Nofap, porn and masturbation

[Carl-Richard]

I've been at both ends of the spectrum. Both extremes are born out of resistance; you can notice that resistance when you try to "milk it" (fap too often) or if you try to deny it (fap too little). Nofap might seem like it's healthy at first, but at the extremes, it's truly just classic repression, and it made me more emotionally numb than I've ever been in my life.

[TrynaBeTurquoise]

I went a full year and then some around 2 years ago with no porn and hardly no masturbation, it does have benefits in looking to talk to girls and just going for it with them. But in a relationship I think its good to be careful with that extra horniness or at least be aware of unwanted effects it might have and then choose how much P or O is healthy for them. 

[freeman194673]

10 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

it's truly just classic repression, and it made me more emotionally numb than I've ever been in my life.

Tell this to Tesla who was a celibate for his entire life.

It's repression if you don't have an outlet,if you do not transmute your sexual energy into creative energy.

[Dlavjr]

I feel like it's not necessarily if you jerk off so much as when, tbh. I think so long as you aren't addicted to it and you don't feel like you HAVE to make time to do it, it's not really a problem. So far, in doing nofap, I agree with all of you that I just feel like I'm repressing urges. Maybe that goes away, I guess I'll find out. I've only ever felt negative affects from masturbation if I do it excessively or if I do it prior to doing something that requires me to utilize a lot of energy. So like before a workout I'd say it'd be negative. But I feel like a lot of the effects that the nofap community warn you about are more so effects of the addiction.  

[stopwow]

What is so wrong with physical expressions of love, including physical expressions of self love? Aren't they beautiful?

[SgtPepper]

I personally like and participate in nofap. Ever since I learned about it, I have done PMO way less and plan to get rid of completely.

Spiritually and personally, I do not see it as helpful in my path to living with Love/God or self-actualization. I could always been doing something better. 

Sometimes masturbation could be self-love or physical expressions of love with someone else. Other times it's straight up hedonism. Your mind will take otherwise innocents who are like you and twist them into pawns in your imagination for your own pleasure, its opposite to love. 

It's better to express love with someone you love and loving you back.

[Fishy]

11 hours ago, stopwow said:

What is so wrong with physical expressions of love, including physical expressions of self love? Aren't they beautiful?

Yea cause porn is so loving lol

[stopwow]

Does nofap refer to abstaining from all masturbation, or just masturbating while viewing porn?  I'm not sure if I had the correct definition. I wasn't referring to masturbating while watching porn (I'm against that), just simple self-love. Some men have difficulty finding a partner due to physical or mental disabilities. Maybe they are physically unattractive. Involuntary celibates do exist. Should they give up orgasms? I suspect that sometimes sexual repression leads to sexual crime, such as priests that molest children. I suppose it is possible that those that don't masturbate aren't forced to "give up" anything because they don't crave it in the first place. I don't crave meat and "give up" nothing because I don't like it.

[Dlavjr]

39 minutes ago, stopwow said:

Does nofap refer to abstaining from all masturbation, or just masturbating while viewing porn?  I'm not sure if I had the correct definition. I wasn't referring to masturbating while watching porn (I'm against that), just simple self-love. Some men have difficulty finding a partner due to physical or mental disabilities. Maybe they are physically unattractive. Involuntary celibates do exist. Should they give up orgasms? I suspect that sometimes sexual repression leads to sexual crime, such as priests that molest children. I suppose it is possible that those that don't masturbate aren't forced to "give up" anything because they don't crave it in the first place. I don't crave meat and "give up" nothing because I don't like it.

Nofap generally means abstaining from all orgasm entirely but I'm pretty sure most just abstain from masturbation. From what I've looked into, the idea is to pretty much repress all sexual urges, like don't even touch yourself, for 90 days, and it should "reset" you mind and reverse the damage of porn. 

I'm not for or against either side of the porn argument, I think porn is one of the slipperiest slopes because there are benefits to porn in moderation but it's extremely easy and common for people to become addicted, to the point that it's actually normal and expected. It's also dangerous that many people discover it so young, but what can be done about that? 

My initial question that I proposed in this chat is, does masturbation, with or without porn, really damage the average person as much as nofap says? Or is nofap really only beneficial to those that masturbate/watch porn excessively? A lot of what I've looked at from people that swear by nofap is just former addicts. I think it's to the same light that nobody in AA is gonna say "yeah enjoy alcohol in moderation", they're all most likely going to demonize it. They almost have to, because that's the only way they don't relapse. So I think nofap blows things out of proportion. A lot of the people I've spoken to about nofap that practice it just kind if assume that everyone that doesn't practice is a porn addict and jerks off every day twice a day. 

[freeman194673]

3 hours ago, Dlavjr said:

It's also dangerous that many people discover it so young,

@Dlavjr it's not dangerous,it's sad.

it fucks your brain up as a kid, a 12 years old kid watching triple penetration gangbang with midgets and shit like that.

3 hours ago, Dlavjr said:

Or is nofap really only beneficial to those that masturbate/watch porn excessively?

watching porn is not like eating food.

so don't compare nofap with fasting.

 

Imo semen retention is highly beneficial if you are transmuting your energy into creative energy.

I had some streaks and I was radiating with magnetism and creativity.

Discussing it doesn't do much,try 90 days semen retention and see for yourself.

and let me know how it went.

 

 

[Fishy]

@Dlavjr can you explain these benefits of porn you are talking about? 

[Dlavjr]

3 hours ago, Fishy said:

@Dlavjr can you explain these benefits of porn you are talking about? 

It's release. Sexual urges are distracting, not everybody wants to pursue sex but suppressing your sexuality can result in some serious damage to your psyche. Usually I go a few days to a week before I feel like I need to almost flush out the system in a sense, and porn just kinda makes it easier. Plus, watching women solo is, in my opinion, a beautiful thing because it's a lot less glorified and it's more of watching a woman please herself naturally, and it also doesn't really affect you view women or sex, at least not for me. I've never had problems with sex, or approaching women, or creativity. I'm a musician, I spend a lot of time practicing and studying music and I'm a pretty efficient guy, honestly the once or twice a week jerk off just kinda keeps my mind clear so I can stay focused on creating the vision I have for myself rather than waste time feeling lonely and wanting to pursue women romantically when I don't really have the time. 

[Danioover9000]

@freeman194673

5 hours ago, freeman194673 said:

@Dlavjr it's not dangerous,it's sad.

it fucks your brain up as a kid, a 12 years old kid watching triple penetration gangbang with midgets and shit like that.

watching porn is not like eating food.

so don't compare nofap with fasting.

 

Imo semen retention is highly beneficial if you are transmuting your energy into creative energy.

I had some streaks and I was radiating with magnetism and creativity.

Discussing it doesn't do much,try 90 days semen retention and see for yourself.

and let me know how it went.

 

 

    Nofap is an addiction recovery program, like addiction programs that are designed around obesity, alcohol, gambling, hard drugs, hoarding e.c.t. just that it's fairly recent. Designed for who?

   Porn is a medium for procreation, as important as drinking and eating. When you've eaten and drank, you feel full and hydrated. Same as porn, you feel a sexual release. 

[Dlavjr]

I'd like to partially revive this thread to ask one question, as I didn't really think it was a question worthy of it's own separate thread. Where do sex toys land in terms of "masturbation being bad"? My understanding is that the reason why jerking off is bad, or one of, is that your brain will switch over into believing that porn/masturbation is what sex is, and it can lead to premature ejaculation. I can certainly see this being true for those who masturbate excessively. However sex toys have developed to be pretty lifelike, for men and women alike. In terms of how it psychologically affects you, how might a sex toy differ from just jerking off? Is there any difference? Note: I've never used a sex toy in my life, at least not in terms of the masturbatory ones like fleshlights etc. 

Strange question, I know, but it got me to contemplate. 

[Shiva99]

22 minutes ago, Dlavjr said:

However sex toys have developed to be pretty lifelike, for men and women alike. In terms of how it psychologically affects you, how might a sex toy differ from just jerking off?

They don't differ if you are addicted. It's all about the chemicals that get released when you have real sex with a real human being. It's about the bonding and the release of oxytocin. For an addict even real sex can be the same as simply  jerking it, because of the pathways that get activated in his/her brain. I suggest reading the book: "Cupid's poisoned arrow" by Marnia Robinson. Explains a whole lot.

I've also heard that fleshlights come pretty close to the real thing, sometimes even better than the real thing. It's pretty obvious that it doesn't lead to anything good. I feel like you will simply just train your brain over time to use a plastic toy instead of the real thing, and it doesn't require any effort from your part, so it's the perfect escape from pain for the brain.

Edited June 16, 2020 by Shiva99