Jack River

The “I” that oberves a thought determines the image that is perceived. When “I” (accumulated attachment/resistance/identification-the past) perceive arising moment to moment experiences, that “I” (the past-time-thought) stamps its own label-image on top of those moment to moment experiencings. That is this concentration itself at play. What happens when there is no concentration/the past projected on the present? What does that imply?

Thought psychologically is not necessary. Motive/gaols are for function. To plan, to accomplish practical goals like leaning how to do things and applying what we learned (jobs/leaning language/learning an art) and such. To project thought to live in society is necessary. But to project thought/time to be psychologically satisfied breeds conflict/suffering. Freedom(psychological contentment/happiness) is literally always only now.

The motive definitely determins the outcome. If I’m seeking psychological security in the future I’m inherently going to project thought in that future moment as a result. Just as a self is seeking now, unless it sees that is a habit, and ends it, it will also seek in that future moment. Therefore never fully here now.

I feel if you want to use a method you may wan to start understanding thoughts nature. This may allow you to not get caught up in the loop of control as the controller. Never know you may not want to do any method after getting into it.

The holistic understanding is an infinite program not limited to the limitations of limitation.

I don’t want to reprogram myself. The program of thought works on its own. But as far operating with a psychological program, well that seems to be where the problems arise.

No... i simply understand thought and its relationship to the thinker. This will bring about a holistic understanding which is its own action that quiets/silences thought.

Fosho...the wanting, striving after/to capture/maintain a sense of psychological contentment is to depend on the future to deliver that. This inherently puts psychological freedom(the ending of compulsive thought chatter) in the future and not now.

The gaol/desire is born of memory just as those thoughts are. To me it’s very simple, as long as we have a psychological goal/desire, we are going to project compulsive thinking in time(present moment) on top of the timeless now. To move with desire to attain a psychological goal is the birth of self/thought.

These current moment wants arise for past wants(desire). So we meet the present movement with what we feel should be according to the past wants(desire). Our likes and dislikes-wants and do not wants that have been accumulated through memory(the past) are projected onto and as the present moment. To prevent oneness from actually being observed directly.

I find it much simpler to observe thought movement from states of this to that. The consistent movement away from what is to what should be. You can be sure that thoughts are arising simultaneously with this movement away from the fact to the abstraction of what it thinks/feeds should be. Thought responds when the self meets the moment to moment nowness with its own desire/fear/ambition/goal oriented pursuit. This movement of becoming other tham what is breeds thoughts.

Control is born of the “past”, modified as “the present”, projected in the “future”. Therfore is the past calling the shots and determining the present moment of the chooser and that which “it” chooses...who’s in control now anyway? The controller is the controlled

This will be answered by stepping out of that thought/time river. But you can also come close to what I mean by exploring thoughts nature.

Very simply. So we meet the moment to moment now with our psychological wants and needs(resistance to now as it is/what is). This responding to the now with the old (thought) is a response of memory( “my” likes/dislikes & desire to self satisfy through those desire-likes/dislikes). When I project my desire(born of the past-memory) to end thought(self constructed image-images) onto the present moment, isn’t that the arising of the thought itself from moment to moment? For me understanding holistically itself ends any current compulsive thought chatter and it becomes a natural response to not self project “future” thought projection as well. It’s to step out of the thought/self loop all together. Quite gnarly and simple, yet difficult for a desire seeking mind.

Pleasure and suffering have there root in desire which is the survival mechanism of thought being utilized to solve psychological dissatisfaction with what-is. Pleasure/desire is resistance to what is. Cant have pleasure without suffering. They go together. They are the same.

The obsever is the ideas/concepts (desire) that looks upon “its own” contents/experience (desire/ideas).. So if that observer(desire) is looking at the content, that which is being observed, the observation is inherently distorted by desire itself. Which brings incoherent action to control/change/alter what-is. If there is any motive to change what is, that is desire-fear-effort in movement.. Even “the I” who says I am not these ideas/desire because I am the one observing ‘them’ is still very subtly desire/fear/effort in movement(an illusion of psychological time).

@LoveandPurpose ?

That would be an action born of the past-thought(action arising out of a judgment itself).

Excellent?

We may also find that fear only arises when we feel the experiencer of fear to be distinct from the experience of fear. As in a separate entity that stands outside and observes “its” fear). The conflict between two opposing images (experiencer and “its” experience; fear, anger, anxiety, etc.) = reaction/resistance to what-is. If that apparent divison between me and my experience is seen actually/factually (holistically) as not divided at all, but one single unit in movement thought, you will see that fear (resistance to what is) itself comes to an end instantaneously.

Are we aware of all subtle forms of fear and how they are all actually one movement of away from what is? Can we see that any arising of fear is reisistance to what is? Can we observe this movement from moment to moment very clearly/easily? The self/thought will see fear in fragments(distinct ions). The self doesn’t see holistically that fear manifest itself as any psychological continuity of becoming or not becoming. Can we see that the movement of desire in pursuit of pleasure, satisfaction, contentment, etc. to come to a state of psychological security implies attachment to what has been, and a projection of what should be. And that this itself implies resistance to what is. Any movement away from what-is is fear(reaction) born of psychological time. Can we see all the subtle ways we escape what is? If you look closely this takes place literally every second of the selfs daily life. The movement of self in its very structure depends of time(resistance to what is-fear).

Well said my man

Understanding the nature of thought as it is actually is the foundation. Everything is simple from then on.

The i(loop) that wants to transcend “it” is the very mechanism consistently sustaining its own continuity. Thought is then transcending it’s own implicit limit continuously which brings about this incoherence of understanding. You can go into one particular question at a time, or you can see the whole of it all by holistically understanding thought/reality itself. You may see that it is all reality. The self looks at the whole of thought-reality as if that self is outside of it. Is that true, or is the self(consciousness) contianed within thought-reality? Is everything thought thinks about reality? As in even the self that apparently stands outside as the thinker?

When I Control to bring about psychological security/satisfaction i am bound to live a contradictory life. Controlling in the psychological realm doesn’t imply order. The ending of psychological evolution leads to a life of order where action is not born of the image(fear/frustration/anxiety and such). Then there can be a living free of hypocrisy. Free of image imposition/projection and conflict in relationship. Control is a mechanism for function, a practical mechanism (tool) to use thought in daily life. If we are slaves to control inward(psychologically) that divison, confusion, filled by conflict will be expressed in our daily life. Look at things the way they are now and you can be sure that is the result of this psychological control dictating the actions we take in the day to day. Without psychological freedom can there be a “spiritual” (the newness of the now)? if not what’s the point, who wants to live as the past, what has been? Isn’t that a dead life? ‘Self Discipline’ is a function of thought. That’s where the limit is drawn.