Husseinisdoingfine

How did the incel come about?

88 posts in this topic

How did the involuntary celibate come about? Why are there so many lonely men who can only interact and socialize with their computer screens, and the Anonymous people there?  What exactly in our society has created this?


لا إله إلا الله، وليو رسول الله

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You answered it - Computers, cellphones, convenience of technology. There have always been lonely men (and women), but modern technology just exacerbates it and pushes even more people into such a state. It allows people to retreat and be completely absent from the necessarily socialization needed for them to create relationships and eventually, have sex.

Not to mention because of the nature of internet culture there is a group and niche for every kind of person, so they can create an elaborate identity out of things and bury themselves deep inside it and not want help, because there are a bunch of other people willing to confirm all their biases.

This is a relatively new phenomenon I'd say. My intuition says these kinds of people wouldn't be allowed to fall so far in this aspect of life in other cultures that don't have this technology, because there is a more of a sense of community to pick up the slack.

Western culture is fucking brutally independent. You are on your own by default in a lot of ways.


"To resist is to piss in the wind, anyone who does will end up smelling.....
Knowing this why do I defy? Because my inner voice is yelling.
"

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My theory: 

Our society still hasn't fully adjusted to the "new" methods of getting laid. 

Arranged marriages and culturally enforced marriage is no longer the norm.

We have to find the new methods of getting laid (relationships too not just sex) for our new society. 

This is why I think prostitution should be legalized. And teens should be educated on the masculine and feminine psychology, this is really important. Learning to get good with women should be encouraged and done in a healthy way as well.

Most men treat women like men, and pretty much bash their heads in a wall (my head hurts hehe). 

We all have that sexual desire deep down, and that sexual desire can turn into frustration and confusion after awhile. 

Society also underestimates the biological NEED of sex. Sex isnt some fun side hobby, it's a fucking need lol. People can go crazy over this.


" We all need Samadhi to lean on."

-The Buddha

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8 minutes ago, dflores321 said:

Society also underestimates the biological NEED of sex. Sex isnt some fun side hobby, it's a fucking need lol. People can go crazy over this.

Osho was very big on this, how sexual repression creates all sorts of psychological dysfunctions in people as well as a neurotic society.


لا إله إلا الله، وليو رسول الله

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21 minutes ago, Husseinisdoingfine said:

Osho was very big on this, how sexual repression creates all sorts of psychological dysfunctions in people as well as a neurotic society.

@Husseinisdoingfine yea its fucking insane lol. 

It's almost as crazy as if society let everyone have sex but didnt give them food.


" We all need Samadhi to lean on."

-The Buddha

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Posted (edited)

Because there are no more arranged marriages. 

Stage Blue cultures thrive better in such environments because everyone gets a chance at romance and sex because of forced marriages and arranged marriages. 

Even the loneliest incel will end up with a bride. 

 

The more I am learning about western culture, the more I'm moving away from it because im observing that it breeds loneliness. 

 

Edited by Preety_India

 INTP loner... .shy girl..

Preety preety

 

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3 hours ago, Preety_India said:

The more I am learning about western culture, the more I'm moving away from it because im observing that it breeds loneliness.

 

39 minutes ago, Peter Miklis said:

There's definitely a lack of empathy for lonely people in general. Noone really gives 2 fucks about you when you're in a bad life situation, unless you have relatives, which tend to be the only people you can trust. And even that is not a guarantee.


The individualism trap - nice little article 

individualism is a sport for the young, healthy, and wealthy. Everyone else is stuck in the culture, but does not benefit from it. And it is a contest; we engage in competitions to be seen as more unique than our peers, more self-sufficient than our peers, more self-reliant then our peers


 

Your future self is watching you right now through memories

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@Peter Miklis yeah it makes you realise how selfish we all are.  The bit about old people being put into homes got to me. People are abandoned so easily.  


 

Your future self is watching you right now through memories

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It's mostly people that spend their whole day online or playing computer games etc.

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Combination of many things 

Culture, parenting, age of the internet and maybe some traumatic experiences 

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Posted (edited)

I think also because of technology and social media the idea of "average" has become bad. People no longer want to be "average" or settle for anything average. They only want the best because they see it everyday. The idea of an average job, average friends, average salary etc has almost become offensive and people feel like failures if they settle for ordinary. Just look at the beauty standard for girls that is promoted and people see everyday through social media, average girls often feel ugly even though they are not. Average income for a man is seen as not good enough. I think this exposure constantly to the best, makes the "best" seem as ordinary reality instead of cherry picked examples and creates the illusion that anything below the best is bad. This is in my opinion the main cause of the self-esteem epidemic that plagues young people these days. Personally i noticed it in myself, the moment i closed my instagram my self-esteem shot up by a good amount. 

This is in addition to what was already said, so not socializing, the false narratives that genders are the same when they are not (from an attraction point of view) etc. In my home country in eastern europe guys have this paradigm that to get girls you need skill, if you cannot get a girl it is because your skills are not good and can be improved. They see getting girls as a conquest and personal challenge. This mindset is very anti incel because when you make getting girls a skill based game, it creates mechanisms in your mind to want to improve.

Meanwhile in the west where i am studying guys often have this idea that girls pick them based on looks, which are mostly fixed. If they cannot girls it is not because their skills suck, but because they are not good looking enough. This mindset, often called blackpill, is very toxic in terms of you improving your dating life. If i am not handsome then why even bother doing anything? Girls will not want me. This mindset often creates incels that blame their looks because they believe looks are what matter most.

Obviously both look and skill matter, however when you make it more of a skill based thing, it gives you room for change and growth which leads to you being more attractive because you believe you can become more attractive.

Why this mindset in the west? I honestly do not know. I might seem biased but i think the removal of gender differences by stage green equalizes attraction in only visual. Also, hollywood and instagram create insane beauty standards that make basically 95 percent of people feel unattractive and shitty about themselves.

Edited by Karmadhi

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Posted (edited)

There have always been low status males in society... even going back to before the development of civilizations, when we were a tribal species, perhaps only 25-33% of the men passed on their seed.. the alphas of the tribe.  The advent of religion, and civilization, suppressed our natural urges so men got to have their wife and women were forced to marry a "beta male" that their biology wasn't necessarily super attracted too out of a need for security. This helped civilization function, and reduced the need to make men slaves, because it gave them something to work for.

With modern religion going away, and the women's liberation movement, men now have to work hard at their inner game in order to get the girl.. they don't get one handed to them on a plate anymore, and this is difficult for them to accept, so rather than work on themselves, they sit on the internet and pine about it, but make no mistake, it's very much genetic. Women tend to be attracted to the most socially proofed 20% of men or physically attractive men. The other 80% have to put in a lot more work, and many of them don't have optimal personalities.  There are a lot of women these days that have really high standards, and rather than have a low status male to themselves, they will literally just stay single. That's how much their biology is repulsed by low status men.  There's also the lack of large scale wars that have driven up the male population as a whole, making for more competition. In a free market, it's all about supply versus demand. When you are in demand, you cost more.

This link will show you that throughout human evolution, only around a third of men ever passed on their seed, with periods where it was much less (either that, or the male:female population ratio was 25:75 from all the men killing each other, or a combination)

https://psmag.com/environment/17-to-1-reproductive-success

This link shows how women and men rate one another... men tend to rate women far more evenly, while women tend to rate the far majority of men as "less attractive."

https://blogs.sas.com/content/sastraining/2014/10/16/how-do-men-rate-women-on-dating-websites-part-2/

It's simple genetics... the strong men used to get ALL the women. There were incels during Roman times also. It's baked into our genetic makeup. Alphas and betas were both needed to ensure the species' success. Evolution was hard.. it was do or die.. all the societally manufactured sheltered bubbles and safe spaces where people can pine about the existential horror that is being human didn't exist back then. It was survival of the fittest.

All "incels" would have to do is watch Leo's video "What Women Want In A Man - 5 Factors That Hook Women Like Crack" and then apply these principles to their real life, by practice practice practice, and they would make excellent process. It's like learning any new skill...repetition, repetition, repetition. Leo mentions this in his video "why women fall for assholes" about how many women he flirted with to realize the truth about gender dynamics. He's spot on in these videos.  All this work takes tremendous emotional labor though... it's easier to sit and pine about how unfair life is while scarfing down chips and smoking pot.

Edited by sholomar

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A comment i found on an incel youtube video. The video is about a man that face edits himself as a women so he got the "female version of himself".

This comment has 18 likes and the maker of the video also liked it.

The comment is: "LOL, the SAME face and looks (looksmatch) male to female, you go from a lifetime of loneliness, neglect and wagecucking for pennies to a lifetime of being pampered and catered, having [almost] ANY man you want, partying and Chad harems every weekend. If THIS doesn't prove the Blackpill exists idk what does".

This comment basically explains perfectly how incels think and see the world.

 

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I think this is an issue of attachment-style. Especially the way the OP put it, 'lonely men who can only interact and socialize with their computer screens', that's what this looks like. Avoidant attachment-style.

There may be some of them who genuinely lack social skills but generally, people in the West have really good social skills by my standards. Culturally, Western culture is one of the best in terms of socialization and social skills. If you can string two sentences together in your own head, your social-skills are good. If you can interact well online, you can interact well in person. It's not an issue of social skills, as much as it is an issue of attachment-style. Most people who actually lack social-skills are either really stupid people who can't put 2 and 2 together, or they're really obnoxious people who talk a lot, don't listen and who would think their social skills are much better than they actually are. They'll be 'confident' though!

If you can listen to what the other person is saying and you can have a decent conversation, your social skills are good enough. The issue of attachment-style is much more serious though.


"Do not pray for an easy life. Pray for the strength to endure a difficult one." - Bruce Lee

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19 minutes ago, Peter Miklis said:

@Karmadhi All people on this forum are missing the point when talking about incels. They don't appreciate just how more difficult physically unatractive men have it compared to good looking or even normal looking dudes. Just look at Conor Murphy's old videos ffs, dude has literaly zero game but has chicks all over him. 

It's hard to even begin approaching if you have zero faith in yourself. Femininity and masculinity my ass, what they need first is a first hand experience of unatractive dude being successfull.

You can't be successful as a guy if you're unattractive.

100% of your success and attractiveness in life as a man is caused by your personality, and you have 100% control over that.

If you think you don't, then you're in victim mod, which consists to tell yourself you have no control, when actually you do.

 


Spirituality is not the renunciation of life

It is the art of living fully

 

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Posted (edited)

@Peter Miklis Looks matter a lot more than people here dare to admit. If you need to talk with 200 girls to get one to like you (not sleep but to be attracted to you, because sleeping requires good logistics which is independent of attraction)  it means your looks have  issues (or you are super akward). However, if you take care of yourself properly you can get results. It will just be a lot harder. Yes it sucks but nothing to do about it. Honestly if you talk with a lot of girls you will get 1 to like you, it is just that the return to investment is so low that most guys do not want to do it. If you really want a girl though it is possible. Imagine you wanna go from New York to San Francisco, the good looking guy can take a plane while you have to cycle there. It is much harder and more work but if you really really want to go there, then you will.

Also guys these days are so lame that you really have an edge in some ways. Having balls and some charisma will put you above a lot of guys. These things can be developed with work. Also, Connor Murphy might seem like he has 0 game but putting yourself out in public like that, get shirtless, approach girls and then film it and put it in youtube requires serious balls that 99 percent of incels do not have. I can assure you that.

Edited by Karmadhi

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@Roy It also creates very dangerous circle jerk groups. You may even make friends there, but they will only pull you deeper into it.  They come up with all sorts of explanations why they are in a state they are in. In a way it's a crutch because it takes responsibility off you, it's not your fault, it's just your genes or the Marxists or feminists. In a way it's comforting to be a victim but it also makes it really hard for you to change your situation.  

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On 5/29/2021 at 9:21 AM, Karmadhi said:

This mindset often creates incels that blame their looks because they believe looks are what matter most.

That's so stupid everybody knows that money matters the most

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Posted (edited)

On 5/29/2021 at 11:37 PM, Karmadhi said:

@Peter Miklis Looks matter a lot more than people here dare to admit. If you need to talk with 200 girls to get one to like you (not sleep but to be attracted to you, because sleeping requires good logistics which is independent of attraction)  it means your looks have  issues (or you are super akward).

I am so pissed of when a friend of mine who is good looking start preaching that he gets women because he is confident and have personality, and "game" not because of the looks. It really pisses me of. I am 100 procent sure that my game is better but anyway.

Edited by kras

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