Fortunate Son

Jealousy situation

38 posts in this topic

My girlfriend and I were watching tv last night and I saw that she was texting with some guy and they were talking about that they will meet next wendesday at 2pm and after that she replied "see you" and sent a hug emoticon. Is this normal? I think that she recently added him on Facebook, I don't think she's her friend.

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Posted (edited)

3 hours ago, Fortunate Son said:

My girlfriend and I were watching tv last night and I saw that she was texting with some guy and they were talking about that they will meet next wendesday at 2pm and after that she replied "see you" and sent a hug emoticon. Is this normal? I think that she recently added him on Facebook, I don't think she's her friend.

@Fortunate Son First of all, I can relate a lot to that feeling since I've felt it pretty often. I know it's very unpleasant. 

Normal and not normal are just labels based on our own morals. The important part of this is that it bothers you, which probably means that this is a boundary you have to talk about with your girlfriend in order to reach an agreement that is OK for both of you. 

Honest communication is key in a relationship. I wouldn't suggest sweeping it under the rug, because it will get triggered again. What I suggest is to talk this through with your girlfriend, explaining how you felt in that moment and don't hide your vulnerability. Also, it's very important to take responsibility of this feeling that was triggered when you saw her texting with another guy and get to know this feeling better. Chances are it has to do with some deeper insecurity, fear of abandonment or something along those lines. 

In a nutshell:

1) Work on honest communication about feelings, boundaries, etc., with your girlfriend and don't ignore these strong emotions that are getting triggered

2) Work on your fears, insecurities, etc. 

Good luck :) 

Edited by Farnaby

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Thank you for your reply, I was silent last night because I didn't want to reveal that I was looking on her phone while she's texting hehe. And she's gone on a trip to London this morning so I didn't want arguing before the trip.

Last month we were at friends wedding and some fat, drunk idiot started to dance with her and he was going with his hand towards her ass and then I pushed him and told him to fu.. off... I was always a jealous person, I rarely show it to my spouse. Instead I keep the anger within and than it explodes.

But I will listen to your advice, thank you friend.

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54 minutes ago, Fortunate Son said:

Thank you for your reply, I was silent last night because I didn't want to reveal that I was looking on her phone while she's texting hehe. And she's gone on a trip to London this morning so I didn't want arguing before the trip.

Last month we were at friends wedding and some fat, drunk idiot started to dance with her and he was going with his hand towards her ass and then I pushed him and told him to fu.. off... I was always a jealous person, I rarely show it to my spouse. Instead I keep the anger within and than it explodes.

But I will listen to your advice, thank you friend.

Yeah I know how that feels and it sucks. I've also been silent because I didn't want to reveal that I was looking, but in the end the things that you hide and don't communicate create resentment and block honest comunication. Also, as you noticed, emotions that aren't expressed tend to build up until something happens that makes them explode. 

Have you considered abstaining from intervening in such situations? What happens inside of you when you think about letting her be the one who stops the other person (in this case the drunk guy)?

I'm not saying you should stay completely passive .If she's stopping the guy and he won't listen I agree that you should intervene, but try to let her make the first move in this direction and see what happens. Do you feel some kind of fear that she wouldn't stop him? These are all questions I find important to ask yourself because they may lead to connecting with the emotions that are triggering the jealous behavior. 

What also helps is treating your jealous part with compassion. Jealousy is seen as something bad by society, but it's actually an emotion that we all have felt at some point or another. It's usually due to fear of abandonment, so it's important to make this vulnerable part feel loved and secure. 

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Doesn't sound normal. Ask her about it.

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@Farnaby When someone touches my girlfriend in a flirtatious way I don't think I just react and I am full of rage... It's so strong that I can't contain it in myself. I think it's a very complex emotion actually that really confuses me. I always focus on the worst outcomes, that she will cheat on me or that a guy will physically hurt her.

I grown up with abusing family, father who beat me and a mother who always said that it's all my fault. So this is emotion is probably amplified by fear of confrontation, fear of loosing my spouse and fear of worst outcomes. 

I am working with therapist but yeah, it takes time and hard work to beat this sh..

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@M3t4 Yes, I am thinking about and planning that conversation when she's back from her trip :)

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You actually think she's "yours."

LOL! So delusional!

That's the root of all your pain.

But knowing that you cannot "possess" someone intellectually won't stop you from feeling as if you do really "possess" her.

If you deny this and pretend like you "respect her autonomy" or whatever, don't bother. You don't.

I'm sure you do really love her. I don't challenge that. But based on the information you've given us, and also based on personal experience (I've been in your shoes) I will guarantee that somewhere in your mind is the idea that "she's my girl."

That is a lie.

The reality is that she owes you absolutely nothing and that she is completely independent of you.

There is nothing stopping her from leaving you and having sex with a train of men; furthermore, if she were to do that, you have no right to tell her that it is "wrong" because you don't control her.

Take the example of the fat drunk dude trying to grope her. Let's say he really does it. He gets a big handful of her ass.

Of course, you freak out. You might even blame her for letting him touch her. And you will say it's all to keep her safe, as if you don't want her to get hurt.

Lies.

What took the biggest hit is your ego, not her safety.

Besides, how dare you suggest that she can't look after herself. She's a grown up. Does that mean she's invincible? No. But she doesn't need her man constantly micromanaging her "safety."

If she gets hurt, that's on her. If she's a smart, resourceful woman she'll find a way to bounce back when it happens. If she's not a smart, resourceful woman, than life will find a way to teach her that lesson with or without you acting as her guardian.

So really, your protective power is also an illusion.

Imagine you saw someone else's bike getting stolen. Gee, that's awful, you think. But it doesn't dig under your skin at all. Why? Because it's not your bike. Now, if someone were to steal your bike... aha, well suddenly, the narrative is: "I can't believe this guy did this, what an asshole, he deserves punishment," etc.

Something similar is happening to you in your relationship, except instead of a bicycle, the thing in question is a living, breathing woman who gives you sex, validation, comfort, self esteem, meaning and a reason to feel good about your life on a daily basis.

Jealousy at it's core is nothing other than you lying to yourself about ownership.

That's laughable, really. What, did you buy her? xD

No... well then what is it? Ahhh, you're always there for her! You love her so much! Look at how much you sacrifice! Surely that means she must reciprocate! You gave her love so now she must give you love! You give her all of your attention so now she must give you all of hers!

As if you give her "100 love points" so now she owes you "100 loves points" back. Absurd. What is this, a bank transaction?

Here's the truth: She's NOT yours. Does that hurt? Do you disagree?

Your relationship is an illusion. It's grounded in nothing other than a shared fantasy.

This applies to all relationships, by the way. Including my own. Yes, I have a girlfriend. Or rather, "have" a "girlfriend," shall I say xD

I don't care if you pay her bills or act as her therapist, your philanthropy does not metaphysically bind her to you. She is free to leave and that sense of uncertainty is a punch to the gut that you've been putting off with your lies.

Consider that if you manage to stop seeing her as "yours," suddenly there is no longer any suffering associated with any of her actions. Hell, she could cheat on you and you could sincerely not care (at which point you could calmly dump her or not, up to you).

As you are now, if she cheated on you, you would be utterly destroyed and the manipulation games you'll play with her will be bitter and sick.

As to why you lie to yourself this way... I cannot answer that for you. Find that out for yourself.

But as long as you tell yourself this lie, you have something to defend.

There is no place for "defending" amidst true love. Remember that.

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@Fortunate Son

I would say focus on yourself, do your self-development and you'll end up on a frequency with like-minded girls. if there are attachment and loss issues in your past which affect your relationships then that is an important area to look at.

don't ever get into the mindset of looking at a girls phone or prying in any way like that. if there's trust between you then then you naturally won't do it anyway. and part of the trust process is trusting yourself. Is there deception in you? if so, get rid of it.

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8 hours ago, studentofthegame said:

@RendHeaven steady on, mate. sounded like you were getting off on all that.

Of course I was getting off, lol.

Realizing that she's not yours is a brilliant, bitter, and freeing revelation.

Anyone experiencing jealousy does not understand this.

I bring passion to my words to illustrate the absurdity of jealousy.

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6 hours ago, RendHeaven said:

Of course I was getting off, lol.

Realizing that she's not yours is a brilliant, bitter, and freeing revelation.

Anyone experiencing jealousy does not understand this.

I bring passion to my words to illustrate the absurdity of jealousy.

@RendHeaven Can you please explain practically how one gets over jealousy? Because "she's not yours" can be an intellectual concept that is not embodied and therefore doesn't necessarily make jealousy go away.

I'm genuinely interested, I also tend to feel jealousy.

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@RendHeaven Same question as @Gili Trawangan. Dating my girlfriend has been the most delusion shattering experience ever as it made me realize I'm not as developed as I like to be. 

Am I really dating her because I like her for who she is or because I get sex, validation, comfort, someone to hang out with, etc? 

What do you recommend to get to the bottom of this? 

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Posted (edited)

6 hours ago, Gili Trawangan said:

@RendHeaven Can you please explain practically how one gets over jealousy? Because "she's not yours" can be an intellectual concept that is not embodied and therefore doesn't necessarily make jealousy go away.

I'm genuinely interested, I also tend to feel jealousy.

It took the worst breakup of my life to come to this realization.

I was always upset with her, always controlling her, always telling her how to be, and always making her feel as though things were her fault.

Why did I do this? Well, the easy answer was that I was jealous. There were deeper reasons in hindsight, but I won't get into them here.

 

For 2 whole years, I thought she was mine. Having it all vanish in one day ruined me.

I felt so empty that I didn't eat or sleep or leave my room for 48 hours straight. I also immediately started scheming of ways to get her back, and ended up crawling to her and begging - a horrible idea which needless to say did not work.

At that point, the only silver lining I could see was for me to rebuild myself, stronger, smarter, and better; such that I could win her back organically.

I doubled down on self-help like a maniac, all the while acutely aware of the emptiness inside of me.

Not much time passed before this girl started dating someone else, and I felt further betrayed. But I swallowed my pride and slowly my goal started to shift from getting her back to authentic healing.

Here I was, hurting, while she had already found her next boyfriend... I realized it made no sense to chase her anymore.

 

It took about half an year, but after 6 months of serious self reflection, the realization occurred to me that I never "had" her anyway, and it dawned on me that I actually had no reason to suffer.

This realization came slowly, in phases. It wasn't an instant epiphany.

I eventually reached a point where she was so clearly, obviously not mine that her "metaphysical importance," per se, was no different than a random stranger I had never met before even though all the memories we shared were crystal clear.

At that point, my pain just... stopped. I found myself laughing, making new friends, and even helping other people.

Looking back on it, I see that breakup as the greatest gift any woman has ever given me. The amount I grew from that breakup was tremendous. My old identity was utterly shattered, and that was precisely what was necessary for me to grow.

 

So to answer your question, sadly, I'm limited in my ability to help you. I can't just tell you to break up, can I? :P

To this day, I view my breakup experience as absolutely necessary for me to have reached the point I am at today.

Without this breakup, I would not have had the opportunity to investigate myself seriously.

No way I would of done the grueling, painful, deep inner work while still dating. No chance.

In fact, the only reason I was able to do the deep inner work at all was because I had no other option, you see.

My options were either: grow, or feel suicidal. I chose growth.

While you're in a relationship, you don't have the desperation or incentive necessary to really examine yourself.

You're too busy doing shallow, petty things with your partner; and even if you do inner work, keeping your relationship alive remains your priority.

You cannot lose jealousy while prioritizing your relationship. These agendas are counter to one another.

 

Perhaps, maybe, it is possible to lose jealousy while maintaining your relationship... but that will take an enormous shift in priorities, and a lot of sacrifice that almost nobody is willing to make.

You realize that to "lose" your jealousy, you must "lose" your relationship?

You want something practical? Dissolve the relationship.

See for yourself that your bonds were nothing more than a flimsy social pact, loaded with romantic jargon to mask its temporary and uncertain nature.

Actually do it. Don't think about it. Look at your girlfriend. That is not your "girlfriend."

Notice, "My girlfriend," and "My girl" are nothing other than labeling thoughts. If you lost the capacity to think, your "girlfriend" would cease to be "your girlfriend." Imagine that!

Or even better, experience that!

So "dissolve the relationship" can mean different things for different people. Maybe you really can pull this off without a breakup!

In most cases, though, this won't ever hit home until the relationship is over, literally and permanently.

This is as practical as it gets. :D

Edited by RendHeaven

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5 hours ago, LordFall said:

Am I really dating her because I like her for who she is or because I get sex, validation, comfort, someone to hang out with, etc? 

Both. Relationships are a complex mix of selfish desires and selfless desires.

That's completely normal! Just don't lie to yourself :)

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24 minutes ago, RendHeaven said:

Looking back on it, I see that breakup as the greatest gift any woman has ever given me. The amount I grew from that breakup was tremendous. My old identity was utterly shattered, and that was precisely what was necessary for me to grow.

Is this new identity really yours, or does it belong to God? :P 

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It's fair and appropriate to be jealous. If she really is your girlfriend, and you're not just dating, it's a big red flag for how she feels about the relationship. How does that feel to you? Would it be hard to break it off with her even when she violates your boundaries?

It sounds like she is often in situations where a boyfriend would be jealous.

You don't control if others hurt you, but please don't hurt yourself as well. People who get so angry don't expect to be heard. But you yourself have to listen to the information in your anger or you will start to distrust yourself, and be more and more and more dependent on others to give you love, because you effectively removed yourself as the authority of your own boundaries.

If you still want to be with her, I don't know whether a conversation will help in the long run. I think you have to walk away as soon as she mentions to you what she's doing next Wednesday. And if she doesn't mention it when you ask, leave because you know she is hiding from you.

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On 20/6/2019 at 11:07 PM, Fortunate Son said:

@Farnaby When someone touches my girlfriend in a flirtatious way I don't think I just react and I am full of rage... It's so strong that I can't contain it in myself. I think it's a very complex emotion actually that really confuses me. I always focus on the worst outcomes, that she will cheat on me or that a guy will physically hurt her.

I grown up with abusing family, father who beat me and a mother who always said that it's all my fault. So this is emotion is probably amplified by fear of confrontation, fear of loosing my spouse and fear of worst outcomes. 

I am working with therapist but yeah, it takes time and hard work to beat this sh..

@Fortunate Son I can relate to this, although my coping mechanism with these kind of situations has been a more repressive, passive-agressive one than what you're describing. But I've definitely felt that emotion. Have you considered that it could be something deeper than rage? Something along the lines of sadness, fear of emptiness and fear of abandonment? We tend to express sadness and fear through anger and rage. This is especially true for us men. 

I'm really sorry to hear that you had to grow up in an abusing family. There probably is a lot of anger, resentment and sadness that needs to be taken care of, since you were a victim of abusive relationships which you depended upon to survive. 

Yes, it's hard to overcome, but keep working on it with your therapist and by yourself. Allow yourself to be vulnerable. Also, I suggest looking at it from this point of view: instead of seeing it as some shit to beat, ask yourself what these "symptoms" (jealousy, rage, etc.) are protecting you from. 

I suggest practicing meditation, as well as finding a way to express your rage in a healthy way (for example martial arts, having a punching bag, screaming into a pillow, etc.). Meditation will help you connect with a part of yourself that can observe thoughts and emotions without acting them out. This will allow you to accept the emotions you feel when a situation like the one you described happens, discover the reason why they get triggered and start healing those wounded parts of yourself.

Something that I didn't really trust but have found to be pretty useful is to say a mantra whenever you feel a strong emotion. Something like: "I'm here with you and I will give you my whole attention and presence". If you get distracted, gently repeat this to yourself and also thank this distraction mechanism for what it may have helped you endure. 

I also agree with those who suggested abstaining from acting like her guardian. Make it an exercise. When you feel the impulse to act like this, try to abstain from it and feel the emotions and thoughts that bubble up. Don't resist them, but don't act them out. 

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@RendHeaven Thank you for such expanded and detailed answer, I read it all.

I was just talking with my friend last night and told him about this, my girlfriend sending hugs to some guy. He told me that he have one female friend who is a girlfriend of his friend and that she is sending him hearts emojis and smiles all the time in messages. So one hug is not a big deal. He also told me that I am jealous and possessive, specially when I watching her phone when she's texting. He didn't even suggest that I mention this to her and don't talk about it.

So I think the confusion is in me because of one part of me who loves her and the other part who is like her prison guard, watching her every little move. And these two parts cannot live together... The idea of letting go of this other part is a relieving feeling.

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