Amit

Dangers of being a follower of Leo Gura

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I'm a follower of Leo's content for more than 4 years. I've watched almost every video each week, followed his insights and know some people in the community too. From all this experience into this work, I can infer that there's lots of dangers of it. I'll try to list few of those, would like you to add to the list. 

. Too much theory demands lots of time & effort, and you can't leave it in the middle, you've to be determined to finish it. 

. He's about transformation so work goes till the depth of your core belief structure to change it. But it can make your life worse, if you can't make sense of it. 

. Many layers of understanding to make sense of, It can leave you unstable and unfit for society if half done.

. You've to be intelligent enough to do the hard work, not possible for everyone, leaves people with huge egos acting spiritual and not understanding anything. 

. Makes you question everything around you, might make other people distant and hostile to you if you still have ego left. 

 

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That's right, there are many dangers.

But don't forget to consider the dangers of following someone else or no one at all ;)

You're damned if you do, and you're damned if you don't. Such is life. Ignorance cannot help being ignorant.


You are God. You are Love. You are Infinity. You are Leo.

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Enlightenment work or even self actualization work is hard. Most people won't achieve enlightenment or in fact, they won't even achieve self actualization. 

You can follow another guru but the end result will still be the same. 

Here's a list of self help gurus you can follow: ...

oh wait it doesn't matter. You still have to do the consciousness work by yourself.

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@Amit On an intersubjective level I'd argue that the goal shouldn't be to eliminate following, its impractical, simply because there's a vast percentage of people that are unable to or just not yet capable enough when it comes to being able to integrate reality, as a consequence they're forced to be a follower of what someone else has said. This will never change until we can or peoples systematically follow a means by which they upgrade their ability to process reality. 

On a personal level, the goal should always be higher integration of reality which means listening to everything reality has to offer, prioritising there as sensibly as possible.

 The only reason even "science" exists as a cultural phenomenon is because people are forced to follow one another as they're unable to research everything about reality by themselves, so they've invented this meme called science followed by a body of authorities that determine what gets to be published under that heading and what doesn't. Science follows this similar mechanism of theoretical prioritisation that an individual should also follow, one major gap about science is that its so concentrated on the outer world rather than what the individual should be concerning themselves with, how they come to know the world at all and to what level this is possible, this is of course one of sciences flaws, it has not properly conceded that its paradigm or any paradigm it produces is limited by the consciousness that discerns said related information about reality. 

This puts both the follower and discerner in a difficult but necessary and inescapable interesting conundrum which can be described as an interesting interplay between conductor trying to play the music of the universe and screwing up and instrumentalist trying to follow the conductors instructions about the universe while screwing up.

Edited by Origins

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Followers @Amit are a fascinating subset of the population (well actually most of the population is but hey haha) to study though, and I recommend doing so you'll learn some really interesting things about human behaviour, and there's demographics within every brand of follower that is similar across the board, there's always the religious ones be it sport, nation or celebrity archetype. 

They can of course be the most annoying haha, but still if you can just see it for what it is that annoyance can be easily transmuted for the benefit of understanding what exactly is happening rather than judging too harshly on either side (follower/followed).

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2 hours ago, Amit said:

Too much theory demands lots of time & effort

Many layers of understanding to make sense of

Getting lost in theory is really easy to do. Part of the problem is that too much information is available and a lot of it is contradictory. What may apply now may not apply later. And what applies to Bob may not apply to Tom. I think that most go through an information gathering stage until they reach a point of unbearable confusion. Which teacher is right? What is the next step? At some point you get real and understand the importance of first hand experience. Theory intake is reduced and practice taken more seriously. This is a very painful process.

What's interesting about Leo is that he shares way more information each week than can possibly be internalized. I personally think he'd be more effective if he were to release 15 minutes of highly concentrated content each week. Some topics require a more in depth explanation but two hour videos is overkill.

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I agree with most of the things said, but my point is to be aware of the specific path of leo, He is so much of theory, ofc he simplifies it very much but without direct experience, it soon becomes waste of time, for truly following along one has to take responsibility, which leo is not gonna force you upon. But it can become dangerous for people who just consumes the content and are scared of putting their best selves to the work, as they do not understand it's dangers and can fall pretty bad, worse than the people doing something else. So the main point is to either put ourselves fully into understanding or just leave. 

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Good clickbait haha! I thought it was going to be another angry person ranting about how were all sheep for listening to Leo!


It's just a ride.

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Yeah, you can't half-ass the work. I've  come to realise that this work is for like 2% of the population. The rest are simply not going to be able to do it, probably me included. You can understand what Leo is saying in his videos but if it isn't real for you in direct experience, then do not blindly go along with it, or worse - preach to other people about what Leo says. This will lose you plenty of friends and family.

I went all spiritual for a while and I wasn't ready for it. It messes with your head and then you realise you have to go back and live like a chimp for a while, doing lots of chimp activities with other chimps.

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Remember that all the theory you learn are MERELY BELIEFS  UNTIL YOU EMBODY THEM AND CONFIRM FOR YOURSELF. 

 

Look at theory as an invitation to a new perspective, NOTHING MORE. It's too easy to get stuck in your head. 

Direct experience is the only way. It can take years to really embody just a sliver of theory. 


“A master in the art of living draws no sharp distinction between his work and his play; his labor and his leisure; his mind and his body; his education and his recreation. He hardly knows which is which. He simply pursues his vision of excellence through whatever he is doing, and leaves others to determine whether he is working or playing. To himself, he always appears to be doing both.” — L. P. Jacks

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21 hours ago, Amit said:

I'm a follower of Leo's content for more than 4 years. I've watched almost every video each week, followed his insights and know some people in the community too. From all this experience into this work, I can infer that there's lots of dangers of it. I'll try to list few of those, would like you to add to the list. 

. Too much theory demands lots of time & effort, and you can't leave it in the middle, you've to be determined to finish it. 

. He's about transformation so work goes till the depth of your core belief structure to change it. But it can make your life worse, if you can't make sense of it. 

. Many layers of understanding to make sense of, It can leave you unstable and unfit for society if half done.

. You've to be intelligent enough to do the hard work, not possible for everyone, leaves people with huge egos acting spiritual and not understanding anything. 

. Makes you question everything around you, might make other people distant and hostile to you if you still have ego left. 

 

This can be said about personal transformation of all kinds through all systems.  Could be said about who you get in relationships with or what family you interact with or what society your apart of.

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1 hour ago, Mu_ said:

This can be said about personal transformation of all kinds through all systems.  Could be said about who you get in relationships with or what family you interact with or what society your apart of.

Not all systems, some systems have very minimal theory and mostly practices. 

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I think Leo's teachings are on advanced personal development and life purpose. He also teaches those who are seeking higher awakenings. So you have to be clear on what you want or seek.

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23 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You're damned if you do, and you're damned if you don't. Such is life. Ignorance cannot help being ignorant.

pretty much... 

 

a trap for me that i noticed was that practical aspects of life for me got neglected. listening to my own heart and intuition over other people's words. but this i noticed was not an issue solely with leo but i found occurring in other people as well. 

 

leo did mention these traps though

 

1 hour ago, Mu_ said:
23 hours ago, Amit said:

 

This can be said about personal transformation of all kinds through all systems

my guess for now is all systems of thought has their issues. like science, stoicism, law of attraction, new age perspectives, mainstream perspective, parents perspectives... 

Edited by Jacob Morres

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20 minutes ago, Mu_ said:

says who?

Truth need not be stated by anyone to be truth, it is what it is. 

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On 10/29/2020 at 5:10 AM, Amit said:

I'm a follower of Leo's content for more than 4 years. I've watched almost every video each week, followed his insights and know some people in the community too. From all this experience into this work, I can infer that there's lots of dangers of it. I'll try to list few of those, would like you to add to the list. 

. Too much theory demands lots of time & effort, and you can't leave it in the middle, you've to be determined to finish it. 

. He's about transformation so work goes till the depth of your core belief structure to change it. But it can make your life worse, if you can't make sense of it. 

. Many layers of understanding to make sense of, It can leave you unstable and unfit for society if half done.

. You've to be intelligent enough to do the hard work, not possible for everyone, leaves people with huge egos acting spiritual and not understanding anything. 

. Makes you question everything around you, might make other people distant and hostile to you if you still have ego left. 

 

On 10/29/2020 at 8:13 AM, ivory said:

Getting lost in theory is really easy to do. Part of the problem is that too much information is available and a lot of it is contradictory. What may apply now may not apply later. And what applies to Bob may not apply to Tom. I think that most go through an information gathering stage until they reach a point of unbearable confusion. Which teacher is right? What is the next step? At some point you get real and understand the importance of first hand experience. Theory intake is reduced and practice taken more seriously. This is a very painful process.

What's interesting about Leo is that he shares way more information each week than can possibly be internalized. I personally think he'd be more effective if he were to release 15 minutes of highly concentrated content each week. Some topics require a more in depth explanation but two hour videos is overkill.

@Amit @ivory OMG. Wow... you guys hit the nail on the fucking head.

God damn, can you read my thoughts or what? I wanted to make a thread about this for ages. You literally summarized the last 1-2 years of my life lol

 

@Leo Gura has been one of the greatest blessings and curses of my life (and many others that I talked to).

No doubt, Actualized.org is one of the most valuable gold mines that I have ever stumble upon. 

No doubt, Leo is one of if not THE most sophisticated intellectual on YouTube. And...

No doubt, I will forever be grateful for all things I had the honor and privilege to learn from him. It is truly a gift...

 

BUT

 

and this is a big but (not ambiguous). I believe that there is not a sufficient or good enough introduction/warnings/disclaimers/guidance along the way which help you navigate the utter amounts of theory Leo is presenting to us. These videos are a great start: 

I lost my shit a few times in the past but after watching 150 videos from Actualized.org I entered one of my biggest "mid-life crisis" (not mid-life actually but at a very young age) which fucked with my head so much that it took me an entire year to rebuild my work ethic and get my life back together. It was one of the most confusing times of my life (the integration is not over). I appreciate it because I know that this gives birth to massive growth: where you are going through is where you are coming out of but it still sucks and I am sure that there are many who simply cannot handle this stuff. 

This video puts it really well:

Yes, Leo does warn you sometimes, but I do not think that it is nearly enough. I feel as though he teaches a really masculine spirituality (left brain, intellectual, mind, etc.). Which is great because this is how you convert atheists (like my former self) into open-minded, somewhat spiritual human beings that strive to 'achieve' self-actualization, Spiral Dynamics Tier Two, or enlightenment. Unfortionaly, (imo) Leo heavily neglects practice, action (= ACTUALITY), and the more feminine side of spirituality (head chakra, right brain, emotions, Sadhguru stylish, etc.) even though the name of this website is Actualized.org and his highest teaching is LOVE. 

On 10/29/2020 at 5:14 AM, Leo Gura said:

That's right, there are many dangers.

But don't forget to consider the dangers of following someone else or no one at all ;)

You're damned if you do, and you're damned if you don't. Such is life. Ignorance cannot help being ignorant.

On 10/29/2020 at 5:38 AM, hyruga said:

You can follow another guru but the end result will still be the same. 

 

I do not agree. There are many teachers and gurus that are way more focused on practice. Obviously, that has its downsides as well. 

When I first discovered Leo I loved how he cuts the BULLSHIT and just tells you DIRECTLY what the fuck is going on (again, very masculine energy). But nowadays I value more and more a teaching style that encourages seeking instead of stuffing the answer into your face. Even Leo admitted that multiple times in the past. I do not say it's good or bad, it just has its pros and cons. 

I just went through Dr. Joe Dispenza's workshops recently and I gotta say that I am impressed. I am amazed at how Dr. Joe actually ACTUALIZES the teachings from Actualized.org lol. Let it be quantum physics, Love, mystical experiences, OBEs, "miracle" healings, you name it... Dr. Joe's YouTube channel is stuffed with testimonials that attest to all of it (in record time). 

Be wise and realize if you are NOT ready yet. I certainly wasn't. It is painful but necessary! I love all of the stuff Leo is teachings, I even was addicted to his videos and theory in general but I had to come to terms with the fact that I have much more fundamental and hedonistic needs to meet before I can transcend my ass into heaven. 

Get your shit together! Most people need to put their heads down and build a solid life purpose for the next 10 years.

 

Conclusion@Leo Gura with great power comes great responsibility, your teachings go to the core! They are one of the most potent ones on the internet... please stress the importance of practice more and do your best to help newbies navigate this stuff otherwise there will be more people that get lost like this:

Rule of thumb: For every 10% theory you consume go out and do 90% action.

This post puts my critique in a nutshell:

I would say that at least for me the positives definitely out whey the negatives, the path Leo put me on is invaluable. Nonetheless, you put my mind through the wringer, big-time haha

Thank you for that & much love <3

 


"The journey never ends, the point of arrival is always now." 

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@Spiral Wizard Thanks for the feedback. I don't really disagree with you. I'm just at a point in my development where practice and action are not that interesting to talk about. It's like teaching people how to brush their teeth and tie their shoelaces.


You are God. You are Love. You are Infinity. You are Leo.

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