscious which means you'll go and let out every little monster that you have inside of you. And they'll rape you as long and deep as they can. For years. And then you are allowed to wake up. Also, don't think you can lead this process consciously in any way. The only conscious thing you can do is giving power to the engine (your unconscious) to burn out the wood (repressed memories and beliefs). If it is time to wake up, you will. If it's not, you will not because you don't decide.

I think you are dreaming. No, I didn't. If you can quote that I would be astonished because I wouldn't say such a thing. My prior life was not a lie and my current life is not a lie. My prior life was everything that is needed to be here and now. There is no rush for enlightenment. Go for it, if you have the hunger for it. Go for something else, if you have the hunger for that. Trust your intuition to lead you all the way. I could've never gotten to this point if I hadn't done that. That's why I will choose to go down a stupid road if my intuition leads my there because I know that I should probably make that experience then and learn from it.