DefinitelyNotARobot

Vaush vs. Tim Pool

31 posts in this topic

@Forestluv You brought up a very important point: It's not just about the arguments themselves, but also about how you present them.

For example: A lot of right-wingers like to believe that they are very rational and logical people, who have transcended the concept of emotions entirely (I am looking at you Ben!), while left-wingers are overly irrational, emotionally unstable, triggered SJW's who are stuck in the world of 2016 Buzzfeed, so having someone like Vaush on Tim's show is good for optics. Most of the viewers minds probably haven't been changed over that single exchange, but it might have planted a seed in some of their minds, especially some of more open-minded ones.

I think that people have to be more mindful of how they present themselves and their ideas. You won't get most people just through pure logic.

I often hear centrists/liberals who turn conservative make the point that the people at the Trump rally's were "so much nicer than the people on the left." And there's probably some truth to that, even if there are different reasons as to why that is.


beep boop

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Vaush here is like a grizzly bear on a leash at a dinner party.


You are God. You are Truth. You are Love. You are Infinity.

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1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

Vaush here is like a grizzly bear on a leash at a dinner party.

I kept waiting for Vaush to snap and rip Tim to shreds. The intellectual version of gore video. 

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He had to be extra cautious because he knew he was on massive platform and he didn't want to alienate anyone.

I admire Vaush's sophistication about converting right-wingers. He's very clever about it.

See, the thing with debates is, they are all about optics. He who appears most calm and rational wins. Of course this has nothing to do with truth, but dumb people only understand optics. Ranting in a public debate will backfire.


You are God. You are Truth. You are Love. You are Infinity.

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12 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Ranting in a public debate will backfire.

Unless your name is Trump in which case you should rant as much as humanly possible!


beep boop

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19 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

See, the thing with debates is, they are all about optics. He who appears most calm and rational wins. Of course this has nothing to do with truth, but dumb people only understand optics. Ranting in a public debate will backfire.

In the first 2000 presidential debate, Al Gore was leagues higher than George Bush on knowledge and intellect. Yet the next day, most people were talking about how Gore was sighing and rolling his eyes (to Bush's stupidity) throughout the debate. Gore came across as an arrogant know-it-all and Bush came across as a "regular guy".  Hence, Bush "won" the debate in most people's eyes - in spite of his ignorance. 

4 minutes ago, DefinitelyNotARobot said:

Unless your name is Trump in which case you should rant as much as humanly possible!

I thought the same thing after the first debate - yet Biden was considered the victor and got a measurable post-debate bounce. So much so that Trump tried to control himself during the second debate. 

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2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Vaush here is like a grizzly bear on a leash at a dinner party.

Vaushfield calmly poking at the lasagna.

Ej_l2QUVcAAKXYm.jpg


Intrinsic joy is revealed in the marriage of meaning and being.

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56 minutes ago, DefinitelyNotARobot said:

Unless your name is Trump in which case you should rant as much as humanly possible!

Actually it seemed to backfire on Trump. Most people were turned off by his ranting.

When you rant, it's preaching the choir. It makes your loyalists happy, but it doesn't convert any new people to your movement.

That's one of the reasons I've had to dial back my rants. If it wasn't for this, my rants would be off the hook, Lewis Black style.


You are God. You are Truth. You are Love. You are Infinity.

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41 minutes ago, Forestluv said:

So much so that Trump tried to control himself during the second debate. 

Which tells us a lot. He probably thought that he could pull another 2016 on us, just to realize that it wouldn't work this time around. People didn't take him seriously enough in the 2016 elections and he thought that he could get away with the same shenanigans yet again. Luckily things have changed. People started taking him way more seriously now. They're fed up and angry. A lot of them scared. Scared of what another 4 years of Trump might bring. I know I am.

1 minute ago, Leo Gura said:

When you rant, it's preaching the choir. It makes your loyalists happy, but it doesn't convert any new people to your movement.

I hope you're right. Trump does seem to have become more and more unhinged lately, which gets him into a lot of trouble. I mean he gives me a pretty desperate vibe now.

First he can't denounce the proud boys. The right is happy, but now the left starts putting pressure on him. This alienates a lot of his potential centrist voters, who don't want to be associated with some far-right militia. He now has to retract his statement and denounce the proud boys in an attempt to move back towards the center, but the proud boys hate that! Just look at their reactions!

I think that he might actually have moved too far to the right. It doesn't do him any good!


beep boop

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