Leo - are you in ‘Permanent Non-dual Awareness’?

[Leo Gura]

@Roy My top 5 haven't changed much.

Understanding is still my highest.

[Raptorsin7]

@Leo Gura We are infinite beings. Won't your understand just go infinitely deep and you'll be chasing your infinite tail for infinity?

[Leo Gura]

3 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

@Leo Gura We are infinite beings. Won't your understand just go infinitely deep and you'll be chasing your infinite tail for infinity?

You won't know until you try.

Besides which, you got something better to do?

[Raptorsin7]

@Leo Gura Yeah, better is feeling amazing. Which i don't think is achieved by chasing insights to infinity. 

Seek better feeling, not more understanding. Better feeling has an end point and is satiating, understanding will take you forever.

[WHO IS]

Leo you said this:

Quote

Personally I don't like practices where I have to force myself to do something. To me harsh discipline doesn't feel loving or right. 

But at the same time in other thread you told me, when I said that I don't agree that it is "loving" for God to give me illness, You said that it is because my POV is biased. And that from God's POV healing people or torturing a child is both Love. 

However, here You write that harsh discipline doesn't feel loving for you, yet you expect me to accept that healing someone and torturing a child is both loving things. 

Edited March 25, 2020 by WHO IS

[WHO IS]

Leo, didnt You say that there only exist the things that are in your view/proximity, so if you are in your room, that room is the only that exist.

However, You are now mentioning DMT worlds, which would mean that there are worlds existing simultaneously while you being inside the room, Which would contradict the notion that only the things one sees in one's own proximity are the only thing that exists. 

[Leo Gura]

18 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

@Leo Gura Yeah, better is feeling amazing. Which i don't think is achieved by chasing insights to infinity. 

Seek better feeling, not more understanding. Better feeling has an end point and is satiating, understanding will take you forever.

By seeking feeling better, you doom yourself to a life of suffering and misery.

UNDERSTANDING is the most important thing! Understanding solves every problem.

The reason you don't feel good is because you don't understand enough.

14 minutes ago, WHO IS said:

Leo you said this:

But at the same time in other thread you told me, when I said that I don't agree that it is "loving" for God to give me illness, You said that it is because my POV is biased. And that from God's POV healing people or torturing a child is both Love. 

However, here You write that harsh discipline doesn't feel loving for you, yet you expect me to accept that healing someone and torturing a child is both loving things. 

You are confusing two different things.

Of course harsh discipline is still Love in the absolute sense. I just said here that it's not how I choose to live my life.

The more conscious you become the more effortless and loving you'll want to live your life. For example, you'll have less desire to murder people. That doesn't mean murder isn't Love in the absolute sense. But if I'm choosing how to live my life, and I'm conscious about it, I will choose not to murder people. This doesn't change the fact that murder is still Love. But not-murdering is more in alignment with higher levels of consciousness. So if I see someone murdering another, I will totally understand it as Love. But that doesn't mean I will engage in the murder myself, or support it politically. Because I can still have a desire for a society where murder isn't common. That is how a higher consciousness being chooses to express its Love.

The more conscious you become, the more "godly" you will want to act. The more conscious I become, the less desire I have to force myself to do stuff. Effortlessness is a higher quality of God, even though all qualities are qualities of God.

[WHO IS]

Then, wouldn't You agree that having a healthy physical body is a better more functional choice for a more effortless life one earth, compared to a body with illness(es)? All that time going into trying to fix the body's health could be used for higher consciousness goals, etc. 

That's why, I was wondering in that thread in the first place, why would God, which is the Highest Level of Consciousness, consciously give illness to a human on earth. When You say "if I'm choosing how to live my life, and I'm conscious about it, I will choose not to murder people.", It sounds like You as a Being have a higher-consciousness level, then God who gives all kinds of illness to folk!  

Edited March 25, 2020 by WHO IS

[Leo Gura]

4 minutes ago, WHO IS said:

Then, wouldn't You agree that having a healthy physical body is a better more functional choice for a more effortless life one earth, compared to a body with illness(es)? All that time going into trying to fix the body's health could be used for higher consciousness goals, etc. 

Yes, but this is still within the domain of the relative and survival.

This is correct from the human perspective.

But there is a much higher perspective.

Quote

That's why, I was wondering in that thread in the first place, why would God, which is the Highest Level of Consciousness, consciously give illness to a human on earth. When You say "if I'm choosing how to live my life, and I'm conscious about it, I will choose not to murder people.", It sounds like You as a Being have a higher-consciousness level, then God who gives all kinds of illness to folk. 

From the highest perspective, God sees no difference between anything. In its eyes, nothing is ever wrong or bad. It doesn't see illness as bad and it does not recognize survival as any more important than non-survival.

This is the Absolute domain.

You are mixing up the relative and absolute domains.

[Salvijus]

@Leo Gura I think what @Raptorsin7 meant is to reach a state where you are satisfied and satiated with yourself no matter what consciousness level you are whether It's ulta consciousness or super ultra consciouness or super duper ultra consciouness. You know. Just being in total contentment 24/7. And then all those insights and deepening of consciouness happen automatically. It just becomes sweeter and sweeter every day but you're not chasing it. You're just marinating in it all the time in full joy. I think this is a classic aproach that is taught by the todays spiritual teachers.

And you can see people like echkart tolle or Mooji they gave up the search, they no longer have to meditate and they are completely satiafied and without lacking anything anymore. but they are still evolving without doing anything. Just live your life, life is evolution, it happens by itself in it's own speed, in it's most appropriate way and time.

Like Mooji says, there's still refining and maturing of consciousness happening in me against the background of unchanging awareness. 

This refining of consciousness can probably go on forever. What's important is to find the ever lasting peace and happyness. Then you can still do all those other things if you still want to.

Edited March 25, 2020 by Salvijus

[Leo Gura]

4 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

@Leo Gura I think what @Raptorsin7 meant is to reach a state where you are satisfied and satiated no matter what consciousness level you are whether It's ulta consciousness ir super ultra consciouness or super duper ultra consciouness. You know. Just being in total contentment 24/7. And then all those insights and deepening of consciouness happen automatically. It just becomes sweeter and sweeter every day but you're not chasing it. You're just marinating in in all the time in full joy. I think this is a classic aproach that is taught by the todays spiritual teachers.

Sure, that's a good thing. I'm not against that.

But there is a trap there. If you quit seeking too early, if you become too satisified with yourself too early, you will not reach the highest level of God realization. There has to be a certain thirst for higher understanding.

Most spiritual teachers today sell their students short. They don't give students a proper understanding of the depth of God realization possible. They only take their students half-way up the mountain. This is a great shame. Their students never realize what God truly is.

Quote

And you can are people like echkart tolle or Mooji they gave up the search, they no longer have to meditate, but they are still evolving without doing anything. Just live your life, life is evolution, it happens by itself in it's own speed, in it's most appropriate way and time.

There is much higher to go than Tolle or Mooji.

[WHO IS]

I understand now that there this two POV, the absolute and hte relative. However, we still exist here on earth as humans, on a relative , survival game. And if we are talking about us individually choosing how we each would like to live our lifes, it makes one to really think how much really "freedom of choice" do we really have.

I too, would not want to murder somebody, and would rather see the earth being a peaceful place. However, it is still part of earth, reality, murder etc. So does one really have a choice? And even if one makes the right choices, reality can still "bite" one's ass. 

That's why, I wonder, why wouldn't God make his canvas to be made with the highest expression of the highest level of consciousness, without the lower consciousness elements. Like a world, without diseases, getting older, etc. 

DMT worlds, show how wildly, different existence, can be, how much different realty-worlds can be. So why not turn our world into a more heavenly place?

Edited March 25, 2020 by WHO IS

[Leo Gura]

8 minutes ago, WHO IS said:

That's why, I wonder, why wouldn't God make his canvas to be made with the highest expression of the highest level of consciousness, without the lower consciousness elements. Like a world, without diseases, getting older, etc. 

God HAS made this world the highest expression of consciousness and love.

But you are not conscious enough to see it. Because you're stuck in the relative survival domain.

The problem is, your idea of "highest expression of love" is incorrect. God's idea of it correct. And it has been made actual.

Love is a very counter-intuitive thing. You think it should be all rainbows and butterflies, but that's wrong! That's not the highest love. The highest love includes viruses and death and suffering. Why? Because the highest Love must even love viruses, death, and suffering! The highest Love must be unconditional.

The problem is you hate viruses, death, and suffering. Because you are selfish. But God does not hate those things. Because God is selfless.

Stop asking God to stoop down to your level. Instead, muster the courage to raise your perspective to God's level. So you can appreciate the Love.

 

[WHO IS]

6 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

God HAS made this world the highest expression of consciousness and love.

But you are not conscious enough to see it. Because you're stuck in the relative survival domain.

The problem is, your idea of "highest expression of love" is incorrect. God's idea of it correct. And it has been made actual.

Stop asking God to stoop down to your level. Instead, muster the courage to raise your perspective to God's level. So you can appreciate the Love.

Im not ruling out this possibility, that indeed, God created this world with the highest expression of consciousness and love. And that it is me who should go to closer God's level to see that he is right, it seems more logical that God has a better perspective of things. 

However, for example, the DMT realms, how amazingly beautiful and wonderous they are, aren't they? So worlds could be more wondrous then ours, cant they? If our world was the apex-creation made of as the highest expression of love, then why would people fell in love and say how much more amazing and unspeakably beautiful the DMT worlds are, appearing more real then ours?

Edited March 25, 2020 by WHO IS

[Salvijus]

14 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

if you become too satisified with yourself too early, you will not reach the highest level of God realization.

Maybe there is no such thing. Maybe it goes on forever.

Like Mooji says, there's still refining and maturing of consciousness happening in me against the background of unchanging awareness. 

This refining of consciousness can probably go on forever. I think what's more important is to find the ever lasting peace and happyness which is your own Self. Then you can still do all those other things if you still want to.

Edited March 25, 2020 by Salvijus

[Leo Gura]

5 minutes ago, WHO IS said:

However, for example, the DMT realms, how amazingly beautiful and wonderous they are, aren't they? So worlds could be more wondrous then ours, cant they?

This is still a relative value judgment you're making.

The middle of Iraq is as wonderful and amazing and beautiful as the DMT realm.

But this requires great consciousness to see. You take our world for granted because you're so used to it. But the DMT aliens would be amazed if they ever entered our world.

[Derek White]

5 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

. I think what's more important is to find the ever lasting peace and happyness

That is a relatively easy thing to do. Just practice letting go. 

[WHO IS]

 

6 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

This is still a relative value judgment you're making.

The middle of Iraq is as wonderful and amazing and beautiful as the DMT realm.

But this requires great consciousness to see. You take our world for granted because you're so used to it. But the DMT aliens would be amazed if they ever entered our world.

I see now that it was foolish for me think so, thank you for opening my mind, so to speak. It is indeed, about the POV and the level of consciousness  of the specific POV. 

Leo, however, If You dont mind, I have to clarify something that You are teaching. You are saying that when one is in his/her room, that room is the only thing that exist. But when we talk about dmt worlds and the dmt aliens, wouldn't that mean that there are other worlds/canvases like the dmt worlds with its own inhabitants which exist simultaneously, while one is in his/her room. 

 

Edited March 25, 2020 by WHO IS

[Salvijus]

2 minutes ago, Derek White said:

That is a relatively easy thing to do. Just practice letting go. 

I do that, thank you

[Derek White]

3 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

I do that, thank you

It also includes letting go of beliefs and connecting with direct experience, with what is.