What would happen if all drugs were legalized?

thepixelmonk · July 19, 2022

On 17/07/2022 at 8:12 PM, Blackhawk said:

Disaster in every imaginable way.

They aren't illegal just because it's fun to make things illegal. They are illegal for a very good reason.

But of course all the drug lovers will disagree. They want easy access to their drugs.

Straight up factually wrong. As has been mentioned, multiple countries have completely decriminalized all drug use and the results have been nothing but super positive. You have no idea what you're talking about and obviously have zero understanding of why they're illegal in the first place. It was not for a "very good reason", maybe try educating yourself first and watching some of the countless documentaries out there about the origin of the war on drugs before talking out your ass.

**Thought Art** · July 19, 2022

I think there could be some kind of legalization and a license to use certain drugs. Like, in order to take 5meodmt legally or LSD you need to do a mental health check, take a safety course and get certified to use it on your own for personal use. Sort of like getting gun training.

Devin · July 19, 2022

2 hours ago, thepixelmonk said:

Straight up factually wrong. As has been mentioned, multiple countries have completely decriminalized all drug use and the results have been nothing but super positive. You have no idea what you're talking about and obviously have zero understanding of why they're illegal in the first place. It was not for a "very good reason", maybe try educating yourself first and watching some of the countless documentaries out there about the origin of the war on drugs before talking out your ass.

It's an opinion.

You can't say its factually wrong, those were specific circumstances and settings that don't translate everywhere.

Maybe give him a chance to explain himself before pushing him off a cliff

Edited July 19, 2022 by Devin

zurew · July 19, 2022

11 minutes ago, Devin said:

You can't say its factually wrong, those were specific circumstances and settings that don't translate everywhere.

You don't know if they translate to everywhere or not. The most you could say, is that we need to collect more stats about this topic.They were specific circumstances, but on the other hand, i have yet to see something that would justify to be strongly against the decriminalization of drugs. There are arguments, but those arguments are not backed up by any data (as far as i know).

Empirical data always trumps hypotheticals and assumptions.

thepixelmonk · July 19, 2022

20 minutes ago, Devin said:

It's an opinion.

You can't say its factually wrong, those were specific circumstances and settings that don't translate everywhere.

Maybe give him a chance to explain himself before pushing him off a cliff

Pretty much every bit of empirical, scientific data ever collected shows that, no, it is nowhere near a "disaster in every imaginable way". If you disagree feel free to provide some legit studies that show otherwise. Until that happens, yes, it is factually wrong.

Blackhawk · July 19, 2022

3 hours ago, thepixelmonk said:

Straight up factually wrong. As has been mentioned, multiple countries have completely decriminalized all drug use and the results have been nothing but super positive. You have no idea what you're talking about and obviously have zero understanding of why they're illegal in the first place. It was not for a "very good reason", maybe try educating yourself first and watching some of the countless documentaries out there about the origin of the war on drugs before talking out your ass.

And in those countries it's also legal to sell and buy any drugs? I don't think so. So no, I'm not wrong.

Devin · July 20, 2022

1 hour ago, thepixelmonk said:

Pretty much every bit of empirical, scientific data ever collected shows that, no, it is nowhere near a "disaster in every imaginable way". If you disagree feel free to provide some legit studies that show otherwise. Until that happens, yes, it is factually wrong.

He said it would be, not that it is in those countries, there are obviously different variables elsewhere, I don't agree with him but who wants to live in an echo chamber, don't jump down his throat, he wasn't being disrespectful, give him a chance to explain first.

Statistics don't mean sh!t sometimes

Edited July 20, 2022 by Devin

Devin · July 20, 2022

1 hour ago, zurew said:

You don't know if they translate to everywhere or not. The most you could say, is that we need to collect more stats about this topic.They were specific circumstances, but on the other hand, i have yet to see something that would justify to be strongly against the decriminalization of drugs. There are arguments, but those arguments are not backed up by any data (as far as i know).

Empirical data always trumps hypotheticals and assumptions.

Guess there's no point in ever discussing anything like this ever then huh? Little Timmy in Portugal didn't start shooting up therefore open the flood gates.

Edited July 20, 2022 by Devin

**Carl-Richard** · July 20, 2022

15 hours ago, integral said:

if all drugs became unregulated and legal I would put it in all the food that I manufacture and sell at the grocery store and addicted people to my food, exactly what cigarettes do with their product.

Why do you have this weird obsession with drugging people? ? I'll stay far the hell away from you ?

**Leo Gura** · July 20, 2022

Actualized Cookies coming to the Actualized Store soon

BuddhistLover · July 20, 2022

@Leo Gura Lol, that's how you deal with bullies, buy them cookies. Did you ever deal with bullies growing up? Or did you just get into big debates with everyone in class proving that you were right?

thepixelmonk · July 20, 2022

6 hours ago, Blackhawk said:

And in those countries it's also legal to sell and buy any drugs? I don't think so. So no, I'm not wrong.

Yes, you are. I asked for any empirical data whatsoever and you come back with... nothing. Until you can back your statement up with literally any piece of data, you are wrong.

4 hours ago, Devin said:

He said it would be, not that it is in those countries, there are obviously different variables elsewhere, I don't agree with him but who wants to live in an echo chamber, don't jump down his throat, he wasn't being disrespectful, give him a chance to explain first. Statistics don't mean sh!t sometimes

Nothing is the end-all-be-all, but if you're going to go against every bit of data and statistics we have, you better, as you say, be able to back it up with something. And as we can see, we still have... nothing.

Edited July 20, 2022 by thepixelmonk

zurew · July 20, 2022

4 hours ago, Devin said:

Guess there's no point in ever discussing anything like this ever then huh? Little Timmy in Portugal didn't start shooting up therefore open the flood gates.

There is value in discussing stuff like this, of course. But its really hard to argue, when all empirical data is pointing in one direction. Its a factual disagreement, so it can only be settled by using outside sources.

I had my own views on this topic, but i had to change my mind, because my views were hinging upon a lot of assumpsions, that were not backed up by any data or studies.

When i read these studies i was like: "fuck it, i have different views on this, but if it works, then it works".

4 hours ago, Devin said:

Statistics don't mean sh!t sometimes

When it comes to social issues, the most valuable thing you can do is to collect a lot of data and try to make sense of these issues using that data.

Blackhawk · July 20, 2022

1 hour ago, thepixelmonk said:

Yes, you are. I asked for any empirical data whatsoever and you come back with... nothing. Until you can back your statement up with literally any piece of data, you are wrong.

You are insane if you think that fully legalizing selling, buying and use of all drugs would lead to good things.

I don't need any data for that, because I can use my brain to understand it.

You are like "where is the data which proves that drinking lava is a bad thing?"

I say: there is no data, because no one (except you, apparently) would be so insane and drink lava in the first place.

ZenAlex · July 20, 2022

They should not be legalized, just decriminalized.

Let people organise themselves through sites like Silk road that give them a greater chance of safety. No guarantee, but greater chance.

something_else · July 20, 2022

2 hours ago, Blackhawk said:

You are insane if you think that fully legalizing selling, buying and use of all drugs would lead to good things.

Decriminalization of all drugs has been shown to be extremely positive in various countries. You shouldn't go to prison because you ended up addicted to heroin or coke.

Nor should you go to prison for being found with a couple tabs of acid in your pocket.

It's a nuanced issue, and your initial response of "no this is a fucking shit idea" is probably what riled up that dude. It's not a simple issue with an easy answer.

Most people here are particularly concerned with psychedelics anyway, since many of us have had such positive effects. I don't think anyone is advocating for the legalization of buying some heroin in your local corner store.

Most common psychedelics are non-addictive and non-toxic. The dangers come from misusing them, or from the substance not being what it was advertised as.

My argument would be that legalizing psychedelics to a degree would essentially fix both issues, by introducing regulation/awareness/standards for use. Basically preventing it from being sold as something it's not and preventing people who are likely to have intense negative reactions from taking them.

**Carl-Richard** · July 20, 2022

7 hours ago, something_else said:

Most people here are particularly concerned with psychedelics anyway, since many of us have had such positive effects. I don't think anyone is advocating for the legalization of buying some heroin in your local corner store.

Should we abolish clean needle rooms? https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2018/09/07/645609248/whats-the-evidence-that-supervised-drug-injection-sites-save-lives

The reasoning there is that people are inevitably going to shoot up, so we might as make it as safe as possible. Legalization and regulation has a similiar reasoning behind it. It's possible to make drugs available for purchase with heavy regulation like tobacco products in some countries which disincentivizes use: no advertising, all brands have the same boring packaging, have graphic health warnings on them, and they're completely hidden from view. In Norway, it's possible to grow up without knowing how to legally buy tobacco.

https://norwaytoday.info/news/standardized-tobacco-containers-norway/

I could imagine other types of regulations like a national customer registry which tracks all your drug purchases and limits the amounts you can buy from any store at one time or over a certain period. Say if you were to max out your amount of heroin and you say that it's not enough, you could for example be offered a methadone treatment program or buy some weaker opiate substitute.

**integral** · July 20, 2022

10 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

Why do you have this weird obsession with drugging people? ? I'll stay far the hell away from you ?

LMFAOO dont make me put a little something in that fish bread, youll be sure to come around.

Jokes aside I was explaining what a business minded person would do with out regulations. I wouldn't scheme to addict people. Not that we already aren't doing that legally with msg.

Imagine dumping millions of litters of psychedelics into the ocean like they did with mercury in unregulated countries. We would be ingesting some amount of it with everything we eat.

How twisted can a green business get? If my arrogance was a few notches higher i could see myself believing i know what's best for the entire world and push a twisted green business agenda.