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Ragib Ashraf

Serotonin Hypothesis of Depression Debunked

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The theory of serotonin or other biochemical imbalances being the cause of depression has been hugely shattered by a new “umbrella” study from UCL. 
 

Apparently there’s no empirical link between specific biochemical levels in one’s brain and depression. The problem is far more complex than a single neurotransmitter’s concentrations being responsible for it. 

We blindly worship SSRI’s on the basis of authority. The lit review also included a double-blind placebo study that showed how the effects of SSRI’s are largely placebos. 

There’s much to say about this. What are the implications regarding pharmaceutical capitalism, mental health, the psychology of individual and collective authority, the brain, the nature of emotions, science, medicine, etc.? 
 

Article:

https://www.ucl.ac.uk/news/2022/jul/analysis-depression-probably-not-caused-chemical-imbalance-brain-new-study

 

Actual study:

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41380-022-01661-0

 

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Cheers


"Just a spoonful of sugar helps the medicine go down"   --   Marry Poppins

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Posted (edited)

On 7/24/2022 at 3:29 AM, Ragib Ashraf said:

The theory of serotonin or other biochemical imbalances being the cause of depression has been hugely shattered by a new “umbrella” study from UCL. 
 

Apparently there’s no empirical link between specific biochemical levels in one’s brain and depression. The problem is far more complex than a single neurotransmitter’s concentrations being responsible for it. 

We blindly worship SSRI’s on the basis of authority. The lit review also included a double-blind placebo study that showed how the effects of SSRI’s are largely placebos. 

There’s much to say about this. What are the implications regarding pharmaceutical capitalism, mental health, the psychology of individual and collective authority, the brain, the nature of emotions, science, medicine, etc.? 
 

Article:

https://www.ucl.ac.uk/news/2022/jul/analysis-depression-probably-not-caused-chemical-imbalance-brain-new-study

 

Actual study:

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41380-022-01661-0

 

Even if Correcting the chemical imbalance enables the mentally ill to feel better, it's still bad because they would be reliant or addicted to such drugs until death. Such drugs don't cure, they just mask the problem. It's similar to smoking, taking meth and drinking alcohol to feel ok. 

Chemical imbalance is a result of genetics, sustained or prolonged childhood abuse or trauma. Also a result of bad mindset and enviroment. 

Edited by jimwell

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11 hours ago, jimwell said:

Even if Correcting the chemical imbalance enables the mentally ill to feel better, it's still bad because they would be reliant or addicted to such drugs until death. Such drugs don't cure, they just mask the problem. It's similar to smoking, taking meth and drinking alcohol to feel ok. 

Chemical imbalance is a result of genetics, sustained or prolonged childhood abuse or trauma. Also a result of bad mindset and enviroment. 

well said ^^


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Posted (edited)

10 hours ago, Michael569 said:

well said ^^

Thanks! I'm glad that you see what I see. :) 

Edited by jimwell

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22 hours ago, jimwell said:

Even if Correcting the chemical imbalance enables the mentally ill to feel better, it's still bad because they would be reliant or addicted to such drugs until death. Such drugs don't cure, they just mask the problem. It's similar to smoking, taking meth and drinking alcohol to feel ok. 

Chemical imbalance is a result of genetics, sustained or prolonged childhood abuse or trauma. Also a result of bad mindset and enviroment. 

You don't take pain killers? Has it been proven that people who take anti depressants are less likely to recover or seek recovery from depression? 

Interesting article.

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@jimwell there are people who say antidepressant saved their lives. If i know well the average patients takes it for few years or months then with the help of the doctor they decrease the dose gradually.

There are people who have other illnesses and have to take their pill everyday whats the problem with that?

 

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Bruh the effects of that study are potentially massive.

Although I think they'll be a lot of people in society who'll be working to silence the results.

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On 7/26/2022 at 3:44 AM, Chrisd said:

You don't take pain killers? Has it been proven that people who take anti depressants are less likely to recover or seek recovery from depression? 

I take pain killers when I have a toothache. But having a toothache is very different from having extreme anxiety, depression, schizophrenia, and other mental-emotional diseases.

I used to suffer from extreme anxiety (OCD, GAD, BDD, agoraphobia) and depression. I initially went to a few psychiatrists and took SSRIs and other prescription drugs. I didn't feel better after a few months. So, I decided to stop seeing my psychiatrists and stop taking their drugs. I continued smoking and drinking alcohol instead. I was a cigarette and alcohol addict for 13 years. Now you have an idea how broken I was.

I found drinking alcohol to be therapeutic and made me feel better. I continued getting drunk every night for many years until the alcohol started to seriously lose its "healing" effects. My mental-emotional problems became worse and I knew I would die via self-murder or a sudden heart attack as a result of extreme mental-emotional pain if I continued what I had been doing for many years.

So, I decided to stop being an alcohol and cigarette addict, and decided to focus on exploring my internal world, especially my childhood years to understand myself better. I recovered many horrifying and traumatic childhood experiences and realized I was extremely abused by my own father. I did introspection work for many years until things became clear to me. I researched about healing trauma and read a few books. I was not satisfied with the authors' insights and recommendations. I became even more depressed and hopeless because there was nobody out there who could help me. I even thought about murdering myself a few times, to be honest.

But I decided to continue my life and heal my extremely damaged soul. After a few months of introspection and contemplation, I was able to design my own self-therapy. I did my own self-therapy for a few years until I felt I had become the real me. It feels very good and genuine so I know it's the real me. The broken me was very different from the real (healthy) me. 

The post below is a result of my direct experience and self-observation.

I healed without any help from any psychiatrist or psychotherapist. I also healed without taking their SSRIs and other prescription drugs. I provided more details about me and the things I did to demonstrate that I speak from direct experience. It's not just my opinion or speculation.   

I know that not everybody can be their own therapist. They need to start with seeing a psychiatrist or therapist and taking prescription drugs. But if you really want to seriously heal your soul, there will come a point in time when you need to learn to be your own therapist and stop taking prescription drugs. It is similar to self-actualization, in the sense that at one point in time, you need to stop relying on professors, authors, and intellectuals to obtain the highest wisdom. You need to do it yourself.  

 

19 hours ago, ShardMare said:

there are people who say antidepressant saved their lives.

There are also many people who say SSRIs or antidepressants did not help them, even made them more depressed and suicidal. 

 

19 hours ago, ShardMare said:

If i know well the average patients takes it for few years or months then with the help of the doctor they decrease the dose gradually.

Many actually end up increasing the dose or switching to other types or brands of prescription drugs. It's only possible to lower the dose without relapse if the patient goes through successful psychotherapy.

 

19 hours ago, ShardMare said:

There are people who have other illnesses and have to take their pill everyday whats the problem with that?

The problem is obvious. It's similar to using crutches (pills) to be able to walk (function). If you are ok with using crutches your entire life just to be able to walk, that's your decision. But I don't recommend it. You also need to consider the harmful effects of the pills on your body and mind-emotion (paradoxically) long term. I almost forget to mention the amount of money lost. Many, especially in third world countries, don't have health insurance, or the health insurance company or government doesn't cover mental-emotional diseases. 

It's still a low-intelligence and low-love society we live in.

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Just want to emphasize that details are still muddy and it’s unclear what the exact effects of SSRI’s are and how directly responsible they are for treating depression. Clearly there’s anecdotal evidence of SSRI’s being successful in treating some degree of depressive symptoms. Now what portion of these results are placebo versus long-term chemical modulations is undetermined atm. 

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The same faulty science determined that psychedelics have no useful function and are dangerous, thus providing the justification to make them schedule 1 drugs.   The SSRI explanation was reductionist science at its finest.  There are thousands of people who now micro dose mushrooms to avoid antidepressants and their side effects which degenerate the brain and cause huge problems for many users which are ignored by the authorities prescribing the medications.   The present state of psychiatry is primitive and dangerous.   


Vincit omnia Veritas.

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Posted (edited)

The reality is though that some people say they feel better on SSRI's.

You guys need to respect that some people may have tried a lot of things that haven't worked in relation to depression. I've seen examples of people who are fit, healthy and have done therapy etc and they still are in bad shape mentally. 

Unfortunately meds may be the best some people can get, as some damage is irreparable, and humanity is not wise enough yet to resolve some people's issues. 

I agree it's silly to just take meds without trying anything else first, but obvious if someone is so bad that they cannot even function or on the verge of ending it all, then meds are better than suicide or not being able to get out of bed.

I'd personally prefer to do whatever it takes to avoid meds for anything. But I will admit that I've done so much, and it has worked to some degree, but I still don't feel like I used to regardless of what I do.

I'm not full on depressed or having mental breakdowns but I feel quite anhedonic and more neurotic than I did before my issues started.

My symptoms have improved due to better lifestyle and self awareness, but I feel like they will never go away, they can only be managed.

Edited by ZenAlex

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@jimwell

I dont get it how do you explore ur childhood? How do you remember it? How do u do your own therapy?

 

 

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On 24/07/2022 at 10:28 PM, jimwell said:

Even if Correcting the chemical imbalance enables the mentally ill to feel better, it's still bad because they would be reliant or addicted to such drugs until death. Such drugs don't cure, they just mask the problem. It's similar to smoking, taking meth and drinking alcohol to feel ok. 

Chemical imbalance is a result of genetics, sustained or prolonged childhood abuse or trauma. Also a result of bad mindset and enviroment. 

And people with neuropathy are also addicted to brain meds? If your brain is fucked (mental illness), there's nothing wrong in taking the medication you need.

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Posted (edited)

@ZenAlex Zoloft absolutely, undeniably works for me. I am a lot more functional on Zoloft, and ALL my fear responses are reduced which is strange. I am calmer around other phobias like spiders when on Zoloft. I take 200mg per day which is the max dose, I quit it once before but relapsed into severe depression etc etc... Went back on and it helped me again.

I have no problem with taking my brain medicine.

SSRIs don't only affect serotonin, they have a much wider action. There is an area of brain structure which alters after some time on them, and that's hypothesized as the real mode of action, and the delay before the meds start working is thought to be due to that. I used to remember much more in-depth details about this.

Edited by RMQualtrough

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