Frank Yang on TOE with Curt Jaimungal Interview

[Thought Art]

3 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

I can sympathize with being fed up with being told "you ain't shit" by some random dudes on the internet day-in and day-out. Imagine if the forum was a corporation and Leo was the CEO and people went up to him regularly to say "you ain't shit". Those people would disappear pretty quickly.

On the other hand, this is a forum, and returning the abuse in a public manner like this sets a bad example. It puts the law-abiding forum members in a double-bind: "should I follow the guidelines or should I follow the owner? The owner regularly calls people idiots, so why can't I?" And also, it just makes people confused and forces them to make up elaborate excuses for behavior that they know is not ok.

So what should Leo do? Shut down the forum? Go for a walk? Meditate? That's up to him, but I will keep making the same point every time something like this happens.

Good points. Nothing I say is gonna change anyone’s mind. I personally don’t care if he occasionally cusses out some assholes. 
 

At the same time, I am trying to observe everything objectively. 

[Gesundheit2]

24 minutes ago, Thought Art said:

People think they can come to a forum a guy runs, verbally abuse him all they want and if he reacts they get upset, play victim.

Although, notice who started the verbal abuse in this thread and who reacted to it. It's the other way around than you're describing. Leo barged in and insulted Frank first, and then people started reacting to it. Then Leo doubled-down, and they doubled-down too until things came to this.

None of this would have happened if Leo behaved differently, optimally more smoothly.

[Carl-Richard]

Just now, Nilsi said:

Ok that's fair lol.

Down with the guidelines!!!

*cocks ban hammer* "whatchu say?" 

[Carl-Richard]

4 minutes ago, Gesundheit2 said:

Although, notice who started the verbal abuse in this thread and who reacted to it. It's the other way around than you're describing. Leo barged in and insulted Frank first, and then people started reacting to it. Then Leo doubled-down, and they doubled-down too until things came to this.

None of this would have happened if Leo behaved differently, optimally more smoothly.

But then you could make the argument that he is more inclined to shit on people like Frank because people are shitting on him all the time. It's a complex circular relationship, like all abusive relationships 

Edited March 17, 2023 by Carl-Richard

[Gesundheit2]

1 minute ago, Carl-Richard said:

But then you could make the argument that he is more inclined to shit on people like Frank because people is constantly shitting on him all the time. It's a complex circular relationship, like all abusive relationships

Where's the role of consciousness and virtue? An eye for an eye only makes the whole world blind.

Besides, if you know yourself well and you are confident in what you know, no criticism should shake you. If you have the truth, falsehood cannot hurt you.

[Carl-Richard]

3 minutes ago, Gesundheit2 said:

Where's the role of consciousness and virtue? An eye for an eye only makes the whole world blind.

Besides, if you know yourself well and you are confident in what you know, no criticism should shake you. If you have the truth, falsehood cannot hurt you.

I agree. I'm on your side.

Edited March 17, 2023 by Carl-Richard

[Yimpa]

5 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

On the other hand, this is a forum, and returning the abuse in a public manner like this sets a bad example. It puts the law-abiding forum members in a double-bind: "should I follow the guidelines or should I follow the owner? The owner regularly calls people idiots, so why can't I?" And also, it just makes people confused and forces them to make up elaborate excuses for behavior that they know is not ok.

From my experience, it can go beyond making up excuses for certain behaviors. You can also become profoundly aware of these behaviors directly. Most of us have missed that simple step, understandably.

[Thought Art]

@Gesundheit2 who is for frank?

[Yimpa]

13 minutes ago, Gesundheit2 said:

None of this would have happened if Leo behaved differently, optimally more smoothly.

This is a huge distraction from looking deeper. You make this statement as if reality should have been a different way. 

[Jacob Morres]

it's valid and understandable based off the stuff he has been putting up with

One solution is inner child work and conscious boundaries 

Edited March 17, 2023 by Jacob Morres

[Nemra]

When you start to think independently you will know why Leo reacts this way. Also, he has to protect his teachings, like most gurus and he's honest about it. So what if he curses. You haven't seen people who constantly do that and are not intelligent. And it's not like you are his slaves. You can take a break from actualized as long as you want. If anything, he teaches how to be independent in all domains.

The important thing is what he offers.

[Inliytened1]

Bottom line is if you don't support the work get lost.  We got rid of this round of haters - but more will come.  Honestly I lost patience years ago which is honestly why I am a more passive mod.  I probably couldn't deal with all the criticism like he does. It has to weigh on anyone after enough time.  Especially when the stuff here actually points to awakening and is valid. 

 

Edited March 18, 2023 by Inliytened1

[Globalcollective]

11 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

It's not required, but it could happens. In the case of Leo, it is clearly seen that it is very important for him to be above everyone else. It is irritating? a lot. We each have our flaws. but that does not mean that it has broken the barriers of the apparent and has gone deeper than anyone else in the history of humanity. Or perhaps there are others who have delved deeper, but do not spread. he is still human, with what that entails: ego

@Breakingthewall Don't think for one second there not other hardcore psychonauts who have gone as deep or deeper than Leo. I have met loads, some do things with psychedelics you wouldnt dare. But one thing I have noticed with all of them is they loose sense of reality in this world as a human, it's hardly something you would want to replicate.

At the end of the day some of the stuff he is saying should raise alarm bells. "I am the most awakened person in the whole of humanity" when in reality I take a shit load of psychedelics. What is so special in that? it's hardly an achievement is it? granted there are intense as hell but anyone can do it and you can easily encourage people to pursue awakening through psychedelics without being arrogant and mean about it, if anything that will just put people off and now with some of the posts recently people are going to see this as a cult with a narcissistic leader, he is fucking up and I hope he returns to normal soon

[Inliytened1]

19 minutes ago, Globalcollective said:

@Breakingthewall Don't think for one second there not other hardcore psychonauts who have gone as deep or deeper than Leo. I have met loads, some do things with psychedelics you wouldnt dare. But one thing I have noticed with all of them is they loose sense of reality in this world as a human, it's hardly something you would want to replicate.

At the end of the day some of the stuff he is saying should raise alarm bells. "I am the most awakened person in the whole of humanity" when in reality I take a shit load of psychedelics. What is so special in that? it's hardly an achievement is it? granted there are intense as hell but anyone can do it and you can easily encourage people to pursue awakening through psychedelics without being arrogant and mean about it, if anything that will just put people off and now with some of the posts recently people are going to see this as a cult with a narcissistic leader, he is fucking up and I hope he returns to normal soon

I used to always say psychedelics were cheating for the ones not genetically prone to meditation awakening them.  But it's really not the case.   All that matters is the shift in consciousness.   The bragging will fade as he ages- and actually he won't even care about this place at that point.  When he stops caring about that he won't care about anything.  So let him still cling to this world.  

[DrugsBunny]

14 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Nobody here is Awake or has one clue what Awake is.

Humble yourself or ban. I will not entertain your shit here. You can fuck around with me on any other topic on this forum. But if you dare question me on AWAKENING, you are gone from here. I will not allow you to corrupt my teachings. You fucking devil. Shame on you. How dare you! You fucking spiritual rat. You have no clue what I teach.

If you try to corrupt my teachings I will fucking kill you.

Nobody here is AWAKE. And if you try to claim otherwise, banned. I am done being nice to you. You will respect my teachings or you will lose me forever.

I tend to lend merit to your perspective beyond all others on spiritual matters, but it'd be easier to pay credence to your standpoint if I had a better understanding of your temperament.

Here's my main concern.

I have yet to see anyone blatantly cross the line in response to your unique vantage point. Obviously the user you admonished was brazenly lambasting your conduct, but you necessarily invite such a response when you insist on this abrasive approach you've adopted. I can understand there being a defensible rationale for this approach, but why would the predictable arrogance of ignorant people warrant such a harsh response when you've repeatedly stressed how nobody is truly awake but yourself? If awakening as you see it is so impossible to achieve, who is even being harmed when your teachings are disrespected?

You've stated yourself that the Truth in it's most radical form can only be discovered independently, and it is a "trap" to give away your authority to other human beings, so why are you so concerned with your teachings being maligned? The type of person who could conceivably stand a chance at realizing the awakenings you speak of would surely not be hindered by the obfuscations of those who berate your teachings.

[Loveeee]

15 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Nobody here is AWAKE. And if you try to claim otherwise, banned.

 

[Gesundheit2]

11 hours ago, Yimpa said:

This is a huge distraction from looking deeper. You make this statement as if reality should have been a different way. 

The reality is that some things were said and they were uncalled for and could have been delivered better. That is the deeper level everyone should be looking at. We are here to improve ourselves after all, right?

[Gesundheit2]

9 hours ago, Inliytened1 said:

Bottom line is if you don't support the work get lost.  We got rid of this round of haters - but more will come.  Honestly I lost patience years ago which is honestly why I am a more passive mod.  I probably couldn't deal with all the criticism like he does. It has to weigh on anyone after enough time.  Especially when the stuff here actually points to awakening and is valid. 

Why can't this challenge be considered a domain and more like an opportunity for inter-personal skills work and development?

[Osaid]

1 hour ago, DrugsBunny said:

but you necessarily invite such a response when you insist on this abrasive approach you've adopted. I can understand there being a defensible rationale for this approach, but why would the predictable arrogance of ignorant people warrant such a harsh response

Just because something is predictable doesn't mean it should be tolerated.

1 hour ago, DrugsBunny said:

but why would the predictable arrogance of ignorant people warrant such a harsh response when you've repeatedly stressed how nobody is truly awake but yourself? If awakening as you see it is so impossible to achieve, who is even being harmed when your teachings are disrespected?

Awakening is not impossible.

And also, practicing authority and calling out other people on false ideas doesn't have much to do with only Leo being awake. That's something that extends even into normal everyday life. So, most people are harmed when you're not taught to watch out for that.

In life, you are constantly swayed and gaslighted by the loose opinions of others. That's why practicing authority and calling people out is so important.

1 hour ago, DrugsBunny said:

You've stated yourself that the Truth in it's most radical form can only be discovered independently, and it is a "trap" to give away your authority to other human beings, so why are you so concerned with your teachings being maligned? The type of person who could conceivably stand a chance at realizing the awakenings you speak of would surely not be hindered by the obfuscations of those who berate your teachings.

He IS practicing that exact authority you speak of when he calls people out for berating his teachings. And people will learn from that. Someone who has a chance at realizing awakenings would first have to learn to practice their own authority. Many people fall into that trap, and it's a massive one, so of course he would stand against it and exemplify how to do so.
 

[bambi]

17 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

@Flyboy Banned.

For being such a fool.

I will ban every last fool from here. So watch out.

Do not play games with me.

Nobody here is Awake or has one clue what Awake is.

Humble yourself or ban. I will not entertain your shit here. You can fuck around with me on any other topic on this forum. But if you dare question me on AWAKENING, you are gone from here. I will not allow you to corrupt my teachings. You fucking devil. Shame on you. How dare you! You fucking spiritual rat. You have no clue what I teach.

If you try to corrupt my teachings I will fucking kill you.

Nobody here is AWAKE. And if you try to claim otherwise, banned. I am done being nice to you. You will respect my teachings or you will lose me forever.

My compassion is for Truth, not for your shit.

Do not be confused. This is said not out of ego, or to abuse you, but because it must be said in order to get your mind to understand the seriousness of what is being taught. If I don't yell at you, you are not going to take this seriously enough. I don't enjoy having to do this. I do this as a last resort when all other means have failed. If the nice approach worked, it would have worked, but it didn't work. So here we are. Nice is a luxury we can afford most of the time. But not HERE. Not on this issue! This issue is unlike any other issue. This is not like any other disagreement. On this hinges your whole understanding of God. I am here to ensure that you take things seriously enough to reach a level of God that no one else on this planet can guide you to. That is my role here. My role is not to be your friend. I am not your therapist either. I am here to uphold a standard. The HIGHEST standard. In order to provoke you into pursing the highest levels of Consciousness. This is very serious. Your emotions cannot matter here.

I want you to seriously contemplate all this. There is a very deep lesson here for you.

 

How lost are you to threaten people with violence? You will kill people? Your in the bottom 2% of humans and their behaviour. You are getting worse year by year

The way you treat and communicate to other humans is disgusting, but thats not the worst part, its your denial and attitude: you show 0 remorse

Deep suffering and isolation will become your friend