OBEler

Ego death on Ketamin vs other psychedelica

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I ask me, how they differentiate? I mean ego death not on high dose but normal dose. How is there a difference between ego death on Keta vs on lsd for example? Is ia Keta ego death/transcendence more smooth and gendle? 

I never experienced an ego death so I consider to go smooth into my first one

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6 hours ago, OBEler said:

I ask me, how they differentiate? I mean ego death not on high dose but normal dose. How is there a difference between ego death on Keta vs on lsd for example? Is ia Keta ego death/transcendence more smooth and gendle? 

I never experienced an ego death so I consider to go smooth into my first one

Ummmm ego death is loss of identification with the body I don't believe there is anything smooth about it for a first timer.


The same strength, the same level of desire it takes to change your life, is the same strength, the same level of desire it takes to end your life. Notice you are headed towards one or the other. - Razard86

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Posted (edited)

Ego death is romanticised far too much in the psychedelic community. 

Ketamine can lead to ego death just like other psychedelics but what matters is the subsequent event; Ketamine generally takes you to the void state but is also very calming which allows you to get comfortable with the void and realise it isn't something to fear. That in and of itself is extremely valuable, however after a certain point is no longer important. 

Psychedelics on the other hand take you to pretty much all the other aspects of an enlightened peak experience following ego death; unity state/interconnectedness, unconditional love, the Godhead and Infinite potentiality (as well as infinite manifestation). Ketamine lacks a lot of the divinity that comes with the territory, but it could be especially useful early on.

That being said combining small amounts of Ket with psychedelics is just another level lol, but this isn't for everyone.

Edited by Ry4n

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You don’t want to have an ego death. You might think you do but you don’t. Ketamine is more difficult than psychedelics like LSD and mushrooms ime. 


"You Create Magic" 

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@Flowerfaeiry oh why Do you see ego death as a negative event? Can you elaborate? And why Do you think ketamin more difficult? I heard it is almost always positiv experience (but maybe only if you have no ego death with it) 

@Razard86 there must be a way to have it smooth. For example ego death just for some seconds. Or ego death with the Mdma feeling of acceptance and so on

 

 

 

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@OBEler 

@Razard86 put it well. I think you might be romanticizing the ego death a bit. Difficult psychedelic experiences are some of the worst times I’ve been through. When I didn’t  have the proper tools and maturity to integrate my hard experiences it became more difficult for me to move forward in life. Taking psychedelics and having experience after experience without any integration is another form of addiction. 
 

When I had an “ego death” there was no controlling it. It just happens and it is terrible. 


"You Create Magic" 

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31 minutes ago, Flowerfaeiry said:

@OBEler 

@Razard86 put it well. I think you might be romanticizing the ego death a bit. Difficult psychedelic experiences are some of the worst times I’ve been through. When I didn’t  have the proper tools and maturity to integrate my hard experiences it became more difficult for me to move forward in life. Taking psychedelics and having experience after experience without any integration is another form of addiction. 
 

When I had an “ego death” there was no controlling it. It just happens and it is terrible. 

@Flowerfaeiry

That's interesting what do you find terrible about it? I think it becomes terrible if you have resistence to the ego death, requires surrending to the experience but again, everyones egos are different and some probably have a huge fear of death when faced with it in the moment. I don't think mine does as it feels like more of a natural experience. It is interesting how others react to psychedelics though. 

I have had ego death on several occasions during different trips and found it incredibly liberating and freeing. I think the only time I got really scared was on 5 meo but that kind of felt beyond ego death. More of a god-realization kind of effect.

I recently had an ego death smoking weed and it was so peaceful. I found natural insights just came to me because the "ego" was no longer running my reality doing its same behaviours. 

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Every time I’ve truly been faced with a loss of everything I think I am, I get scared. Nothing pretty about it. 


"You Create Magic" 

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1 hour ago, Flowerfaeiry said:

Every time I’ve truly been faced with a loss of everything I think I am, I get scared. Nothing pretty about it. 

What happened after you lost everything you thought you are?

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@Batman coming back from those experiences did feel good and enlightening but I didn’t know how to apply it to my life and ended up feeling more disconnected because I was still living in the “3D”. Now that the path of integration is more clear I am able to take those experiences into my daily life in a different way. 


"You Create Magic" 

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Posted (edited)

Do you want to know how an ego death feels like for some seconds?

Just become completely aware of your surroundings and/or you inner body. 

Engulf yourself completely in the sensations, without any interpretation. It's actually pretty easy.

That's no ego. 

During psychedelics you get pushed into this state. 

Right now you can sense how your mind will fight against your awareness. Thoughts will come up to pull you back into ego thinking. 

The stress between pushing you into the presence and pulling you back into thinking is what can be challenging. 

Now you have all the cards of the table, what it needs to have a terrible experience versus a beautiful experience. 

Edited by Vynce

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Posted (edited)

@Vynce I cannot experience ego death with this exercise. Thats because background thinking is not in my control and subtle. Cannot switch off

 

Any other idea how I can get a Taste of ego death? 

 

Edited by OBEler

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On 8/11/2022 at 3:33 AM, OBEler said:

@Flowerfaeiry oh why Do you see ego death as a negative event? Can you elaborate? And why Do you think ketamin more difficult? I heard it is almost always positiv experience (but maybe only if you have no ego death with it) 

@Razard86 there must be a way to have it smooth. For example ego death just for some seconds. Or ego death with the Mdma feeling of acceptance and so on

 

 

 

When I had ego death it was equivalent to a terrorist strapping a bomb inside my body... and me exploding from the inside out. My ego death was an explosion of consciousness that sent me to a void....and I became an infinite puzzle piece that could shapeshift. Lol the puzzle had little arms that waved at me and looked at me. As I thought things it would change shape to fit that and asked me questions.

It was the scariest moment of my entire life and I have been in 3 head on collision car accidents. Ego death is great for showing you that you are not the body... but....that crap is scary as hell. I'm lucky I'm a calm person in general and don't have issues with trauma. If you are a person who holds grudges, stay away from an ego death. That crap would give you PTSD. I am immune to PTSD because I don't have an issue with accepting things (it could change if I ever go backwards) but if you can't let stuff go.... and ego death can give you PTSD.


The same strength, the same level of desire it takes to change your life, is the same strength, the same level of desire it takes to end your life. Notice you are headed towards one or the other. - Razard86

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@Razard86 Jep that sounds total scary..dont know how to live my life if I would see this..And because of this I want a soft, smooth ego death.

Ego death ruins my psychedelic trips. I am always scared that this event will happen any second during the trip.Before I knew about ego death psychedelic trips were so much fun..now it is deadly serious

how did your ego death happened? And how many days did you needed to recover from this event?

 

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3 hours ago, OBEler said:

Thats because background thinking is not in my control and subtle. Cannot switch off

 

So you notice there is a subtle background thinking? Thats YOU "formlessness" noticing the faint structures of you "the Ego". Keep going, the split between awareness and thinking will become bigger and bigger. You can have hundreds of little ego deaths or "Satori's" per day with that awareness about the subtle voice in your head ;)

Just notice it and notice the stillness, in which the voice speaks. This stillness - Thats YOU!

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2 hours ago, OBEler said:

Jep that sounds total scary..dont know how to live my life if I would see this..And because of this I want a soft, smooth ego death.

Ego death ruins my psychedelic trips. I am always scared that this event will happen any second during the trip.Before I knew about ego death psychedelic trips were so much fun..now it is deadly serious

how did your ego death happened? And how many days did you needed to recover from this event?

Stop it! 

Your ego does not want to die. It's only natural. But you will build your own hell by believing this fear is genuinely yours. YOU are not the ego. 

Totally disidentification with thoughts is the death of the ego, it cannot survive when its structures (thoughts) get noticed by you. Your only job is to notice your thoughts and feel your authentic deeper, underlying, still Self. If you can do that, no psychedelics or mystical experience will EVER give you fear. It will only you give endless love for free. 

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@Vynce Oh damn that would be so great. Do you really talk from experience? You also had ego deaths on psychedelics so that you can compare?

Ok I will further try to notice its structure. Starting with meditation

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Just now, OBEler said:

@Vynce Oh damn that would be so great. Do you really talk from experience? You also had ego deaths on psychedelics so that you can compare?

Ok I will further try to notice its structure. Starting with meditation

Ego death on psychedelics is exactly the same like without.

The way there can be a little dramatic. But only if you are firmly identified with your thought structures as you. 

Meditation is good. Watch your thoughts and see how they trick you into making more thoughts ;)

Ingenious tricks at play there. Don't believe your thoughts. 

Be conscious of them and then conscious about your surroundings, the sounds, the colors, your feelings inside the body AND of course your internal voice creeping up again saying: "wow sounds and colors are so ordinary I cannot do something with them - do something else!".

That's the trick - the voice wants you to use it. The ego wants to be used. 

Don't worry about the ego, it won't go anywhere, even if you have thousands of ego deaths. just sit there and notice what is happening. 

Thats the most important aspect of life, you will figure out why without me ;)

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Posted (edited)

5 hours ago, OBEler said:

@Razard86 Jep that sounds total scary..dont know how to live my life if I would see this..And because of this I want a soft, smooth ego death.

Ego death ruins my psychedelic trips. I am always scared that this event will happen any second during the trip.Before I knew about ego death psychedelic trips were so much fun..now it is deadly serious

how did your ego death happened? And how many days did you needed to recover from this event?

 

I didn't need any days to recover it was the greatest moment of my entire life because it validated everything Leo said. It motivated me to want to research awareness even more. It also showed me that Fear is the biggest joke in reality....you can't die so fear is an illusion. You are infinity. Reality is imagination etc. etc. 

My only issue with fear....is I wish I could turn it off lol, because its an involuntary reaction, it just happens through no involvement from you. So basically when fear happens, you need to lean into it and just accept it. Once you have ego death....you are just there safe and sound with nothing to worry about. Its why you need the a theoretical understanding of what is happening so you can ground yourself. If you think you have that, then when the fear comes and it happens you are gonna be like really? Why was I ever afraid? Then you will laugh.

Now what did traumatize me for awhile was the kundalini awakening because I kept seeing visons and reality kept collapsing and I couldn't control it. I couldn't even go to sleep...and went without sufficient sleep for like a week and started losing my mind lol. That was way worse than any psychedelic. Psychedelic can open your chakras and give you a spiritual awakening so understand that as well.

Edited by Razard86

The same strength, the same level of desire it takes to change your life, is the same strength, the same level of desire it takes to end your life. Notice you are headed towards one or the other. - Razard86

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5 hours ago, OBEler said:

@Vynce Oh damn that would be so great. Do you really talk from experience? You also had ego deaths on psychedelics so that you can compare?

Ok I will further try to notice its structure. Starting with meditation

He isn't speaking from experience, nor is it the same as what he is saying, depending on how you define an ego death,

Having no-thought or access concentration level of absorption is not the same as ego-death in my book.

Ego-death is when you literallly die, you the thing cognizing this you will die as real as any death you imagine, and you will go to/absorb to/merge with some fucked up dimension that if you haveny experienced is incommunicable. Thats full ego death to me. In my experience, I became some bright white/yellow tint  plane of existence that simultaneously felt like my whole being was stretched across the universe but also the same size of an atom, YMMV

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