Mind Illuminated - meditation book, have you tried it's techniques?

[bazera]

Hey guys,

I just bought Mind Illuminated, for those of you who haven't heard of it, it's a book that teaches you meditation.

I'm just curious if any one of you has read it, found it useful, and practiced the instructions it gives on meditation?

I also think that it over-complicates it, but I want to hear your thoughts about it.

Maybe just mastering Mindfulness with Labeling, as Leo teaches it, is sufficient and there is no need to overcomplicate meditation?

[Consilience]

It is a bit of over complication however it was an invaluable investment to learn the system. All the complicated step involves is making subtle distinctions about the various dynamics of mind involved with constructing your experience during meditation so yes complicated, but well worth the investment to learn.

I spent a year really devoted to the techniques in this book, it still is paying off today even though I dont strictly practice it anymore. Combing that system with Shinzen’s Unified Mindfulness system is like a perfect cocktail for awakening via meditation but start with TMI.

Once you've really gotten a handle of TMI, stages 7-10 territory, reading Rob Burbea’s seeing that frees and working through Rob’s jhana retreat on dharma seed is also a great next step in addition to Shinzen’s stuff.

Wishing you well on your journey. Thank you for putting in the work. ?

Edited July 20, 2021 by Consilience

[nistake]

I've got the book. It can give you a solid foundation, but yeah, it tends to be overcomplicated.

As far as I remember, I quit practising his method around stage 4-5. Nevertheless, it's definitely worth practising the techniques and moving up the stages, but after a certain point, dropping all the techniques may be advisable. Adyashanti calls it 'true meditation', Loch Kelly calls it 'effortless mindfulness'. For beginners, it's an excellent book.

[bazera]

@Consilience @nistake

Thanks for the feedback guys. Yeah, I also think that it will be worth my time to learn what this book tries to teach. Even if I change the technique in the future, the subtle distinctions that I think I'll learn with this will still be valuable I think.

[The0Self]

6 hours ago, Consilience said:

Once you've really gotten a handle of TMI, stages 7-10 territory, reading Rob Burbea’s seeing that frees and working through Rob’s jhana retreat on dharma seed is also a great next step in addition to Shinzen’s stuff.

^^ Most definitely. I also recommend the TMI audiobook for when you're on the go -- it's in 2 parts -- doesn't substitute for the book though, which has very helpful visual aides, especially one -- the one that helps you to understand what cessation is.

Also (in my opinion the next step after that) various contemplations and inquiries in daily life are where it's at but it may take quite a bit of meditation skill for it to be an effective endeavor. Like imagining everyone's experiences -- where are they? They're this! But you're identified with one of them. Who is not identified with this experience? That's you, which is also everyone else, and there's no one (or thing, or moment) separate from everything. Even the very most subtle movements of materiality or thought are literally being driven by and not separate from the infinite unstoppable and un-hinder-able force of the entire universe... Including the extreme subtlety and stillness that you can apply to this very contemplation technique! (etc)

Here's the key: I recommend devising many such contemplative views, and observe HOW they change the way you see reality. See enough of these enough times with enough combined stillness, subtlety, and energy... And see the underlying trend of what appearance, emptiness, and truth actually are.

Edited July 20, 2021 by The0Self

[Flyboy]

I like to think of TMI as a great place to learn the "fundamentals" -- i.e. good habits that will give you the foundation and groundwork to eventually reach mastery levels.  A master, after all, is really only someone who is so good at the fundamentals that the endeavor appears effortless.  The interludes are especially useful as well for building a framework of how the mind works.

That being said, a trap I've run into with TMI is that you can definitely over-think the techniques... he gives you so much to think about that it's easy to get neurotic and stressed out about trying to remember the 17 things you're supposed to be doing every second.  Balance his techniques with a willingness to playfully explore and experiment.  This is the single best piece of advice I've come across in all of the books I've read.  The actual real-deal skill is simply more nuanced, complex, and intuitive than the grindy mechanical techniques can address.  They are like starting points from which to explore, not rigid rules to be followed in every moment.  I hope this helps!

I highly recommend Seeing That Frees as a counterpoint to TMI, as this attitude of playfulness and heart (which is missing from many instructions) is fully developed.

[Moksha]

If you contemplate and practice it, beyond simply reading it, your mind will be illuminated. For me, the value was less about Self-realization, and more about Self-integration.

[Consilience]

7 hours ago, Moksha said:

If you contemplate and practice it, beyond simply reading it, your mind will be illuminated. For me, the value was less about Self-realization, and more about Self-integration.

Completely agree with this analysis. Techniques such as vipassana, do nothing, or self inquiry I have found to be more helpful for "awakening" but a shamatha practice has and continues to be great for integrating, unifying, harmonizing, and grounding these insights into lived experience.

[Moksha]

@Consilience Well said! ?⚡

[bazera]

Thanks for your feedback guys, I'll take your words into account