ryoko

And yeah, the bliss thing is a gimmick. It wears off the moment you start thinking independently and break out of the conformity. You can rack up records of how blissful these people are when you're under the effect of delusions and show it off. None of that is sustainable. The people I've found in that community are some of the most miserable people ever. Sure, they have this clown face when they're in their guru sucking mode. I've seen them and lived with them enough to understand how this is evil. The positioning and manipulation, it's beyond shady. I will tell you this, some of the most blissful moments in my life is because of that thing. But I've paid the price for it dearly. I'm so glad I got out of it in a matter of months.. May be I've sat with it for a year at max, but that's it.

Leo's not coming from a place of "I have to make these humans my minions" Sadhguru is shady af. Just look at the posts in this thread alone. You can see how he's claimed so many people already.

Anyways fuck bliss. Where's your rage, anger, fear, anxiety, geed, lust, sloth, jealousy, sadness. We need all of these. I suggest reading "Laughing in the face of chaos" by Ruda Iande. The guy's very mature, and he doesn't bias you towards bliss or feel good. Some really good pointers on finding your values, very realistic.

Coming to Osho, I do recommend his Book of Secrets as a valid path. He's not gatekeeping siddhis like Sadhguru is. Vigyan Bhairav Tantra is a great source, to pick a practice out of 112 which suits you well. It's not like these yogic practices but more like methods to practice awareness and they're quite simple. Definitely not mental like Shambhavi. Or just do Qi Gong: Yi Jin Jing, Ba Duan Jin Or even hit the gym. Do cardio. Don't listen to Sadhguru and his cult.

I've been in close proximity with a volunteer. And his everyday rituals. There's this pledge, I forget the wording.. "...I will strive my best to fulfil Sadhguru's vision.." more words but it ends like that. My reaction to that was utter contempt. He worships his guru with a photo and some Yantra and other usual stuffs like burning camphor, wearing bhasma. Not against any of that, I get it, rituals are a powerful way to invoke certain stuff. This is a cult. That's when I got into thinking what's the point of Shambhavi. I started connecting the dots. He mentions Shambhavi as "she's a star"..like she's a person, coincidence? I think not. In one of what Sadhguru claims to be his past life where he was a snake guy, his girlfriend's name was Shambhavi, and people killed him with his own snakes for that love affair. That was his first experience into awareness while dying. There's so much crazy stuff than the eye meets. Shambhavi is like a temple that once you're initiated, it's there, the point of your daily practices is to clean the temple, take care of it. It's borrowed bliss. This is quite a common theme in the Hindu culture with local deities. You're submitting something of yours for something in return. And the next is, knowing a community of people who are dedicated to volunteering, and doing the practices. That's where everything broke for me. The way he frames this. He's selling you bliss. I'm not saying it cannot work, but what it will do is destroy your possibility for material growth in big ways, unless you're an asshole who can use this to extract the preferred hormones by submission and use it as a cushion to do horrible things, basic hierarchy we find all over nature and human cultures, work a shitty job which pays well, cope with the money. All spiritual practices have an element to them which destroys your material nature if you're serious about it. I do agree with him that bliss or well being is not something that should be a goal, it should be the default. Had I not known these people intimately I wouldn't have quit this whole thing.

What are you talking about? Humans are carnivores through and through. Even our social dynamics represent something carnivorous. We extract energy from other vertebrates for a living.

This is dark stuff. He's energy harvesting, from the practicioners. It's fine if it didn't come with this nonsense. But it's not. This shit's mental.

Talk about keeping the dogma alive..

I took it from home, during COVID period. It was powerful because of the hype. You expect you're doing something life changing thing. And your body just creates the results. Once you see through it, it's all just a house of cards.

The kriya itself is a mix of normal yoga practices, done in an order. The practice itself has nothing to do with bliss. It's the belief that this practice can change stuff, and the philosophy musings combined by the theoretical lessons, it creates a certain delusional effect. He aims to keep it alive so you keep feeling blissful, or you think you should feel blissful. What he's aiming to do is trigger certain hormones by using a mix of beliefs, yoga and a whole community of sheeps. As for the results, I can confirm they wear off the moment you start thinking on your own.

Shambhavi Mahamudra Kriya is potent as long as you hold the dogma. It's effective at first, then it quickly turns into a mundane exercise. Don't buy into their bliss claims. I recommend doing some actual physical activity instead. Shambhavi isn't in any way sufficient. I got initiated back in 2021, and it was a great experience. But the more I went into this rabbit hole, the more I saw it's true face, I quit the whole thing in a matter of months. Had nothing to do with Sadhguru ever again.

Here, I imply Religion = Blind Belief It's how I've always made sense of the word. "Are you religious?" -> "Do you beleive in something you have no clue about?"

Atheism is a religion @Daniel Balan

Here's something useful. Mental pain is something you can bypass altogether, temporarily, until you get back up on your feet. You're dead, now stop caring about the world. Now focus on the pain, learn to enjoy it, feel it like your death depends on it. Give it enormous energy. If you're not feeling any real mental pain, you should. Because extremes are interesting places to be. Living in the world of thoughts, ideologies, philosophies are the first mistake a human can do.

The truth of the matter is, we have an inefficient system. It works really well for small percentage, moderately well for a big chunk and really not well for the rest. And the work involved in shifting to a better place in the spectrum and maintaining it is arbitrary in the sense that people are different and you can't create what you aren't meant for. It's really not unfair in the real sense, it's mostly inefficient. It's not run by mechanical truths or mathematical rules, it's all very much arbitrary. Biases are how we navigate the world. Feeling good for being at the top is a response the system wants you to have, and so is the opposite response. You're programmed to feel bad when you're not playing the game well. It's not something you can really change. You can try all sorts of things; no amount of mystical experience can really fix it. Especially if you have certain biases against living an ascetic life. And the culture around mostly doesn't tolerate monkhood. Every retreat into the personal space of philosophies like misanthropy, efilism, anti-natalism will consequently make the game more meaningless and harder while giving you small hit of dopamine trashing the system. Spirituality is a scam. We live in a material world. You need food and shelter, you're not gonna transcend your body and stop pooping. Same goes for the mind, your psyche keeps you alive, you feel what you feel thanks to the psyche. It's not like you're in the position to influence how it functions. Nobody can. We are the body and mind. And it's seriously demented to push people into "feeling the spirit, meditation"/"you're not your mind or body" even as a concept. As for suicide. I agree with the anti-natalist philosophy. But what people get wrong is, if you accept that bringing children in the world is immoral and bad, you basically saying your own existence is a mistake and you'd rather die. That's quite flawed as a logic, but our psyche is likely to interpret it as such no matter how logical we are. Once you're alive, you have an interest to keep living and in turn propagating life. Logic isn't how humans and society functions. This is why almost all frameworks to understand humans through logic fails. Spiral Dynamics is a good example. The philosophy is dangerous in the sense that if taken seriously you can turn really anti life and worse you become some vegan and stop nourishing yourself. We're cannibalistic carnivores, instead of flesh, we feed on others' energy, while keeping them alive. It's how we've come to survive in the last few centuries. Life and it's way of functioning is messy and inefficient, there's no real fix, other than having a good experiential reality. If you feel good eating meat, that's a win. Stop trying to function logically.

IDK why people give totally incompatible advice when someone asks for a way out of their suffering. birth is not easy, it's hard work. 10 months of labor, decade long nurturing of the child.

LLMs aren't stage any. It's just a plant they grew which caters to every spiral. And badly so for stuff too beyond Orange. LLMs aren't truly smart as in Stage Yellow. It's simply synthesizing available information. Also people aren't color. Complexity, adopted values, identities, it's not something one can map and be done with. Spiral Dynamics isn't useful in analyzing humans or fringe groups. It's only useful on a macro level, of large populations, not at all useful for outliers and exceptions.

Those who had children and is somewhat "functional" will reject these ideologies, because experience makes them "feel" otherwise. It's essential for their survival. You have to feel good while having children and looking after them. There's no point debating anti-natalism to most of the world, when having children is like the default, and it's a lot of work to get into a non default frame. I love non-existence. I'd rather never be born. The best gift I can give to my children is non existence, by never making them in the first place. I love life, I enjoy life despite all the suffering(of others). If that's a bucket of fun, non-existence is an ocean of fun, infinite. What I call life is inclusive of the non existence. May be that's why I love it, and I see earthly life as a pain in the matrix, what's the point of pointless distractions.

"Life purpose" is a luxury in that sense. Human Function will turn into mass slavery which is called jobs in the capitalist society. The frame that your function has to align with being will cause massive conflicts because most can't afford it simply. Now I understand why most people discourage you from pursuing what you love. This is not a universal mandate. It's a class privelage: the degree to which you can maintain integrity between being and function depends on how much structural freedom you have.

We need to properly define life purpose in this context. If we take it verbatim it makes no sense because life has no purpose. LP here is an attempt to align your social self with your true self. Social self will always be compromised in many ways and these two selves will always have some conflict. We need to understand social self is a construct we keep for survival. It's easier to survive when this construct exists. You have to contribute to society to survive without too much trouble and it's in no way efficient, many people struggle to survive regardless of this society's existence, hierarchies exist, so many disgusting dynamics all around, it's simply an efficiency problem, it's best you don't take this personally or get too identified with survival process and calling it "life". We have little control over how the society will turn out. You're just one in 10 billion. No matter how much power or money you amass, all of it is simply a dynamics within the social sphere. A planet getting nuked by the will of a single person, everyone on the planet is equally responsible, because social implies collective, material. Meaning no amount of control will truly amount to anything. Life is a heavily misused word("that's life", "life's hard", "life purpose"), I don't like to use it for some activity you do while alive. Life's what's within, and life has no purpose. It simply exists. (and do not confuse my usage of "true self" with life, it's just your internal reality) I'm trying to find a more clear word for this concept: Societal Directive may be more accurate. But now we've entered the territory of how much people are disconnected from their true self. And societal directive can become a misnomer easily. It gets solved if you are integrous. "Integrity is the measure of alignment between being and function." Maintaining integrity doesn’t mean achieving perfection or escaping compromise — it means continually recalibrating the social self to remain coherent with the true self. Another term is Human Function: almost clinical in tone, detached, suggesting it's what you do as a species. Whatever we do, we can enjoy it, feel annoyed at times, but ultimately it's not required. Life doesn't require some function, survival does. So “life purpose,” properly understood, is not about achieving something external but maintaining integrity — keeping your function coherent with your being. In this sense, “life purpose” is not something to achieve but something to maintain: an ongoing coherence between inner truth and outer expression.

Leo this outfit really adds 20 years of age to you.

There are incompatible selves. The aghori in Vegas dilemma is unsolvable. The aghori can exist in Vegas only as a circus freak. This is why choosing one over the other is crucial. My own fantasies of getting different incompatible blends was the first fantasy which needed to dissolve.

Misanthropy, Anti-Natalism, Efilism, Extinctionism I've come across these philosophises recently, they stand for different things, while all have a deep problems with human society. Anti Natalism is against bringing children into the world, a world of humans as we currently have. All of these philosophises are anti-life in many regards. Although I'm not an ideology person, I'm ideeply misanthropic. I mostly dislike everything about humanity. I don't care about participating in human society or improving it. Life Purpose makes no sense to me. Mastery does, but I am deeply content with nothing. I find society to be an obstacle to my simply being. At the same time, I'm competitive, and care about achievements which are deeply personal. My question is, how are people so efficiently unaware of what's around. I understand Cognitive Polyphasia but I'm badly wired for that. It have it's advantages. But also makes being a hypocrite harder. I don't mean hypocrite in a moralising way. It is what it is. So my question is, how to be a hypocrite efficiently. P.S - I know this is human complexity and we call this process integration and not "becoming a hypocrite". I just happen to like the phrase.

I've contemplated this a lot, and I've come to this conclusion. Expecting meditation to help with your goals is fundamentally incompatible. It serves the opposite function. My mystic nature doesn't help with goals, sure it gives me an edge, but the cost is total dissolution of all goals. This has taught me authenticity in the last years and find what truly matters to me. And this has come with a great cost. My nature thrives on immersion of whatever I'm doing, be it mysticism or goal pursuits. Cognitive Polyphasia can't function alongside with high awareness. It's just a survival tool for mundane activities. Trying to weaponize it completely defeats the point. Integration is when you've gained the experiences which have irreversibly changed you and you function without conflicts or without trying to defend an ideology.

dude, what kind of servers are you trolling