vinc3nc

"My 5 MeO DMT experience" (Adeptus Psychonautica doesn't get it)

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Posted (edited)

@AdeptusPsychonautica

Hey man, nice video on 5-MEO DMT.  I very much enjoyed hearing your perspective on the substance.  I've been very interested in trying it for a long time myself but have never had the opportunity.  I'll be interested to see what other things you have in store on YouTube.

On another note, I wish you would soften what seems to be negative feelings you have towards Leo.  I feel you have been the aggressor in the situation and he's allowed you to express your dissenting opinion on his forum.  I'm not saying to not have a critical eye, I just hope that the things you say come from a place of good faith.  Because regardless of what your opinion is, this forum and Leo's work have helped a lot of people.  

Edited by Heart of Space

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I would like to see Leo have some dialogs with the wider community outside of his channel. But I don't really blame him if he doesn't want to do that, that's never been what he's been about and while I'm sure I would enjoy watching it I doubt it would have as much value as his regular content.

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Posted (edited)

@AdeptusPsychonautica 

Didn't expect you to come here. Let me make a few things clear. The goal of my post was not to attack you. I don't have anything against you. I think you have a decent YT channel.

I just wanted to take you as an example here - that people who don't do any consciousness work (meditation, contemplation, etc) don't experience trips or don't understand what's shown to them in the same way. Just like, for example, people taking drugs at parties won't be able to make any sense of their trips. Not trying to compare you to them, but you get the point. Joe Rogan is another example. He's not become conscious of "certain things" even tho he's probably had 100 trips.

Do you care about growing as a person, developing yourself spiritually? Is that something you care about? Or do you want to have psychedelic experiences "just because"? If the latter, then don't expect to have the same kind of experiences that some of the people can have. Or think that it's all just "subjective". Or that "we" just call things differently.

Can you open your mind up to the possibility of experiencing the trips way differently with some inner work done beforehand?

Hope you won't treat this as a personal attack. I don't want to make anyone feel inferior here.

Edited by vinc3nc

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2 hours ago, Forestluv said:

Imagine you have led me to believe that you simply want to explore a forest together, learn about nature and share our ideas and experiences. To have “conversations” along our hike. Yet once in the forest, it becomes clear that your orientation is to argue that ants should be in the same genus as beetles and that you are right and I am wrong. 

If you ever did that to me, I would most likely kill you, because I absolutely hated zoology systematics in college xD


To balance beauty and complexity so perfectly is a divine mystery.

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2 hours ago, Gesundheit said:
3 hours ago, AdeptusPsychonautica said:

Guys - In case it wasn’t clear I wasn’t offering a debate, simply a conversation.

Leo - I have never denied I am God, nor you, nor anyone, and if it makes you happy then I am indeed God, as we all are... Tada

Despite your godliness, don’t forget to remember that you are also a human being - right now it looks like you are in orbit but maybe one day you will get to land on the planet 😉

Space - most of your questions are addressed in this follow up video

 

I can sense your hypocrisy through the Atlantic 

This work supposedly makes you more humble but you criticize online more than one people without having any clue who they are and what they have done in their lives , people that actually helping. 

And to see it also with unconscious  mind what the fuck you have to offer?

Stay out of drugs please 

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Posted (edited)

@Insane butterfly I think what Adeptus is saying is mostly a fair and healthy form of criticism. Being able to criticize is really important especially with this type of work, since it has the potential to devolve into cult-like "authority" worshipping dynamics. 

Edited by TheAlchemist

Every perspective has at least a piece of the truth in it.

No one is capable of being 100% wrong.

 

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12 hours ago, vinc3nc said:

Joe Rogan is another example. He's not become conscious of "certain things" even tho he's probably had 100 trips.

That is an assumption you are making simply because he hasn't made outright claims about reality that line up with Leo's teachings, but simply describing the feeling of these experiences without assertions. 

@AdeptusPsychonautica I absolutely agree that there is a certain sect of the forum that does exhibit group think and it's probably only made worse by Leo's aura of superiority, which is such a ridiculous trait to have given how utterly subjective these experiences are; there's certainly overall themes that most of us can agree on but outside that it's purely our own personal interpretations that work for us and I feel Leo fails to recognise this and any disagreement on the tiny nuances is seen as simply being a lack of 'wokeness' thus further perpetuating such groupthink in more vulnerable individuals. Honestly he just needs a bit of humbling....maybe a good dose of mushrooms would do the trick xD.

 

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Posted (edited)

1 hour ago, Ry4n said:

That is an assumption you are making simply because he hasn't made outright claims about reality that line up with Leo's teachings, but simply describing the feeling of these experiences without assertions. 

Joe Rogan still avoids questioning a lot of very basic things, for example why he fears 5-MeO-DMT. He says he fears it but he doesn't care enough to find out exactly why. Still stuck in sensation seeking. There has to be a certain natural inclination towards truth seeking that cannot be learned. For instance, I experienced the same fear when I took LSD and when I was 6 years old looking up at the night sky. The question of why it happens has been tormenting me all my life. You can't learn that.

(Btw, I'm only talking about Joe Rogan here, not Adeptus).

Edited by Carl-Richard

To balance beauty and complexity so perfectly is a divine mystery.

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1 hour ago, Ry4n said:

That is an assumption you are making simply because he hasn't made outright claims about reality that line up with Leo's teachings, but simply describing the feeling of these experiences without assertions. 

@AdeptusPsychonautica I absolutely agree that there is a certain sect of the forum that does exhibit group think and it's probably only made worse by Leo's aura of superiority, which is such a ridiculous trait to have given how utterly subjective these experiences are; there's certainly overall themes that most of us can agree on but outside that it's purely our own personal interpretations that work for us and I feel Leo fails to recognise this and any disagreement on the tiny nuances is seen as simply being a lack of 'wokeness' thus further perpetuating such groupthink in more vulnerable individuals. Honestly he just needs a bit of humbling....maybe a good dose of mushrooms would do the trick xD.

 

@Ry4n When you grow up you recognize that your opinions on different matters doesent really matter at all because people will do what people will do anyways. 

It is after all Leo's forum and his creation and if he act like a supervisor and you feel disturbed by it you can also check for why you get triggered. 

Regarding psychedelics experiences it is highly personal and can show up in many different flavors and contexts depending on the psyche of the one who uses them.

But honestly to give critics of Leo and using Adeptus in it is a bit of a small man move and that Leo need to be humble, I feel that you are the one who is disturbed and should check why you assume someone should behave the way you want them to behave?

 

Both Adeptus and Leo is good guys with different psyches and it plays out in different ways, instead you could be the change you want to see in the world and act accordingly. 

I honestly feel that adeptus as well is trying to play humble alot but will still use criticism against Leo but ofcourse Adeptus is framing it as he is good with his intentions and other people who had experiences can be delusional and he understands but he ofcourse is not delusional in it cause he is rational which is horseshit imo and is just an act.

I think Adeptus is deliberatly not trying to say things as infinite and so forth just to not sound like a flower power individual since he does not like that stuff and he has pissed on Leo for his statements.

(but it could just aswell be me who is projecting that on him.)

One thing tho is that we can agree that we all are living in our own world with our own experiences and ideas and you are right that we all can interpret it differently and just because it doesent line up with your experiences or ideas doesent mean it is wrong.

When Leo actually say's that you can go deeper there is more to become concious of, maybe there is something to it?

Leo is not the first person communicating such radical insights.

But you have to make your own choice about it and see if its true or dont it does not matter but to say that Leo needs to become more humble you are projecting that unto him and I do feel that Leo knows his shit more then you think you know about him.

Be silent and quiet the mind brother.

Leo is you and adeptus is you so what is the problem?

Love them equally. 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Adamq8 said:

@Ry4n When you grow up you recognize that your opinions on different matters doesent really matter at all because people will do what people will do anyways. 

It is after all Leo's forum and his creation and if he act like a supervisor and you feel disturbed by it you can also check for why you get triggered. 

Regarding psychedelics experiences it is highly personal and can show up in many different flavors and contexts depending on the psyche of the one who uses them.

But honestly to give critics of Leo and using Adeptus in it is a bit of a small man move and that Leo need to be humble, I feel that you are the one who is disturbed and should check why you assume someone should behave the way you want them to behave?

 

Both Adeptus and Leo is good guys with different psyches and it plays out in different ways, instead you could be the change you want to see in the world and act accordingly. 

I honestly feel that adeptus as well is trying to play humble alot but will still use criticism against Leo but ofcourse Adeptus is framing it as he is good with his intentions and other people who had experiences can be delusional and he understands but he ofcourse is not delusional in it cause he is rational which is horseshit imo and is just an act.

I think Adeptus is deliberatly not trying to say things as infinite and so forth just to not sound like a flower power individual since he does not like that stuff and he has pissed on Leo for his statements.

(but it could just aswell be me who is projecting that on him.)

One thing tho is that we can agree that we all are living in our own world with our own experiences and ideas and you are right that we all can interpret it differently and just because it doesent line up with your experiences or ideas doesent mean it is wrong.

When Leo actually say's that you can go deeper there is more to become concious of, maybe there is something to it?

Leo is not the first person communicating such radical insights.

But you have to make your own choice about it and see if its true or dont it does not matter but to say that Leo needs to become more humble you are projecting that unto him and I do feel that Leo knows his shit more then you think you know about him.

Be silent and quiet the mind brother.

Leo is you and adeptus is you so what is the problem?

Love them equally. 

 

 

 

Saying something is wrong isnt wrong aswell. A bit of a paradox.

I think you know that, i had the urge to state that regardless. lol

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3 hours ago, Adamq8 said:

@Ry4n When you grow up you recognize that your opinions on different matters doesent really matter at all because people will do what people will do anyways. 

It is after all Leo's forum and his creation and if he act like a supervisor and you feel disturbed by it you can also check for why you get triggered. 

Regarding psychedelics experiences it is highly personal and can show up in many different flavors and contexts depending on the psyche of the one who uses them.

But honestly to give critics of Leo and using Adeptus in it is a bit of a small man move and that Leo need to be humble, I feel that you are the one who is disturbed and should check why you assume someone should behave the way you want them to behave?

 

Both Adeptus and Leo is good guys with different psyches and it plays out in different ways, instead you could be the change you want to see in the world and act accordingly. 

I honestly feel that adeptus as well is trying to play humble alot but will still use criticism against Leo but ofcourse Adeptus is framing it as he is good with his intentions and other people who had experiences can be delusional and he understands but he ofcourse is not delusional in it cause he is rational which is horseshit imo and is just an act.

I think Adeptus is deliberatly not trying to say things as infinite and so forth just to not sound like a flower power individual since he does not like that stuff and he has pissed on Leo for his statements.

(but it could just aswell be me who is projecting that on him.)

One thing tho is that we can agree that we all are living in our own world with our own experiences and ideas and you are right that we all can interpret it differently and just because it doesent line up with your experiences or ideas doesent mean it is wrong.

When Leo actually say's that you can go deeper there is more to become concious of, maybe there is something to it?

Leo is not the first person communicating such radical insights.

But you have to make your own choice about it and see if its true or dont it does not matter but to say that Leo needs to become more humble you are projecting that unto him and I do feel that Leo knows his shit more then you think you know about him.

Be silent and quiet the mind brother.

Leo is you and adeptus is you so what is the problem?

Love them equally. 

 

 

 

Pot calling the kettle black.

 

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17 hours ago, vinc3nc said:

@AdeptusPsychonautica 

Didn't expect you to come here. Let me make a few things clear. The goal of my post was not to attack you. I don't have anything against you. I think you have a decent YT channel.

I just wanted to take you as an example here - that people who don't do any consciousness work (meditation, contemplation, etc) don't experience trips or don't understand what's shown to them in the same way. Just like, for example, people taking drugs at parties won't be able to make any sense of their trips. Not trying to compare you to them, but you get the point. Joe Rogan is another example. He's not become conscious of "certain things" even tho he's probably had 100 trips.

Do you care about growing as a person, developing yourself spiritually? Is that something you care about? Or do you want to have psychedelic experiences "just because"? If the latter, then don't expect to have the same kind of experiences that some of the people can have. Or think that it's all just "subjective". Or that "we" just call things differently.

Can you open your mind up to the possibility of experiencing the trips way differently with some inner work done beforehand?

Hope you won't treat this as a personal attack. I don't want to make anyone feel inferior here.

@vinc3nc don't worry about me feeling inferior mate, its quite the opposite because I don't think you are coming off too brilliantly here, nor do I think you are being honest in regard to your motives.

Its fairly obvious that you had a chip on your shoulder, and that this was coming from your MISTAKEN assumption that just because I called Leo out for his claims around superhuman abilities (a fairly reasonable bit of criticism which has stood the test of time), that I was therefore opposed to non-duality/spirituality, and thus would have to eat some humble pie...  

Now go take a look at the title of this thread, then re-read your multiple crowing responses on the first page, then try and massage that perception into your "I don't have anything against you" narrative, and then let me know how convincing it sounds. Its fine by the way, but at least have the spine and the self-awareness to own it.

Some examples for you...

"He's deeply asleep"
"When you're so close-minded and you've not done any work on yourself, the trips won't have the same effect on you"
"the last thing he wants is to admit he's been wrong all along"
"There are three classes of people: those who see. Those who see when they are shown. Those who do not see."

The smug sense of superiority is so thick you could butter your toast with it 😄

Now I'm not a huge fan of Joe Rogan, but here again we see you looking down your nose at someone who is actually a fine example of positivity, open mindedness, physical dedication, conversation, knowledge in his chosen discipline, courage, masculinity, independence... and yet YOU would sneer at HIM because he doesn't sing from your pretentious playbook of pseudo-spirituality? Spirituality is (in my humble opinion) about embodying the best version of yourself you can be, not just throwing out a few words of meaningless waffle, and in that regard Joe Rogan WIPES THE FLOOR with you.

As for me, I mean most of what you are asking can be found on my channel so, feel free to answer your own questions rather than have me spoon feed you - although granted you don't seem particularly effective at accurately comprehending the videos you do watch, no doubt in your haste to return to your state of "high consciousness".

Lets flip your question back at you - Do YOU care about growing as a person? Because if so you need to come down off your little high horse, learn some basic comprehension skills, stop sniffing your own farts about how "high conscious" you are (or others aren't), cut down on the EMBARRASSING self-aggrandizement, and actually practice what you claim to espouse.

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3 hours ago, AdeptusPsychonautica said:

@vinc3nc don't worry about me feeling inferior mate, its quite the opposite because I don't think you are coming off too brilliantly here, nor do I think you are being honest in regard to your motives.

Its fairly obvious that you had a chip on your shoulder, and that this was coming from your MISTAKEN assumption that just because I called Leo out for his claims around superhuman abilities (a fairly reasonable bit of criticism which has stood the test of time), that I was therefore opposed to non-duality/spirituality, and thus would have to eat some humble pie...  

Now go take a look at the title of this thread, then re-read your multiple crowing responses on the first page, then try and massage that perception into your "I don't have anything against you" narrative, and then let me know how convincing it sounds. Its fine by the way, but at least have the spine and the self-awareness to own it.

Some examples for you...

"He's deeply asleep"
"When you're so close-minded and you've not done any work on yourself, the trips won't have the same effect on you"
"the last thing he wants is to admit he's been wrong all along"
"There are three classes of people: those who see. Those who see when they are shown. Those who do not see."

The smug sense of superiority is so thick you could butter your toast with it 😄

Now I'm not a huge fan of Joe Rogan, but here again we see you looking down your nose at someone who is actually a fine example of positivity, open mindedness, physical dedication, conversation, knowledge in his chosen discipline, courage, masculinity, independence... and yet YOU would sneer at HIM because he doesn't sing from your pretentious playbook of pseudo-spirituality? Spirituality is (in my humble opinion) about embodying the best version of yourself you can be, not just throwing out a few words of meaningless waffle, and in that regard Joe Rogan WIPES THE FLOOR with you.

As for me, I mean most of what you are asking can be found on my channel so, feel free to answer your own questions rather than have me spoon feed you - although granted you don't seem particularly effective at accurately comprehending the videos you do watch, no doubt in your haste to return to your state of "high consciousness".

Lets flip your question back at you - Do YOU care about growing as a person? Because if so you need to come down off your little high horse, learn some basic comprehension skills, stop sniffing your own farts about how "high conscious" you are (or others aren't), cut down on the EMBARRASSING self-aggrandizement, and actually practice what you claim to espouse.

 

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@AdeptusPsychonautica

There's a difference between me coming to attack you on your YT channel (or forum, if you have one), telling you "hey, I don't like you, you're not open-minded, you're not a high conscious person, etc.", and making a random post on some random forum where my point is to show people something.

I had never done the former. I don't want to go out there telling people they're stupid in the face. You don't change people that way. And I don't care about other people on YT enough to do that.

The thing here is that you weren't supposed to see this post. I wouldn't have told you what I wrote here in person. That's what you have to understand. But here you are, seeing what you shouldn't have seen.

Anyway, the question that you have to ask yourself is why do you care so much about what random people say on some random forum? Do you expect that all of the people on this planet will like you and that no one will ever say anything bad about you or be critical of you? Will you always go out there defending yourself? What is there to defend? Why so insecure? Imagine having 1 Mio subs. Imagine how much criticism you might get. Will you spend 8 hours a day defending your ego?

Some people will like you, others won't. Some will even hate you. Why? Because they have problems with themselves. That's reality. Focus on your work - on your YT channel. Stop caring what people say about you. The right kind of people will be there for you. Ignore others. Ignore me. I'm just a random dude here. We will never meet in real life. I understand that you're trying to defend your image here, but let me tell you people won't like you more for that. You're defending an illusion.

I've never said anything bad about Rogan. Don't put words in my mouth. I've watched A LOT of his podcasts. He's had interesting people on his podcasts, and I've learned a lot from them, and even from Rogan himself. He's an interesting person in his own way, and more accomplished than we both together will ever be. Take nothing away from him. But I can still say, for example, that he has no clue about politics. And I can talk about this fact with my friends. But I would never tell him that in his face. Not that I could.

I also listened to a lot of his trip reports on his podcasts. I remember him describing one of his DMT trips where he became aware that jesters were trying to tell him that he was taking himself too seriously in his life.

Maybe that's something you should also become aware of one day. I'm sure you've done some DMT.

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3 hours ago, traveler said:

 

for real... the OP got literally destroyed just now xD

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It's like he was saying that Oneness & Non-Duality is BS. (His ego-mind defenses are holding strong).

I commented to him 'Non duality is not BS. Saying that Non Duality is BS is the BS.

He also made a Completely Uneccesary and Completely Pointless video critizing Leo.

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@AdeptusPsychonautica

Do you think superhuman abilities are not possible, like literally impossible? In other words, do you think that God or ultimate reality or whatever is fundamentally logical at least of some sorts or as far as we're concerned as humans?

Or are you simply not convinced that we -humans- can have them on demand because there's no evidence for that?


If you have no confidence in yourself, you are twice defeated in the race of life. But with confidence you have won, even before you start.” -- Marcus Garvey

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6 minutes ago, Gesundheit said:

@AdeptusPsychonautica

Do you think superhuman abilities are not possible, like literally impossible? In other words, do you think that God or ultimate reality or whatever is fundamentally logical at least of some sorts or as far as we're concerned as humans?

There is nothing logical about reality. There can only be logical statements.


To balance beauty and complexity so perfectly is a divine mystery.

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Posted (edited)

12 hours ago, vinc3nc said:

@AdeptusPsychonautica

There's a difference between me coming to attack you on your YT channel (or forum, if you have one), telling you "hey, I don't like you, you're not open-minded, you're not a high conscious person, etc.", and making a random post on some random forum where my point is to show people something.

I had never done the former. I don't want to go out there telling people they're stupid in the face. You don't change people that way. And I don't care about other people on YT enough to do that.

The thing here is that you weren't supposed to see this post. I wouldn't have told you what I wrote here in person. That's what you have to understand. But here you are, seeing what you shouldn't have seen.

Anyway, the question that you have to ask yourself is why do you care so much about what random people say on some random forum? Do you expect that all of the people on this planet will like you and that no one will ever say anything bad about you or be critical of you? Will you always go out there defending yourself? What is there to defend? Why so insecure? Imagine having 1 Mio subs. Imagine how much criticism you might get. Will you spend 8 hours a day defending your ego?

Some people will like you, others won't. Some will even hate you. Why? Because they have problems with themselves. That's reality. Focus on your work - on your YT channel. Stop caring what people say about you. The right kind of people will be there for you. Ignore others. Ignore me. I'm just a random dude here. We will never meet in real life. I understand that you're trying to defend your image here, but let me tell you people won't like you more for that. You're defending an illusion.

I've never said anything bad about Rogan. Don't put words in my mouth. I've watched A LOT of his podcasts. He's had interesting people on his podcasts, and I've learned a lot from them, and even from Rogan himself. He's an interesting person in his own way, and more accomplished than we both together will ever be. Take nothing away from him. But I can still say, for example, that he has no clue about politics. And I can talk about this fact with my friends. But I would never tell him that in his face. Not that I could.

I also listened to a lot of his trip reports on his podcasts. I remember him describing one of his DMT trips where he became aware that jesters were trying to tell him that he was taking himself too seriously in his life.

Maybe that's something you should also become aware of one day. I'm sure you've done some DMT.

@vinc3nc

Here once again we see that lack of basic comprehension on display, so lets unpack this together. But first here is a little quote you might enjoy, please keep it in mind, you might find it useful later on.

"the last thing he wants is to admit he's been wrong all along"

OK, down to business! I genuinely don't care about being insulted, criticized, or that people might hate me - I think this is fairly obvious to anyone with common sense who has watched any of my content. What I do care about is rational honest discourse around the topic of psychedelics, and so when I see someone like yourself misrepresenting what I DID say, with some fantasy bullshit that they pulled out of their arse, well then I think thats something worth defending... don't you?

The fact that I can do so HERE, on the very forum populated by those who would continue to regurgitate such nonsense, is just a win win for me. You see I am not a fan of echo chambers, and I am even less of a fan of the pompous absurdity you and your fellow "high consciousness" cronies lavish upon yourself, so to be able to dismantle your bullshit on public display really is a treat for me. And I'm not gonna lie - I am finding this EXTREMELY entertaining, and I hope that enjoyment is coming across in my writing - so please lets not fall back on such tired tropes like "uuuuh why so defensive?".

And yes of course there is a difference between saying something to someone's face, or trying to have a crowing circle jerk within an echo chamber - one of these things requires a spine and a solid argument. 

This is really the fundamental difference between you and I. I don't need to misrepresent you or Leo, and all the cases where you think I have are PURE FANTASY. My criticisms are very specific, they are backed by direct quotes from the person I am discussing, and my arguments stand up. You might disagree with them, but they are not without merit. All I need to do with both this criticism of you, and my original criticism of Leo, is to reflect your own words back at you, highlight the absurdity or inaccuracy, and the cake just bakes itself. 

You on the other hand are pulling things out of your arse in order to fulfil a narrative you have invented, you show a shocking lack of critical thinking, and you dress this bullshit salad with a thick coating of your own egocentric ramblings (Leo has taught you well). The fact that you do all this while unironically prattling on about being "open minded" and "High Consciousness" - IS FUCKING EMBARRASSING. 

Now I'm just making an example of you here because you were the one who started this thread and have provided some of the more cringeworthy quotes, but really I'm addressing a good portion of the Actualized membership here, so please don't take this too personally. After all, I wouldn't want you to feel inferior 😉

So lets return to this little gem of wisdom - "the last thing he wants is to admit he's been wrong all along"

What do you think mate - are YOU big enough to admit you have been wrong all along? That maybe you started this thread in bad faith based on a false assumption that I was anti non-duality/spirituality? That you let your crowing ego get the better of you, and that maybe your much vaunted "high consciousness" isn't really all its cracked up to be? That perhaps you should stop doubling down and just own your bullshit?

How does that sit with you? Just take a few minutes to reflect and try it on for size, see how it fits...

Edited by AdeptusPsychonautica

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