Tobia

Biden: "Israel has a right to defend itself"

84 posts in this topic

Biden's recent position on the recent middle eastern violence caught my attention.

Considering that the US has been providing billions of dollars worth of weapons to an aggressive apartheid state, how can biden speak such thing with a straight face?

At this level, there can never be a solution. No integrity, no respect for humanity.

Might just be the final and definite confirmation: the united states doesn't give a shit about human rights, human dignity and fairness. Let's all accept it.

In terms of spiral dynamics, does this belong to stage blue/orange ?

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Posted (edited)

I am not justified the right wing attitude within Israel, but you have to be more nuanced here. 

There are forces within Israel who are trying right now to establish a left-center government and they are not any less developed than your biased opinion you have just wrote.

Edited by Nivsch

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@Nivsch Being "nuanced" does not mean everything is relative and both sides are equally to blame. They are not equal.

It cannot even be called a war because one side has nothing and is being illegally occupied and evicted from their homes.

Are there complex interests? Yes.

Is palestinian violence justified? No. Is it understandable? Yes.

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@Tobia  I think not caring about human rights is actually stage Red. As stage Blue is a reaction to chaotic warlords constantly fighting and it tries to estabilish order, for example by introducing human rights. The extent to which carelessness about the human rights of certain nations that typically are outside Europe and North America (the most powerful countries in terms of multiple power hierarchies) is horrible. Biden clearly dehumanizes Palestinians by saying this, since while it is undeniable that Israelis are dying because of Palestinian terrorist groups for example, Palestinians are also people and many of the terrorists are born into being terrorists and brainwashed, just like Americans are brainwashed by West-centric education that overlooks the East and South to dehumanize Palestinians.

@Nivsch  It is very interesting to have somebody from Israel on this thread, multi-culturalism and expression of various opinions should be more encouraged on this forum. Could you explain more about the left wing in Israel?

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i think that attacking hamas is the right direction, palestinian need to understand that if they want to live here in peace they should stop ressisting with terror 


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Wasn´t it Hamas who started firing rockets? What would be the right response to that?

I read that before that the Israeli police arrested some Palestinians. That´s why Hamas fired rockets. But arresting people is not the same as firing rockets, at random people.

Correct me if I am wrong

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@TheSomeBody @Hulia  Learn the reason why palestinians end up doing those things out of desperation.

Learn what has been happening in East Jerusalem, for example.

If someone kicks you out of your house, would you be nice to them?

Is someone enters your church while you pray and beats you, would you be nice to them?

 

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8 minutes ago, Hulia said:

Wasn´t it Hamas who started firing rockets? What would be the right response to that?

I read that before that the Israeli police arrested some Palestinians. That´s why Hamas fired rockets. But arresting people is not the same as firing rockets, at random people.

Correct me if I am wrong

hamas had some requirements and in the last moment israel decided to follow al of the requirements, because the spirits in israel and around the world was pretty much for palatenias so they just took a leap of faith and fired anyway to gain some popularity, now israel need to prevent hamas to be popular so they need to destroy gaza in some extant and hamas still acting in stupid ways and throwing rockets


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1 minute ago, Tobia said:

@TheSomeBody @Hulia  Learn the reason why palestinians end up doing those things out of desperation.

Learn what has been happening in East Jerusalem, for example.

If someone kicks you out of your house, would you be nice to them?

Is someone enters your church while you pray and beats you, would you be nice to them?

 

it doesnt matters, you are thinking in white and black ways. 
the way the right wings justefing their action is through terror, if palestinians want peace they should resist in peacful ways, they just making israel more right, not more left. there was a gradual way of israel becoming more left but now it would be pretty much stopped and we need to wait another 10 years or so.
dont think that palestinians doesnt have a say and israel is some kind of nazi mob forever


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15 minutes ago, Hulia said:

Wasn´t it Hamas who started firing rockets? What would be the right response to that?

I read that before that the Israeli police arrested some Palestinians. That´s why Hamas fired rockets. But arresting people is not the same as firing rockets, at random people.

Correct me if I am wrong

Lets cuddle screw politics.

Isreal surrounded by 200 million Arabs around what is to be expected?

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6 minutes ago, Tobia said:

If someone kicks you out of your house, would you be nice to them?

I can relate better than you think. Russia occupied my place of bith and annected Crimea. In Crimea they do exactly they same what Israellis do on the occupied pallestinian territory: they opress the ethnic residents of Crimea - tatars and move Russians to Crimea. So that this territory will be genuinely russian. 

But I cannot imagine Ukrainian army firing rockets at Crimea´s cities (I mean cities not millitary bases). I would never never support it. Even if I knew that the rockets hit Russians moved to Crimea. To kick them off after Crimea gets back to Uktaine - yes, to kill them - no.

 

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8 minutes ago, Zeroguy said:

Lets cuddle screw politics.

Isreal surrounded by 200 million Arabs around what is to be expected?

Cuddle and speak about international politics ...never done that before, would be an interesting experience 

 

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9 minutes ago, Zeroguy said:

Lets cuddle screw politics.

Isreal surrounded by 200 million Arabs around what is to be expected?

?


💊OFF Antidepressants 2020-2023. It takes years because of complicated compensatory changes your body and brain do. 🚫Don't believe doctors say to you its your "disease" back. Just taper slowely enough! 🥝Your body & brain are way more complicated than how western medicine grasps them. Respect them.

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14 minutes ago, Hulia said:

Cuddle and speak about international politics ...never done that before, would be an interesting experience 

 

We can always turn News on TV on.Let them talk we have our thing.

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4 minutes ago, Zeroguy said:

We can always turn News on TV on.Let them talk we have our thing.

I think, it would fit. With all the tensions and distractions happening in the world and us not giving a fuck :) 

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Just now, Hulia said:

I think, it would fit. With all the tensions and distractions happening in the world and us not giving a fuck :) 

Exactly!

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@Hulia We shouldn't be so open 'bout it.Leo has eyes on us like he is our parent or sthg.Haha

Good thing is that he is all about love .But we don't talk long about politics destroys my libido but if you strike me and make me against some of your views it may ignite my passion . 

we will still cuddle no worries.

yes Israel has every right to defend.

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1 hour ago, bejapuskas said:

 

@Nivsch  It is very interesting to have somebody from Israel on this thread, multi-culturalism and expression of various opinions should be more encouraged on this forum. Could you explain more about the left wing in Israel?

I would be interested in hearing this as well.


"The mind is inherently embodied.
Thought is mostly unconscious.
Abstract concepts are largely metaphorical." - George Lakoff

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5 hours ago, Zeroguy said:

Lets cuddle screw politics.

Isreal surrounded by 200 million Arabs around what is to be expected?

@Zeroguy  This sounds almost xenophobic. It is not like all Arabs want to kill Israelis. Politics is a serious thing, nothing to screw.

5 hours ago, Hulia said:

Cuddle and speak about international politics ...never done that before, would be an interesting experience 

@Hulia  It is interesting and really possible. People just need to stop caring about petty survival stuff and get real on what really matters and try to understand each other. But most people are too close-minded to do that, they have to actually open up and give up some of their solid stances.

4 hours ago, DocWatts said:

I would be interested in hearing this as well.

@DocWatts  Nivsch is Israeli I think.

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@bejapuskas Politics is serious thing. Now tell me how much of these guys are actually involved with it? 

Like soccer fans. 

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