Edward mahairi

why is Aleister Crowley stage Turquoise!?

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Can someone explain why did Leo put Alesiter Crowley as a stage Turquoise person in the very first post of the examples that Leo provided for the stage Turquoise Megathread ?

Wasn't he into the occult and he had a cult of some sort?

What makes him stage turquoise?!

Kinda weird

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On second thought, he should probably be lower.

My understanding of Turquoise has deepened a lot since I made that list.


You are God. You are Love. You are Infinity. You are Leo.

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Quite interesting. Leo probably thinks it's like the hippie psychics who questioned that he was God and had no direct experience of what spirituality is actually about.

Crowley has a concept called "crossing the Abyss" which means ego death or "completing the Great Work" which means enlightenment. He did meditation, yoga, breakthwork, and psychedelics. "Love is the Law" means Love = Reality.

He gets a bad rap because he was an aristocratic elitist, abrasive, and was addicted to the heroin he was prescribed for asthma. He also had a spooky reputation among the Christian fundamentalists in England (this was the 1800s/1900s), so he played up Satanic demonic evil stuff to troll people basically.

He kinda was a cult leader. Imagine Actualized.org but with a ranking system where you have to memorize certain rituals to advance in rank. This guy Austin Osman Spare didn't like that and also didn't like Crowley's gay flirtations.

@Leo Gura Magic/witchcraft is a good blind spot for you to investigate as a self-actualization element. I only know one person who's achieved complete knockout nonduality through "ceremonial magic" like Crowley, but this here is good advice regarding self-improvement. Genesis (good friend of Terence McKenna and Timothy Leary and Alexander Shulgin) here is self-actualization taken to its extreme (even though they are quite overweight and abused ketamine). Genesis borrowed an idea from Austin Osman Spare which is the orgasm ritual technique: social conditioning shuts down when you cum, so you can set intentions better.

 

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@AtheisticNonduality Stage Turquoise is not about nonduality. You can have full-blown nonduality at Blue -- the classic example of which is Zen monks.

Crowley is probably more Red/Orange, but combined with mysticism and occult.

It's hard to peg him since he's such an oddball character. Some folks may just be too weird to map onto SD.


You are God. You are Love. You are Infinity. You are Leo.

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@Leo Gura Do you still consider your Turquoise episode (which is on Spotify) worth listening to? Or would you recommend seeking other resources to introduce oneself to that stage

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21 minutes ago, Matt Skinner said:

@Leo Gura Do you still consider your Turquoise episode (which is on Spotify) worth listening to? Or would you recommend seeking other resources to introduce oneself to that stage

I think it still has a lot of value, but you should supplement it with reading the Spiral Dynamics book chapter on Turquoise.

You just need to distinguish a bit more clearly mysticism and nonduality vs Turquoise. They are not the same.


You are God. You are Love. You are Infinity. You are Leo.

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12 hours ago, Edward mahairi said:

Can someone explain why did Leo put Alesiter Crowley as a stage Turquoise person in the very first post of the examples that Leo provided for the stage Turquoise Megathread ?

Wasn't he into the occult and he had a cult of some sort?

What makes him stage turquoise?!

Kinda weird

@Edward mahairi If you are (or anybody else) interested in Crowley, I would highly recommend you to read primary sources (his own writings) or study Thelema itself. The sources are easily accessible online.

If you want to - relatively quickly, because it is a fairly short text - find out, what are the main ideas of Thelema (and maybe sort out some common misconceptions about it), I highly recommend you to read The Message of The Master Therion: https://hermetic.com/crowley/libers/lib2


For more direct sources, go here: https://hermetic.com/crowley/index or visit good old friend -Wikipedia - for overall view: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thelemic_mysticism

The point of this post is basically this: I am not sure, if he was turquoise or not according to the SD. But listen to the man himself and make your own opinion of him and his thoughts regardless of what others say.

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11 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You just need to distinguish a bit more clearly mysticism and nonduality vs Turquoise. They are not the same.

I find that integral theory covers this problem very well by differentiating stages and states. That stages can interpret states differently through their worldview. I don't see why integral theory isn't used more on this forum, I find it far more detailed than SD. Minus the lackluster understanding of green. 

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@Leo Gura You have a book about astral projection and a book by Daniel Ingram. If you are interested in that, Daniel Ingram (friend of Frank Yang) has some cool techniques, even if you are usually not interested in aliens and spirits and other external things. https://www.listennotes.com/podcasts/chaotic-thinking/astral-experiences-evoking-ToZB3SdIryu/ There is also an obnoxious guy on the Carlos Castaneda subreddit named Dan who has full-blown trips eyes open with no drugs by just sitting and blankly staring in a pitch black room for hours at a time, although I don't advise interacting with him because his understandings of metaphysics and the purpose of spirituality are really bad.

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