Cred

Fantastic question! This is my take about that currently: The omnimodal noetic (OMN) model describes the genetic conditions for your personally preferred mode of being. So if your noetic profile consists of 0% of one of these, you cannot be nurtured into engaging with that mode of being. One can be nurtured into living a life that is not in alignment with their genetic noetic profile. Just like people here are being nurtured into doing pickup. This is especially the case for asemionoetic people (non conformists) like us, because nurture itself is a very semionoetic process. (Gotcha) (I can imagine that all mental disorders trace back to a misalignment with the respective noetic profile. But I know this is a big claim.) This means that you can't measure the noetic profile of a person by examining their behavior. (they are doing pickup? Surely they are semionoetic!). Each individual has to at least partly figure out its noetic profile by themselves, since only they know what mode of existence they value. But it is a lot easier when they know about OMN.

It is almost 6:00 am and I haven't slept yet. The model is kinda blowing up in my face. I couldn't stop. It seems to have massive implications to self-actualization, anthropology, ecology, biology, political philosophy, psychology, sociology, theology, mysticism, integral theory, ethics, metaphysics, epistemology and especially ontology lol. So everything important basically. I need to get some rest and then you'll be greeted with a massive thread about Omnimodal noetic ontology (the name of the model for now, I know sounds epic) (for now) TSP (truth sensitive person) is renamed to Asemionoetic (spectrum/person/mode of existence) OSP (object sensitive person) is renamed to Hylonoetic (person/mode of existence) SSP (subject sensitive person) is renamed to Phenonoetic (person/mode of existence) non-TSP is renamed to Semionoetic (person/mode of existence)

Great observations! I want to add some nuance though. You are using TSP as OSP (object-sensitive) which would be more precise. The reason why OSPs cope through analysis is much deeper. The thing is, that OSP says nothing about intelligence. The defining feature about OSPs is not that they are competent, but that they are sensitive to and identify with the object. So low-IQ OSPs tend to be content playing with, collecting or organizing objects like toys for example. When OSPs analyze (an object like a topic), they are affirming their personal mode of existence. This is why nobody here truly stops analyzing in order to find their existence in meditation, because only SSPs can do that. If you are a hybrid, then a hybrid approach works best, which is what you are currently doing anyway.

Thank you so much for the encouragement! I'm working on my Objective-Subjective-Sensitive-person model right now, and honestly, I think I'm cooking. I am calling non-truth-sensitive people symbol-sensitive-people as of right now. I think it's an accurate name. In short, they don't care what it is or what it feels like, they only care about what it means (to other people)

Can you be more precise please? Do you mean seeking out other TSPs? My claim is, this is the only truly healthy way for TSPs to bond. Practicing pickup on thousands of people is the real cope to me. Edit: I'm thinking of changing the name again sorry. I really think I might be onto something here

About the insane Social-Symbolic-Alien Language non-Truth-Sensitive-People use Do you also hate making presents? Since forever, my family hates on me for sucking at making presents. And I beat myself up for it. They say I'm not empathic enough, too egoistic bla bla bla. My best explanation was, that I'm an only child and I've never properly learned it. Theory break: According to me, there exists a kind of neurodiversity I call "Truth-Sensitive-Person" (TSP). I believe, that TSPs exist on a spectrum between object-sensitive-person (OSP) and subject-sensitive-person (SSP) (this model is a work in progress. In previous posts, I used TLP). What all TSPs have in common is a love for absolute truth and a disdain for and a lack of understanding of social truths. More on that below. I have an alternative explanation now. My grandma told me that she is always super thrilled and happy when she receives little gifts like cake from her cleaning lady, and she is disappointed that me and my mom (also SSP) would not engage in little acts of affection like these too. What I've noticed is that this (happiness about gifts from others for their own sake) is not the case for me and my mom at all. Which means that even if we were lazy and egoistic (which we are not) we are at least not hypocrites. In fact, we are always annoyed by gifts from other people, when they are not useful to us. You might now say: "Of course you are. Why would you be happy to receive a gift that you have no use for?" If you believe this logic, you might be on the TSP spectrum. Because for a non-TSP, this logic does not apply at all. When they receive a gift from someone they love, they are super thrilled if that gift is well-meant. The crucial thing to understand, and it is hard to understand for TSPs, is that non-TSPs are not thrilled about the present itself. They get most of their pleasure from the gesture. The present is a symbol to them. This is because non-TSPs speak a completely batshit insane kind of social-symbolic-alien language they picked up and learned passively through conformity like their native language and are super confused about anyone who struggles to speak it, like TSPs, who only care about information (or spiritual truth if you are HSP) and struggle to pick up on these social symbols. Expecting a TSP to implicitly understand this social symbolic language is like starting to talk to some random person on the street in chinese and then being mad and confused, if they don't understand the fuck you're saying. And non-TSPs do that all the damn time! This leads TSPs to develop social anxiety, low self-esteem, etc. People who are TSPs naturally struggle with social situations, especially competitive ones because of this. They will genuinely start believing they have to learn tens of hours of pickup theory and do thousands of approaches to be successful without ever understanding, that they are not meant to engage in this alien language, the same way someone with an IQ of 80 is not meant to study thermodynamics. (If you think you might be TSP, you don't have to worry, just seek out other TSPs irl. They understand you perfectly and vice versa) I want to give another example from my life. I once dated a girl with heavy ADHD. This made her relatable to me, but she is not a TSP. One day, she was kind of in a bad mood, and she asked me: "Do you think I drink too much water?". I answered by dumping her with all the information I knew about the topic "how much water is too much water". After that, she was pissed and said: "What does any of this have to do with the question?". I was stumped. What did I do wrong? You have any ideas? I thought, that she wanted to know if she drinks too much water. Big mistake. See the mistake? If you don't or struggle to answer, then maybe you are a TSP too. It took me some time to figure it out, but I think I got it. She did not want to know if she drinks too much water. She wanted to know if I think that she drinks too much. She just wanted me to affirm that I accept her for drinking so much water. When you dig deep enough you will realize, what she actually asked was: "Do you approve of my existence?". This is at the fundamental reason for all social interactions between non-TSPs. This is why they need social interactions, because without them, they wouldn't know whether they exist. To TSPs, this logic makes zero sense. When we are faced with questions or insecurities regarding our existence, we would NEVER even THINK about going to a cleaning lady for affirmations (nothing against cleaning ladies). Because what the fuck would they know about existence???? What we do instead is we study philosophy if we are more on the autism side, meditate when we are more on the HSP side and do both if we are hybrids. In case this did not get clear enough: The reason why TSPs are here on this forum is because we are genetically unable to be satisfied with answers about our own existence from our cleaning ladies. Or positively reframed: We are not stupid enough to believe that receiving gifts from our cleaning lady is sufficient to affirming our existence.

The same thing without bashing communism

@Miguel1 Honestly, that sounds totally fair to me. I'm in the process of differentiating between unmasked, authentic behaviour and unnecessary "bad" behaviour. I have not had an online presence like this yet and still figuring things out. A lot of the things I've said, I wouldn't have said like this to someone in person. I'll maybe try to use this frame in the future. I will spend time kontemplating intrusion, respect, dignity. I will likely become more careful about my rethoric when adressing an individual on this forum. Thanks for your patience.

Thank you! A few days ago I watched a streamer who said to her chat: "You can be obnoxious if you're right and you can be wrong if you are humble. But you can't be wrong and obnoxious." I think that I get to be obnoxious because I believe I'm right. If you have a different opinion, I get that you find me annoying. Another reason is that I want people to attack my points, so I can go back to the drawing board and strengthen my points. But you're not doing that. You are just attacking my rethoric, not the content of what I'm saying.

This is the best explaination for his rethoric I've found so far. I feel like it is relevant for this forum. I know that my rethoric is intrusive. That's because exposing delusion is inherently intrusive. If you have a more complete explaination than me or you have specific arguments against my claims I'd like to hear them.

@OmniNaut Your mistake is that you have the same wrong assumptions as Leo. You are correct that you point out the hypocracy of someone who says "exposing falsehood is truth" and "love is truth". But you come to the wrong conclusion that the former one must be the wrong one. It's actually the latter. I'll not repeat a point I've already made so here we go:

Leo is heavily oppressed by societ because of his neurodivergency and he is coping by putting himself on a pedastal and everyone else down. If he would finally realize why and how he is being ostracised, he could be able make peace with it and develop a more balanced view of society

@Bernardo Carleial What is your point? Bc if it is "ML is not stage yellow" than you have given the reason why the opposite is true yourself.

The Tibet topic is controversial. Here is an article I found https://redsails.org/friendly-feudalism/ I encourage you to get your own sources and make your own opinion about the subject.

Yeah the problem is, when you train your mind to believe that everything is consciousness, that this will bias your mind to turn inwards. "Why would I help this person materially if I could just imagine helping them, which would be the same thing?" At the end, you will not be more right when you believe in philosophical idealism oder more right when you believe in philosophical materialism, the only thing that is shifting is what you tend to focus on. (Meditation, thinking, lucid dreaming, fantacising, isolation, etc. vs acting, socializing, political activism, improving material conditions etc.) This is not an error. You need to focus on some narrative in order to act and make a decision. You can also empty your cup and act intuetively, but if you are here you have very much intact reasoning skills, it would be a waste not to use them at all. Also your intuition is biased towards your beliefs anyways. Learning about marxism has provided me with an extremely important insight. It's that this notion, common in spiritual circles that "you can't change the world but at least you can change yourself through discovering god" is complete bullshit and capitalist propaganda. No matter where you look in history, the concept of god was always used by the ruling class to make the oppressed class turn inwards and "forget" they are oppressed. "The reason you are doing poorly is because you are not enlightened enough!" I want you to research the horrendous conditions, the tibetan serfs were faced with under the supposedly so loving Lama system before the Chinese communists liberated them. The thing is, this has never changed. It only has become more subtle, and this community is the proof.

"All is Love. 😊All is Love. 😊All is Love. 😊All is Love. 😊All is Love. 😊All is Love. 😊All is Love. 😊All is Love. 😊All is Love. 😊All is Love. 😊All is Love. 😊All is Love. 😊All is Love. 😊All is Love. 😊All is Love. 😊All is Love. 😊" - Xonas Pitfall "Hate is just love taking out the trash, don't you know." - gettoefl The ideology that @Xonas Pitfall and @gettoefl are promoting can be broadly categorized as "right hand path" (RHP). The idea that if you put love as the highest value, it is possible to avoid harm is wrong. However I understand why it seems so bulletproof. After all how could anyone harm someone when their highest value is love? But you don't understand how self-decieved people can be. There are plenty of atrocities that were supposedly committed out of love. "I snipe gazan children in the head out of love towads holy isrealites" give me a break. So how does this deception work? There are some moments in life where cruelty is just the best option. Maybe you've never had this in your life but there exist people who are like parasites that will just keep exploiting you as long as you act selflessly towards them. And as soon as you try to turn your back towards them, they will play the victim and look at you with puppy eyes. Everyone who has met this kind of person who is not a right hand path person will tell you the same thing: Just pull the trigger. Be cruel. Cut them from your life. If you are a devotee of the right hand path (RHP), this will be very tough for you (since you value love, kindness and this shit) and you will try to weasel yourself out of the situation. This is really hard since these kinds of people will not just leave you the fuck alone. The big danger here is this: A lot of RHP people, who intuitively know that the cruel thing is the right thing to do, bc it is, will do that anyways, but than somehow frame it in a way that makes it seem to themselves that they actually upheld their values. For example they might cut the person out and say "I did it out of love! This will teach them to be independent! They are actually better off without my help!". This does not have to be the case at all, like the person could be completely fucked without the help but the RHP will always find a way to bend reality to convince them they are still a good devotee. This is a bit of a niche example but this mechanism happens extremely often. Just look at the heinous things mormon people are capable of. It's also very important to understand, that "high consciousness" RHPs are not immune to this at all. "Hate heals, you should try it sometime Strive for Peace with acts of war The beauty of death we all adore I have no faith distracting me I know why your prayers will never be answered" Left hand path people (LHP) (satanists etc.) are the ones who smell and expose this bullshit. Their way of coping with cruelty and hate is actually brilliant which is they promote it into the devine realm. This allows them to commit cruel acts in a ritualistic way. Notice that I'm not saying, that satanists are necessarily cruel more often than RHPs (In reality, the opposite is the case actually). But WHEN they are cruel, they can do it with integrity and in a pure state of consciousness, without any delusions attached.

@Lyubov It's helpful you mentioned that these labels were harmful to your awakening, not harmful to your survival. First I want to remind you of the approach "figure out which traits you have without labeling yourself". But I also want to defend labels for a sec. Of course I know that identifying yourself with any concept is harmful for an awakening. However, even though buddhists now that, they will still be buddhists bc how else are they supposed to build a sangha if they can't say they're buddhists? The Moment you realize that labels are just a language game that we play out of convenience and don't penetrate the self, you'll be able to call yourself what you want, as long as you remove all the fluff again as soon as you are doing the practices. And do you really want to tell me you want to practice every waking hour? Gimme a break. So why are labels useful in the first place? They are effective. If I see a Nazi charge towards a minority I will not politely tell them: "You are being very unconstitutional you. Don't make me write an angry letter with plenty of exclamationpoints to your mom" like a god damn liberal. I also I will not stand there and empty my fucking cup and wait until laser beams shoot from my eyes. Very quickly, I will notice that I'm a communist and remember how communists deal with nazis. Likewise, when your grandma tells you: "Why are you on the internet so much? Why aren't you enjoying your youth? You are thinking too much about abstract topics, I feel sorry for you. If I was your age again, I would be travelling around the world" you don't want to think to youself: "She is right I AM pretty weird. Why is that? Am I living my life wrong? Am I wasting my youth? Am I wasting my potential?", instead you can, again, quickly remember, that you are ND and she is projecting. Then you can politely tell her "I know how I want to live my life, thank you". Edit: Just in case that wasn't obvious enough, yes this was an actual conversation I just had with my grandma and yes, the first reaction was the one I used to have which led to low self esteem that was indeed not curable through any spiritual practices (the logic, if I realize I'm god, then I will accept myself is complete bullshit) and yes the second reaction is the reaction that I had today and yes, I've never felt more confident and self-assured in my entire life not even close.

It doesn't have to be this way. Every neurodivergency also has advantages. The good news is, that these strengths will correlate with your personal values, since just like personality, your values are also based on your neurodivergance (i knoooow big claim just casually dropped). So for example if you're autistic this means you are really good at unbiased truth seeking which also happens to be important to you since you are here.

@Joseph Maynor Ralston was mentioned! I feel like we are drifting towards a contemplation about a topic that is unrelated to this thread. I will make a new one.

@CARDOZZO Thanks for the new perspective! I think when looking at deals made between countries, it's often hard to tell, wether the deal was fair or not. I'm not saying that China doesn't have it's own interests and it doesn't have leverage over countries but I also want to point out that just bc a country is powerful or has leverage, doesn't mean it is abusing it's power. It's also important to keep in mind, that the west is still secretly at war with communism and spreading propaganda and misinformation. This is from the book "the governance of china" from Xi: "To realize the Chinese Dream, we must pursue peaceful development. We will always follow the path of peaceful development and pursue an opening-up strategy that brings mutual benefits. We will concentrate both on China’s development and on our responsibilities and contributions to the world as a whole. We will bring benefits to both the Chinese people and the people of the rest of the world. The realization of the Chinese Dream will bring the world peace, not turmoil, opportunities, not threats." Of course, one has to treat the words of any politician with skepticism, but I do believe, that they are acting in accordance to these principles Notice how broken the western system is that as soon as people see a country gain power, they automatically assume that country is abusing its power

Nope! China does not colonize or practice imperialism like the west. When they do trade with other countries, they usually make fair deals and don't intervene with their respectice political systems. They don't even fund socialist movements in other countries as far as I know. This is because communist led countries have burned themselves hard in the past from trying to overturn different countries and unlike the west, communists learn from their mistakes. They might snatch back some regions in russia and Taiwan (since it's China) but I'm pretty sure that's it. I trust China way more than any western state

Wouldn't you agree that this is mainly the case because they want the sanctions lifted? You do realize that the sanctions come from the west and not from your government? You need to understand that the west is not your ally. They don't want YOU to profit from the oil. When america installs a puppet regime, sure your situation will improve, since the sanctions are lifted that were unecessary in the first place. But you will be americas bitch just like everybody. You will be heavily propagandized and be expected to be thankful because the american saviours brought you wonderful human rights because that doesn't hurt the profits of anyone and your material situation will still be shit because the opposite would mean that anyone had to actually care about you. Sorry for being so dark. Maybe america and israel will go to hell, then you'll be fine. Woah that was even more cynical sorry

It is important to note that when you are being opressed, you don't have to feel like you have to apologize to the oppressor. They might gaslight you into believing that you are also at fault. This is dangerous. Don't apologize to your oppressors. I'm not saying that you can't forgive them. But if they ruined your life, they ruined your life. Period.

@Karmadhi Thanks for the analysis!

@GroovyGuru Agreed 100% It's the classic Liberal: Terrorism bad! Authoritarianism bad! Dictator bad! vs Leftist: I spare you with boring details and history. Anyways the story begins when the first fish started to walk on land