Sad but True; There are no illusions. You're just unable to accept yourself.

[Lento]

Pathetic humans. I always say.

[Visionary]

46 minutes ago, Consilience said:

See, I'm not sure it's really appropriate to call the journey as a human an illusion; I'm not sure if that's even what you're saying though.

The illusion is the separation. The illusion is thinking "I am this particular one and other's are not me" when in actuality, it's all one happening, all one. But the oneness itself is being expressed as a singular, infinitely unique, finite form and that's the mindfuck. This finitude is not illusory, it is how experience is unfolding, it is actuality. But within this finitude contains an unseparated field of infinity and wholeness. So strange. 

And at the same time there is no real difference between potentiality and actuality. Both can only exist because of eachother.

[VeganAwake]

@Visionary This is off of his website and is the part of his work that I don't agree with at all and it's a pretty big part:

"but you cannot resolve the oscillating seasons of ego until each pattern is wholeheartedly embraced, honored, and nurtured as never before".

See his whole message falls apart right here....

You don't want to embrace honor and nurture something that literally creates separation.

It's essentially like feeding the cancer that harms your body protein shakes.

From what I can tell it's a complete misunderstanding of how the ego functions and works within the human organism.

I don't need to follow or read all of his material in depth...his whole message falls apart right here... and I can tell it's a lack of understanding and true experience.

It doesn't mean I don't have unconditional love for the guy.❤..I just don't think he really knows what he's talking about especially when it comes to Enlightenment work.

Please watch this video and understand why it doesn't make any sense to love, embrace and nurture the ego...

❤

[lmfao]

Everything which exists is real. So thoughts, feelings, etc are all real. 

However, the word "real" is often used in a slightly different sense when someone says something like "time isn't real" or "thoughts aren't real". What is not real is that which causes a conflation of the "map for the territory". I'm using this idiom because it's concise and most people on this forum know what it means, not because I hide behind it as a concept. 

Now the important question arises, what does it mean to conflate the map for the territory? I haven't precisely figured it out. Who is it that is conflating the map for the territory? You would be very much correct in saying that the conflation of the map for the territory is a real happening, however other people would prefer to use the word "real" in a different sense in their descriptions of this process. Various things can be described as unreal because they are structures which cause "false perception". Describing something as not real has great functional use in communication, in my opinion. 

Edited December 20, 2019 by lmfao

[Surfingthewave]

@ivankiss Stirring up the non duality pot again I see. Good for you, how's tricks? ? 

[Visionary]

1 hour ago, VeganAwake said:

@Visionary This is off of his website and is the part of his work that I don't agree with at all and it's a pretty big part:

"but you cannot resolve the oscillating seasons of ego until each pattern is wholeheartedly embraced, honored, and nurtured as never before".

See his whole message falls apart right here....

You don't want to embrace honor and nurture something that literally creates separation.

It's essentially like feeding the cancer that harms your body protein shakes.

From what I can tell it's a complete misunderstanding of how the ego functions and works within the human organism.

I don't need to follow or read all of his material in depth...his whole message falls apart right here... and I can tell it's a lack of understanding and true experience.

It doesn't mean I don't have unconditional love for the guy.❤..I just don't think he really knows what he's talking about especially when it comes to Enlightenment work.

Please watch this video and understand why it doesn't make any sense to love, embrace and nurture the ego...

❤

I see where you're coming from brother, but when he speaks of Honour its actually an awareness through the Heart. The ultimate way of perceiving reality is actually through the Heart. The intimacy of consciousness is best seen through the Heart. Trying to solve separation is actually separation. Love is the true understanding of this separative fantasy. The Zen monks also speak of resting the mind in the Heart. 

Edit: Nisargadatta Maharaj was strictly against turning enlightened masters into some deities. He had a clinical, clean realization of Truth. Nothing mattered to him anymore. There was only the Absolute and thats even before Beingness. Yet, he spend his whole life as a devotee after the realization. He loved other people so incredibly much he nearly kissed their feet. He saw the Absolute in others. He saw how separation made this Love truly truly special. Its about realizing God and embodying it. God wants to live in the flesh through us. Just as bad as we want to realize Him. Separation makes ultimate Love so much more special.

Edited December 20, 2019 by Visionary

[JonasVE12]

When we hear the word illusion, we automatically get the notion that we’re talking about something that seems real, but isn’t. It’s important to know that real/Unreal doesn’t exist. ‘Unreal’ is a human concept and is only a projection of the mind. Everything is exactly as it is. All direct experience being experienced is real. our thoughts, emotions, imagination are real. They are all real from the pov of the ego mind. our individual existance, our awareness, is bound to mind. Mind is bound to duality, to forms. We experience the world through these forms and in our experience, they are real, to our mind.

We are pure infinity. The formless dimension which precedes, and contains all forms. From this pov, all forms are finite constructions within infinity, from infinity. Illusion is just a human concept.

[Highest]

On 19/12/2019 at 6:15 AM, Dlavjr said:

 

Sorry Dlavjr, couldn't get it away. 

I just know this. Last night was real. The about 8 times we did it was real. The weed was real. The love was real.

When I suddenly after smoking and looking at a picture slipped into a state where I became conscious in some few seconds that I literally designed that shit, that was also real. 

This is now a story, a memory. It still really happened. Both the story and memory is real. 

I refuse to accept this advaita hindu buddha notion of illusion. The only illusion there is, is to believe that illusion itself is unreal. 

Edited December 20, 2019 by Highest

[Dlavjr]

29 minutes ago, Highest said:

Sorry Dlavjr, couldn't get it away. 

I just know this. Last night was real. The about 8 times we did it was real. The weed was real. The love was real.

When I suddenly after smoking and looking at a picture slipped into a state where I became conscious in some few seconds that I literally designed that shit, that was also real. 

This is now a story, a memory. It still really happened. Both the story and memory is real. 

I refuse to accept this advaita hindu buddha notion of illusion. The only illusion there is, is to believe that illusion itself is unreal. 

Everything is ultimately Real in the absolute grand scheme of things. It's been created, it's not just "not there", but the part that's "unreal" is the story. You can enjoy life in the moment and look back fondly at things but ultimately everything is just a story and the illusion is that this life is anything different than the wild dreams you have. Everything is experienced within consciousness, it just doesn't hold the weight that people think it does. You can't get caught up in the story, the "content", if you're aware of the grand scheme of consciousness, the "structure". Everything is merely perspective, an endless array of perspectives. The argument of whether everything is "real" or "unreal" is pretty pointless, and just a duality. Once again getting caught up in content and missing the whole point of the infinite beauty and love that exists regardless of this argument. You can go back and forth all day, but where do you draw the line between illusion and non-illusion? The more you try to draw a line, the clearer it becomes that that line does not exist. Everything ultimately exists as one. 

[Highest]

17 minutes ago, Dlavjr said:

Everything is ultimately Real in the absolute grand scheme of things. It's been created, it's not just "not there", but the part that's "unreal" is the story. You can enjoy life in the moment and look back fondly at things but ultimately everything is just a story and the illusion is that this life is anything different than the wild dreams you have. Everything is experienced within consciousness, it just doesn't hold the weight that people think it does. You can't get caught up in the story, the "content", if you're aware of the grand scheme of consciousness, the "structure". Everything is merely perspective, an endless array of perspectives. The argument of whether everything is "real" or "unreal" is pretty pointless, and just a duality. Once again getting caught up in content and missing the whole point of the infinite beauty and love that exists regardless of this argument. You can go back and forth all day, but where do you draw the line between illusion and non-illusion? The more you try to draw a line, the clearer it becomes that that line does not exist. Everything ultimately exists as one. 

8

On 19/12/2019 at 6:15 AM, Dlavjr said:

 

I see what you are saying. 

I think this is indeed a matter of consciousness. You can get to a level of consciousness where you become so conscious, you literally become God. You literally become conscious that all is imagined by you as God etc. 

When you come back to lesser level of consciousness so to say, you now say it's an illusion etc. 

Ultimately All is One indeed, all IS GOD. 

But I know that I am all levels and states of consciousness, I am consciousness itself. And within this consciousness, I like to enjoy one thing: my direct aware experience. What happens in this experience is neither real or unreal, it simply IS. 

Enjoy being God and human at the same time ?

[Ero]

@ivankiss You've come full circle, so the words "real" and "illusion" have an entirely different connotation for you, which is nice.

Just don't forget that some have to still walk it to realize what you're writing about. 

[MAYA EL]

The funny thing is that everything is backwards in this world right now. 

It's just like the masons like to say "as above so below " good is called bad and bad is called good and the popular belief right now is non-duality and thinking everything is an illusion. 

But does illusion by the definition we understand it by even exist?  Because yes your mind is interpreting the signals that it receives from your eyes and at most you can only take in 2% of what's actually going on around you and out of that 2% you are only aware of 5% of that 2% AND it's still manipulated by your perspective .

So if all you will ever be able to experience is that small % of reality and never experience 100% ego/perspective free  then is that even illusion?  By definition I say no .

[ivankiss]

When you conclude something is illusory, what are you comparing it to? 

If you are fully present and conscious of the moment, there simply is no time and no space for an illusion to occur.

You are one with it. It's all alive and vibrant. It's all real and actual. Conscious.

I realize not all of you see what I'm saying here. And that's ok. It is not my intention to prove anything or change anyone's mind. As always, my intention is to nudge and remind those who resonate. Who feel close to what I share.

I could go real deep and talk about frequencies, vibration, shifts, light, densities and completely leave out all aspects that remind you of being human. But that would fly even more over your heads. It would not hit the nail.

Instead, I use words and statements in a down to earth manner, that are made of the particular frequencies I want to demonstrate. That way, just by reading my post, you can climb up the ladder, find peace and surrender to the moment.

That is, if you recognize and accept the invitation.

What you take away depends on where you are on your path.

 

 

Edited December 20, 2019 by ivankiss

[Consilience]

40 minutes ago, ivankiss said:

 

When you conclude something is illusory, what are you comparing it to?

 

It’s being compared to that which is unchanging, the Absolute. Im not sure calling something an illusion is really the right word though.

[Maestro]

It does not really matter whether everything is real or not. The answer can only be understood experientially and an intellectual debate is waste of time in this case.

[VeganAwake]

@Visionary  

10 hours ago, Visionary said:

I see where you're coming from brother, but when he speaks of Honour its actually an awareness through the Heart. The ultimate way of perceiving reality is actually through the Heart. The intimacy of consciousness is best seen through the Heart. Trying to solve separation is actually separation. Love is the true understanding of this separative fantasy. The Zen monks also speak of resting the mind in the Heart. 

Edit: Nisargadatta Maharaj was strictly against turning enlightened masters into some deities. He had a clinical, clean realization of Truth. Nothing mattered to him anymore. There was only the Absolute and thats even before Beingness. Yet, he spend his whole life as a devotee after the realization. He loved other people so incredibly much he nearly kissed their feet. He saw the Absolute in others. He saw how separation made this Love truly truly special. Its about realizing God and embodying it. God wants to live in the flesh through us. Just as bad as we want to realize Him. Separation makes ultimate Love so much more special.

You said a lot of great things here...❤

Be aware that anytime there's a neediness for more of something, you can be sure that's the ego at work.

The ego desires more love more money more power more success more more more there's no end.( it's running on the hamster wheel forever)

When it's recognized that the separate sense of ME is an illusion and the mechanism that creates the misunderstanding is understood, all that is left is Unconditional Love for WHAT IS ❤ The constant seeking to make yourself complete ends...

And What is?

THIS...

There's nothing outside of THIS!! ❤ ?

Have a good day my friend!

 

[Visionary]

19 minutes ago, VeganAwake said:

@Visionary  

You said a lot of great things here...❤

Be aware that anytime there's a neediness for more of something, you can be sure that's the ego at work.

The ego desires more love more money more power more success more more more there's no end.( it's running on the hamster wheel forever)

When it's recognized that the separate sense of ME is an illusion and the mechanism that creates the misunderstanding is understood, all that is left is Unconditional Love for WHAT IS ❤ The constant seeking to make yourself complete ends...

And What is?

THIS...

There's nothing outside of THIS!! ❤ ?

Have a good day my friend!

 

Thank you brother! I see you ❤

Edited December 20, 2019 by Visionary

[VeganAwake]

@Visionary ❤

[WelcometoReality]

 

On 2019-12-19 at 1:38 AM, ivankiss said:

Have you seen this? Have you heard about it?

I'm sure you have.

It's been a trend for the longest time now. 

"It's all an illusion." 

"None of this is real."

"You don't exist."

"I don't exist."

Yadayadayada.

If you spent some time on the spiritual path, you yourself probably went through this phase. Hopefully, you came out the other side and are now having a sweet laugh at it all. 

That's a nice realization to have but not the whole picture is it. It's an important step that you have to go through but not a full realization.

On 2019-12-19 at 1:38 AM, ivankiss said:

I am.

But I also cannot help myself but see a huge flaw in all those teachings. And I don't give a crap about how ancient they are and how proven to be effective. 

Perhaps it's time for a renewal. An upgrade. An improvement.

Perhaps there is a new wave of conscious beings who feel the same way. Who smell something funny about it all. Who see past the limitations of the old ways.

 

The importance of not clinging to a specific teaching. It's like a treasure map that takes you to the treasure. Once you found the treasure, toss the map and take the treasure with you. Don't stay at the treasure chest until you die. There's another treasure somewhere waiting to be discovered and you can't find it with the same map.