kenway

UNICEF disagrees. Do you know more than UNICEF? Also, UNICEF have been to Gaza. Have you? It's not about sides. Hamas and Israel are both devils. It's just that one has better weapons than the other.

https://www.unicef.org/press-releases/statement-unicef-deputy-executive-director-ted-chaiban-upon-conclusion-his-visit Full statement from UNICEF - 18th Jan 2024:- GAZA/ NEW YORK, 18 January 2024 - “I have just finished a three-day visit to the Gaza Strip, where I have been able to coordinate with local and international organizations about the emergency response and take stock of humanitarian operations since the last time I was in the Gaza Strip two months ago. But more than that, I was able to meet with children and their families suffering some of the most horrific conditions I have ever seen. “Since my last visit, the situation has gone from catastrophic to near collapse. UNICEF has described the Gaza Strip as the most dangerous place in the world to be a child. We have said this is a war on children. But these truths do not seem to be getting through. Of the nearly 25,000 people reported to have been killed in the Gaza Strip since the escalation in hostilities, up to 70 per cent are reported to be women and children. The killing of children must cease immediately. “On Tuesday, I met an 11-year-old girl called Sama at Al-Nasser Hospital in Khan Younis. She was skipping with friends when they were hit by shrapnel from a bombardment. The shrapnel sliced through Sama’s abdomen, forcing her into surgery to remove her spleen. She is recovering in hospital, isolated from everyone around her because she is now immunocompromised in a war zone full of disease and infection. “10 minutes later I met 13-year-old Ibrahim. He was in a designated shelter with his family, in an area they were told was safe, when everything collapsed around them. Ibrahim’s hand was badly damaged and quickly became infected. Without medicine, gangrene took hold and he ultimately lost his arm during an amputation without anaesthetic. Ibrahim’s mother, Amani, who accompanied him to the south of the strip for life-saving treatment in Al-Nasser asked for help reaching her remaining six children and husband who had remained north of Gaza City. She has not heard from them in two months. “A matter of hours after we left, many families fled Al-Nasser hospital as fighting closed in on the area. “Over 1.9 million people, or nearly 85 per cent of Gaza’s population, is now displaced including many who have been displaced multiple times. Over a million of them are in Rafah, resulting in a patchwork of makeshift shelters and sites that have made the small town nearly unrecognisable. “The sheer mass of civilians on the border is hard to fathom and the conditions they live in are inhumane. Water is scarce and poor sanitation is inescapable. The cold and rain this week created rivers of waste. The little food that is available doesn’t meet children’s unique nutritional needs. As a result, thousands of children are malnourished and sick. “Two months ago, cases of diarrhoea were up 40 per cent from before the escalation in hostilities. By mid-December, 71,000 cases were recorded among children under five, a more than 4000 per cent increase since the war began. “This is nothing short of a staggering decline in conditions for the children of Gaza. If this decline persists, we could see deaths due to indiscriminate conflict compounded by deaths due to disease and hunger. We need a major breakthrough. “This starts with an end to the intense bombardment, which is not only killing thousands, but is also impeding the delivery of aid to survivors. We have to get more trucks in, do so via more crossings, and with far more efficient inspection processes. Before the conflict more than 500 trucks entered the Gaza Strip every day. When I was there in November, about 60 aid trucks a day entered. Now, it is about 130 trucks a day alongside an average of 30 commercial trucks a day. This is with the opening of a second crossing point but it still remains wholly inadequate. We are trying to drip assistance through a straw to meet an ocean of need. “There must be fewer restrictions on the kind of aid we can bring in, such as generators for water pumps and pipes to repair water facilities, which are critical to restore the water and sanitation services essential for people’s survival. “Once aid gets into the Gaza Strip, our ability to distribute it becomes a matter of life and death. It is imperative that access restrictions are lifted, reliable ground communications ensured, and movement of humanitarian supplies facilitated to ensure those who have been without aid for days receive desperately needed assistance. And, we have to get commercial traffic flowing in Gaza, so that markets can reopen and families can be less dependent on relief. “Finally, we need access to the north. The estimated 250,000 to 300,000 people living in north Gaza have no access to clean water and barely any food. In the first two weeks of January, only 7 of 29 planned aid deliveries have successfully reached their destinations in northern Gaza. Not a single UNICEF convoy has accessed the north of the Gaza Strip in 2024. “Where we have access, we can make a difference. I visited one of the two desalination plants in Khan Younis that UNICEF is supporting and that is providing some water to about 250,000 people. I saw children wearing the winter clothes we brought in and families using soap and sanitary products from hygiene kits that have gotten through. “We cannot wait any longer for a humanitarian ceasefire to end the daily killing and injuring of children and their families, enable the urgent delivery of desperately needed aid and the safe and unconditional release of the two remaining Israeli children still held hostage in Gaza. This cannot go on.”

I have asked you one question. It's not that I don't like it, it's just that you're coming at the problem from a position of simplicity and subjectivity, which has the net result of garbled nonsense that doesn't really have any authority or connection to the actualities of the situation, let alone the broader Middle East. For example, how are you even defining the word "terrorist" or "terrorism"? When you say:- "If my mom is living beside terrorists, then it's a matter of time before she gets bombed anyway." You surely have to recognise how ridiculous that sounds. What is your definition of terrorism? Have you considered or factored in that many people in the world regard Israel as the terrorists? Are you even aware that Israel was founded by terrorism? Militant Zionist terrorist groups such as the Irgun, or the Stern Gang, or even the Haganah, most of which simply became parts of the regular Israeli military post 1948, not least the Mossad? What are you thoughts, say, on Israel's bombing of the King David Hotel in 1951, that killed close to 100 people and was achieved while Israeli terrorists were deliberately pretending to be Palestinian Arabs? What are your thoughts on (for example) Israel fighter jets routinely breaking the sound barrier over Gaza City, way before Hamas even came to power, thus generating sonic booms over Palestinian residents at 3 in the morning, literally terrifying them, night after night? Can you perhaps start to understand that your relationship with the word "terrorist" might be a little simplistic? And I haven't got past your first sentence yet. What is your position on Sabra and Shatila, or Beirut 1982, or 2006? Or Cast Lead? How in your opinion might these events have modulated the Palestinian position on how they regard Israelis? What are your opinions on the morality of the Nakba? Or maybe even the Intifada? What is your position on ethnostates in general? Do you support them? If so why? So... it's not really that I don't like what you say, it's more a case that you have a very simplistic and subjective comprehension on the facts, the ignorance of which is literally one of the reasons why this current genocide is taking place right now. Because if you actually knew, then you would be standing very much against it.

With all due respect, this is just paragraph after paragraph of nonsense.

@Bobby_2021 lol so basically what you're saying is that it would be fine to bomb your mom then?

I take your point, and seemingly there's a subjective grey area. In the case of your two examples, for me I would posit that the second example still counts as unethical, the first one not so much. One way you might want to consider it is what would your reaction be if the person in question suddenly realised what you were doing in its entirety. Say for example, she had telepathic powers, and upon realising you were staring at her ass, or upon her realising that you get off from getting high-fives (while receiving a high-five), what would your reaction be upon her discovery? If your immediate reaction is one of guilt or denial then I'd suggest that it was unethical to begin with. In any event, this a bit off topic lol. Better to just get consent properly and then you'll have more of a meaningful connection in the long run.

Oh I definitely agree with you there. That's a whole different level.

By the way @Nivsch I forgot to thank you for posting these videos. I watched them all and enjoyed them. I appreciate that you're trying to demonstrate a dimension to Israel that might not be apparent in this thread, and I empathise that it must be frustrating.

Absolutely correct. But the weird thing is, that a lot of the brainwashed Zionists (even in this thread) are actually decent, compassionate and intelligent people. I don't exclude @Nivsch from that portrayal, who is clearly intelligent and with good heart.

Israeli media are reporting some (very conveniently timed) rocket launches seemingly come from the Egyptian Sinai towards Eilat. This also follows on from previous minor skirmishes between the IDF and the Egyptian military. If Netanyahu is seriously intending to take control of the Egypt / Gaza border (as declared), what effect might this have on Israeli-Egyptian relations? To me, this seems like a prelude to the deliberate establishment of an international humanitarian enclave in the Sinai desert.

I also want to emphasise that many many Europeans and Americans visit both Gaza and the West Bank very frequently for humanitarian purposes. Similarly, through various anti-war / pro-unity demonstrations again in Europe and America, people have an opportunity to brush shoulders with real Palestinians all the time. @Nivsch What is your experience with real Palestinians, and how many times have you visited either Gaza or the West Bank?

Question: How many Gaza kids have you actually ever met?

Disagree. 2 million people are currently on the precipice of extermination. I spent my life up until the present moment fighting Nazis and I'm not going to stop now.

@zazen Yeah I'm pretty sure that's him. I saw the posts a few weeks back. I don't mind engaging with hardened Zionists, but I draw the line when it comes to school-shooter vibes.

Gaza: Latest updates and analysis from Nora-Barrows Friedman and Ali Abunimah. Powerful insights and definitely worth a listen.

https://edition.cnn.com/2024/01/17/middleeast/israel-far-right-gaza-settler-movement-cmd-intl/index.html Quote:- “The general range goes from about 25% who want to re-establish permanent communities, Jewish Israeli communities in Gaza, to somewhere in the 40% range,” she told CNN of several polls conducted in November and December. “That is not a small portion of Israeli society.” There is also an established track record in Israel of politicians pushing seemingly extremist ideas into mainstream conversation, and even into law. Netanyahu last year supported an effort started by a right-wing minister from his own Likud party to push through a law limiting the Supreme Court’s ability to scrutinize legislation, despite months of protests that roiled the nation. That proposal never had majority support, but the Knesset nonetheless passed it into law. The Supreme Court struck down the proposal earlier this month, saying it would deal a “severe and unprecedented blow to the core characteristics of the State of Israel as a democratic state.” “Ideas that often seem very extreme at a certain phase in Israel’s history can over time become increasingly normalized very incrementally – sometimes a little bit below the radar, not exactly hidden, but not exactly advertised,” Scheindlin said of Israeli policymaking. Diana Buttu, a Palestinian human rights lawyer who has served as an adviser to the Palestinian Authority, gives little credence to Netanyahu’s professed opposition to re-establishing settlements in Gaza. “As much as Netanyahu may say that he’s not going to do it, he will ultimately,” she told CNN. “Because we as Palestinians have long learned that they end up finding some sort of excuse – you know, the coalition needs to stay together, whatever. And Palestinians always pay the price for it.”

Front page of New York Times - Wed 17th January 2024

With 85% of residential homes destroyed and with 1.9 million displaced people building up in the southern enclaves, Netanyahu's strategy for the next phase appears to be forced starvation and the deliberate invocation of a humanitarian catastrophe. The trick is simple:- Bring the remainder of the 2 million civilians to the point of near-death, and then effectively blackmail the international community (especially Egypt) to act accordingly, in accepting the Palestinians unto their territories. Netanyahu's bargain will be: "This is no longer our problem. On the one hand you have a genocide. On the other hand you have a holocaust. It's your choice."

.... and on that subject.... Gideon Levy speaking on Democracy Now about the nature of Israeli media. This is what people mean when they use the term "brainwashed" when talking about ordinary Israelis. Courtesy to @Raze for the link.