Bogdan

Carnivore cannot heal the gut, Leo

173 posts in this topic

9 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

I can't imagine anyone in the modern world who would go hunting just for food.

Its might be worth it even just for food. I remember Joe Rogan saying, that from 1 hunted elk, he stocked up a full freezer of meat that will last him for 6 months. And he is a big guy. Anyway that is whole another skill-set that has to be learned, few will go for it.


O.o Ooo

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Posted (edited)

Honestly I think i'd feel better eating meat, but I just don't feel good ethically

I feel guilty when I do, like it should be illegal

Edited by bliss54

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Posted (edited)

9 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

I don't buy this logic.

I don't think there is any protein intake limits for the body, within reason.

Simply eat until you are full.

I don't "buy" it either, hence "theoretical." Though in my research, I have found some convincing evidence over the years that protein may only be assimilated at a rate of about 10g per hour, throughout all hours, without the inclusion of exogenous insulin (and potentially some other PEDs). As in, even if you ate 240g of protein all at once, once a day, you'd still assimilate all of it -- it would just take a full 24 hours, theoretically. A very similar phenomenon is actually proven to occur with fats, btw -- it would not be unreasonable to assume something similar may be true for protein, as protein is generally even more difficult for the body to fully assimilate. It occurs with both fat and carb when daily caloric intake exceeds ~10kcal, but even in those cases, daily protein intake did not exceed 240g by much, if at all.

Just a suggestion for future troubleshooting. If it's too much trouble to try it, absolutely don't bother. If it's no problem, perhaps consider it. That's all I'm saying.

The downstream glucose conversion from 240g protein is way more than enough to keep from going keto, if that's perhaps what you're worried about by increasing fats significantly to make up for the calories.

Edited by The0Self

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11 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

I can't imagine anyone in the modern world who would go hunting just for food.

Really? Well, considering the aforementioned deer/elk jerky was from my friend's freezer who hunts for food all the time and it's extremely economical and probably humane... And he isn't the only person I know who does that... It definitely seems to be a fairly common thing, at least in the southern USA, but I'm pretty sure it's more or less ubiquitous.

3 hours ago, Yog said:

Its might be worth it even just for food. I remember Joe Rogan saying, that from 1 hunted elk, he stocked up a full freezer of meat that will last him for 6 months. And he is a big guy. Anyway that is whole another skill-set that has to be learned, few will go for it.

^^

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If there are so many good results on carnivore could it be that humans should simply eat meat all the times ? Maybe all that Ayurveda and Buddhism don't hurt animals stuff isn't true after all. I guess humans are just supposed to kill and eat meat only.

After all our bodies are still hunter-gatherers, maybe the whole confusion started once people started farming their food 10.000 years ago, maybe that was the wrong move.

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1 minute ago, Phyllis Wagner said:

If there are so many good results on carnivore could it be that humans should simply eat meat all the times ? Maybe all that Ayurveda and Buddhism don't hurt animals stuff isn't true after all. I guess humans are just supposed to kill and eat meat only.

After all our bodies are still hunter-gatherers, maybe the whole confusion started once people started farming their food 10.000 years ago, maybe that was the wrong move.

For people who don't get a bad reaction to starch and plants, it is best to include those in the diet -- to counteract the carnivore diet's effect on cholesterol and the cardiovascular system. You only need carnivore if you need it, and hopefully not forever but if that's all they can do, it probably beats a diet of processed foods by a long shot. Doesn't mean it's the optimal diet by any means.

It does not seem to be the case that humans should eat meat only, but it also seems to be the case that eliminating meat entirely (and especially eliminating animal products entirely) makes optimal health a bit more complicated, not that it can't still be pursued.

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Posted (edited)

@Phyllis Wagner  I think that a lot of it has to do with our diminished gut microbiome due to fast food, antibiotics, pesticides, toxins etc. Impaired microbiome cannot help us properly metabolize food and that can in time cause immune problems as majority of our immune system resides in the gut. So humans not only have polluted and ruined their environment and surrounding ecosystems but also ecosystems within their guts. I remember watching a documentary years ago in which it was claimed that people in the first world countries have a lot less bacterial species in their colons compared to native tribes in Africa that eat huge amounts of fiber from various plant sources. Also genetics and what part of the world your ancestors came from have an effect on your ability tolerate foods.

Edited by Delis

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Posted (edited)

Leo is looking very thin in the latest blog video :o:o
It’s concerning... these extreme fasts and diets are bordering on anorexia :| Leo even reported in the video that he couldn’t manage to work and could barely stand up, and that he was so hungry the entire time. 

Please people be careful when following these extreme diets and starving yourself!!
becoming so obsessive and having it consume your life is not good. 
 

Edited by Tangerinedream

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Leo, on the video you say carnivore is not for the long term but on the other hand the inuit and every hunter-gatherer tribe from the beginning of time ate mostly meat, for their entire life. Meat has been always the main food of humans. How can that be bad now when it wasn't bad our entire existence? I mean those tribes didn't have modern illnessess like we do now.

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Posted (edited)

2 hours ago, The0Self said:

Really? Well, considering the aforementioned deer/elk jerky was from my friend's freezer who hunts for food all the time and it's extremely economical and probably humane... And he isn't the only person I know who does that... It definitely seems to be a fairly common thing, at least in the southern USA, but I'm pretty sure it's more or less ubiquitous.

My point is that these people probably grew up hunting or grew to like it somehow.

Edited by Carl-Richard

To balance beauty and complexity so perfectly is a divine mystery.

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1 hour ago, Guido said:

Leo, on the video you say carnivore is not for the long term but on the other hand the inuit and every hunter-gatherer tribe from the beginning of time ate mostly meat, for their entire life. Meat has been always the main food of humans. How can that be bad now when it wasn't bad our entire existence? I mean those tribes didn't have modern illnessess like we do now.

Dude... the inuit have horrible health, and a very low life expectancy. Even their mummies had atherosclerosis. The more meat free a civilization is, the longer they live and the healthier they are. This is an undeniable fact.

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2 hours ago, Guido said:

Leo, on the video you say carnivore is not for the long term but on the other hand the inuit and every hunter-gatherer tribe from the beginning of time ate mostly meat, for their entire life. Meat has been always the main food of humans. How can that be bad now when it wasn't bad our entire existence? I mean those tribes didn't have modern illnessess like we do now.

Longevity in meateating tribes is not good. They get clogged arteries. Most of them simply don't live long enough to get a stroke or heart attack because tribal folk tend to die young of natural causes.

High meat diet will definitely skyrocket your cholestorol, the bad kind.


You are God. You are Love. You are Infinity. You are Leo.

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Posted (edited)

11 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Longevity in meateating tribes is not good.

Yep. There is an important distinction between longevity and biological fitness. Just because x diet is observed in nature (the selection criteria being biological fitness) does not mean it promotes longevity. You could argue that longevity isn't a natural phenomena in the first place (it arose "artificially" through human culture).

Edited by Carl-Richard

To balance beauty and complexity so perfectly is a divine mystery.

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But if I had to choose between living 65 years on carnivore vs 80 years on vegan, with how much better I feel on carnivore factored in, I would rather live 65. No doubts about it.

Longevity is meaningless without energy and quality of life. I can accomplish more work in 65 of carnivore than 80 years of vegan. At least given my current health condition. Hopefully I can change that.


You are God. You are Love. You are Infinity. You are Leo.

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Posted (edited)

7 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

But if I had to choose between living 65 years on carnivore vs 80 years on vegan, with how much better I feel on carnivore factored in, I would rather live 65. No doubts about it.

Quality of life trumps longevity.

There is a trade-off for everything. Even within a purely biological framework with healthy individuals, you would actually expect the diet that maximizes fitness to minimize longevity and vice versa.

Edited by Carl-Richard

To balance beauty and complexity so perfectly is a divine mystery.

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Posted (edited)

@Leo Gura Here's a service that lets you buy grass-fed organic meat of all animals: https://www.butcherbox.com/

Also Leo, as a supplementation, a lot of carnivores actually will eat little nibbles of liver (less than the size of my pinkie finger) every day or week: https://carnivoreaurelius.com/

Edited by Husseinisdoingfine

لا إله إلا الله، وليو رسول الله

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@Leo Gura There is a chance a lot of us would have to live without pizza, ice cream, sandwiches, pastry, chocolate and coffee. I would say NO to that lifestyle. Truth is, pleasure of food counts for a huge chunk of pleasure in this world. I'm not sure that life is worth living. You can make millions of dollars and have a gratifying career and all that but if you cannot so much as enjoy a cup of cappuccino and a dark chocolate bar after a long workday?? ! No thank you!!!! I can only hope either fecal transplants or Stem Cell therapy does the trick and spare people the immense suffering..................

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53 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Longevity in meateating tribes is not good. They get clogged arteries. Most of them simply don't live long enough to get a stroke or heart attack because tribal folk tend to die young of natural causes.

High meat diet will definitely skyrocket your cholestorol, the bad kind.

Not trying to argue and of course you've done your research Leo but I don't think that any of that is true. Cholesterol is a natural response of the body to fix inflamation, we know what causes inflamation, of course not meat. So clogged arteries is just the cholesterol trying to fix the inflammation caused by grains, processed foods and (in some bodies more than others) some fruits and veggies.

Veggies have some good nutrients but many antinutrients, fruits are just empty carbs (sugar and fiber). Meat have all you need to survive and thrive (you are proving it yourself right now).

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I know this plot, it ends by Leo realizing that the carnivore diet made everything worse and that he reacts to vegetables even more severely than before, possibly permanently locking him into having to avoid plants for the rest of his life.

 

Good case study on what desperation does to a mind.

 

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