Letting it all go

[KMB4222]

I'll try to describe my experience of letting go of as much as possible, and experiencing a brief moment of clarity. I'm not referring to a clarity of 'knowing'. What I'm referring to is a clarity of not knowing and not not knowing. I think it took me getting to a place where I was dissatisified with everything anyone had ever taught and anything I had ever read. Of course, if it weren't for the videos and books then I probably wouldn't have been brought to this point at all. But nevertheless, I had to be completely okay with throwing all of it away (even for just a moment). I had to bring myself to a point where I was no longer afraid to admit that it didn't matter what anyone said - none of it was going to work for me. 

 

I went through a process of letting go of various things:

-all ideas of ever achieving anything or reaching any state or heightened level

-all notions of attainment

-the idea that there is something beyond here and now, and that I could ever perceive or attain it

-of becoming something other than this (including the notion of ever knowing what "this" is)

-attachment to all addictions, distractions, habits, thought patterns

-the idea of letting go of anything (letting go of letting go)

-ever having anything that I don't already have

-all techniques, practices, expectations, beliefs, teachings

-ever thinking that I would know, or be correct about anything

-the need to know my true existential nature, or 'solve' this mystery of existence or what I am

 

What did this moment of clarity feel like? Mostly like nothing at all. But there was a slight sense of peace in experiencing something that felt truer than anything anyone had ever been pointing at. Or maybe this is what they were point at. But who knows? If it's impossible to describe what the finger is pointing to, then it's impossible to know if what they describe is what I experienced. 

I also get the sense that I don't need to know what it was, nor do I need to call it something. I also know that I didn't need to talk about it. But once you come out of these things, it sure is nice to share them

[Truth Addict]

@KMB4222

That's very nice!

I haven't had that moment of unshakeable clarity yet, but I resonate with most of the things you said. They're just clear to me without even trying.

Of course, it was hard to get there. But once you get there, you get there!

[Conrad]

''the need to know my true existential nature, or 'solve' this mystery of existence or what I am''

 

Big mistake. There is nothing greater than discovering  your true existential nature. Believe me.  Otherwise you would just be a robot, rest of the sheep.

[QandC]

Sounds nice but don't mistake giving up the search for catching your own tail (Aka. self-realization) 

[SriBhagwanYogi]

@KMB4222 That seems like Gangaji just stop Neo Advaita advice to me., dobt give up search to early do self Inquiry hardcore

[KMB4222]

38 minutes ago, Conrad said:

''the need to know my true existential nature, or 'solve' this mystery of existence or what I am''

Big mistake. There is nothing greater than discovering  your true existential nature. Believe me.  Otherwise you would just be a robot, rest of the sheep.

I haven't given up on my search for what I am. I just know that finding it will come via me and my efforts, no through the direction of someone else.

It's just that in this particular moment, I was no longer willing to accept anything anyone had said about my true nature. 

Whatever I experienced only lasted a brief moment. Maybe it was something. Maybe it was nothing. 

In regards to your last comment ("just be a robot, rest of the sheep."), I feel there is a certain nuance to discovering your true existential nature. Don't try at all, and you may never find it or know it when you see it. Try too hard, and you might be denying some aspect of reality. I don't think the search for your true nature is about not wanting to be a robot, or not wanting to be a sheep. Of course, no one wants to be. But what if there is some aspect to the truth that does mean we are in some way 'robots' or 'sheep'? I find it's better to allow for possibilities and see where it goes. Maybe in the long run I will just end up being a robot or sheep, but I will have the knowing where there wasn't knowing before. 

[KMB4222]

@QandC I certainly haven't given up the search. I still have a lifetime to go before my learning comes to an end. It's just that at this point I have a much better idea of where to look. 

[Bill W]

17 minutes ago, SriBhagwanYogi said:

@KMB4222 That seems like Gangaji just stop Neo Advaita advice to me., dobt give up search to early do self Inquiry hardcore

I was about to contribute to this thread and I will, but can you please explain this comment to me? Just a little. I can't work out what you mean. Tried Googling it but wasn't sure. I've bolded the part I am referring to. Thanks. 

[Conrad]

3 minutes ago, KMB4222 said:

I haven't given up on my search for what I am. I just know that finding it will come via me and my efforts, no through the direction of someone else.

It's just that in this particular moment, I was no longer willing to accept anything anyone had said about my true nature. 

Whatever I experienced only lasted a brief moment. Maybe it was something. Maybe it was nothing. 

In regards to your last comment ("just be a robot, rest of the sheep."), I feel there is a certain nuance to discovering your true existential nature. Don't try at all, and you may never find it or know it when you see it. Try too hard, and you might be denying some aspect of reality. I don't think the search for your true nature is about not wanting to be a robot, or not wanting to be a sheep. Of course, no one wants to be. But what if there is some aspect to the truth that does mean we are in some way 'robots' or 'sheep'? I find it's better to allow for possibilities and see where it goes. Maybe in the long run I will just end up being a robot or sheep, but I will have the knowing where there wasn't knowing before. 

psychedelics will give you a push

[KMB4222]

17 minutes ago, SriBhagwanYogi said:

@KMB4222 That seems like Gangaji just stop Neo Advaita advice to me., dobt give up search to early do self Inquiry hardcore

None of what I should be taken as advice. It's from my experience only, and might not be useful at all to anyone else. 

I've never understood doing anything 'hardcore'. For me it felt too rigid and unnatural. That might work for some people, but not for others. For me, it's more effective to apply effort skillfully. Of course, that means different things to different people. 

[Bill W]

@KMB4222

I love this thread of yours. If I could sum u my personal developments goals in two words it would be letting go. It might be that I am thinking of something different to you, but there are, at the minimum some similarities. 

I know you mention letting go of techniques and teachings, but was there any teaching that really resonated with you before you let all teachings go temporarily? If that makes sense? Did anything help you achieve this state? 

Also do you know what @SriBhagwanYogi is talking about? 

[KMB4222]

@Bill W What helped me the most to get to that point was a lot of deconstruction, if I'm using the word accurately. Basically, I had to question everything I had heard or read about what reality is, or what my true nature was. I had to admit that every source I had found useful could be completely wrong. Or at the very least deluded in some regard. These experiences are very personal and there really is no way to communicate the experience accurately. So I had to make the letting go very personal. Which also means I had to admit that I myself didn't know either. 

I'm not entirely sure what @SriBhagwanYogi was referring to. If I remember correctly, Gangaji is a teacher of neo-Advaita (you can find her videos on YouTube). She has a powerful video about letting go, let go of letting go, allow everything to be. That sort of meditation. I think @SriBhagwanYogi may have had the impression that I was talking about letting go of the search entirely, and never coming back to it. In a sense I was, but only for a moment. There is still searching, of course. But I am more confident in my ability to do the searching, rather than relying on anyone else to take me some place. 

[Bill W]

@KMB4222

Thank you. Your posts on this thread have resonated with me totally. I've started going through some of your old topics and posts. I note you liked the Osho book "Trust". I like Osho, and his book "The Buddha Said" is one of the best books I've ever read. Based on the end paragraph of my post here do you think the Osho book "Trust" might be of interest to me? Your topic on taking notes instead of action is the predicament I find myself in right now actually. 

I also found the book Letting Go by David Hawkings to be inspirational. 

I appreciate my idea of letting go might be very different to yours, and my goals very different to yours. I just love your posts here and your attitude. You come across really humble and open-minded. 

My journey at the moment has led me to the point that there is little point in trying to acquire things right now (even though my obsessive/addictive nature continues to try). I'm holding too much crap. Loads of stuff needs to be let go. I think I'll only go as far as my ability to let go. Perhaps not as radical as you describe in your original post here. To begin with I am working on letting go of such things as; blame, anger, resentment, punishment, arrogance, being correct, taking things personally, avoidance, pride and entitlement. Or perhaps letting go of the ego (as I understand the ego).

I also think letting go will be a lifetime activity, day in, day out for me. 

 

[KMB4222]

@Bill W Thank you as well. I've always liked the way Osho tries (tried) to cut through the crap and get to the heart of the matter. Some people try to do the same thing, but end up conceptualizing or philosophizing about it, and end up going about it in a haphazard way, which isn't very useful. It just fills the mind with too much direction. Some direction is useful, but only enough to get you there. I guess you could think of it like driving directions. If you get too hung up on how to get there, you might end up stuck somewhere along the way. If I remember correctly, all of Osho's books (or at least the ones released nowadays) are compiled by the Osho International Foundation, based on Osho's lectures. I don't know enough about him to know if he actually wrote anything down himself. So this probably helps his books seem more to the point. 

I haven't read Trust in a long time, to be honest. One thing I always appreciated about Osho's books is that he gets you to a place as you're reading where you realize you don't really need to read the book. But you have to begin reading to discover that. Just one of those catches, I suppose. I don't know if Trust will be of interest to you, but I know it was worth it for me

The great thing that I have discovered about letting go is that it can be applied to just about anything, even on sublte levels. You can apply it at any time you want, in relation to anything you want, and to any degree that works for you. 

The interesting thing about the moment I described in my original post is that even with that brief moment of clarity, I was still attached to my addictions and other habits. I don't see it as a moment of complete freedom from anything. It was just a moment of clarity. If I had to express it in words I probably would have said to myself "Hm, so that's what that feels like." 

It sounds like you have a good grasp on what works for you. Trust that you will know what to do, including knowing when it's time to ask for assistance from outside sources. 

It's great that you have an idea of what you want to let go of. One thing I found helpful was appreciating that everything I wanted to let go of was also valid in its own way. I don't think it's about getting to a place where you can be free of some 'negative' aspect of yourself entirely. I used to aim for 'perfection', which in my mind at the time meant ridding myself of every little thing that wasn't ideal. But it's also important to aknowledge that something is there. Many people have said that this journey is never complete. I think they are right. However, there are moments of completion along the way. For example, being 100% free of anger might be unrealistic (that is for the individual to determine for themself), but being more mindful or when anger arises, and becoming comfortable with how, when, and to what degree that anger is expressed is also an achievement.

[Bill W]

@KMB4222 Thanks for that. Totally agree with all you said, especially about being realistic about the degree of letting go that can be achieved. 

41 minutes ago, KMB4222 said:

"Hm, so that's what that feels like." 

Yes! This is EXACTLY what I thought to myself about 8 months ago shortly after I had a rock bottom and I decided to quit alcohol and drugs that were not prescribed for me. I took time off work sick for about the first time ever and slowly began to rebuild. I surrendered. I admitted defeat. I LET GO (to a degree at least) my old plan, my crazy ways of trying to cope with life. I knew I had to find a different way. I then experienced moments during the day when I thought to myself "Hmmmm, so this is what a bit of peace of mind feels like", and "this is what it feels like not to be walking around in a state of heightened anxiety at almost every waking moment". I actually felt like I'd ingested a tranquiliser without the grogginess. That's how it felt. 

[KMB4222]

@Bill W That's awesome that you were able to identify something that wasn't working for you and decided it wasn't worth it. It can be tough, especially when our habits are tied in to many other aspects of our everyday lives. 

From my experience the most effective letting go is the one that seems almost immediate. We may use strategies to get to that point, but something just snaps, and the let go happens almost instantaneously. It can be a bit of a challenge figuring out how to let go because we keep running in circles trying to find the best way. Only then do we get so tired of circling back on our old attempts to let go that we realize that the actual letting go moment is more immediate than any plan will take us. 

Another helpful (and somewhat related) tip I remember hearing was to decide and act at the same time. I don't remember what this person was talking about, but the essence is that by deciding and acting at the same time (or in one fluid movement) you are essentially bypassing the self-doubt part of your psychology, so you can get right to taking action and making change. I think this might be useful in transitioning from one thing to another. For example, letting go of drinking coffee and choosing to drink more water. The letting go of drinking coffee is accompanied by drinking water. 

I don't think this is what the person was actually talking about, but I think it's still useful to some degree. 

[Bill W]

@KMB4222

Makes sense actually. If you are going to let something go, have something ready to take it's place. Perhaps this is similar as to when they say you can drop one addiction but pick up another right away to take it's place. Therefore try to have a "better" behaviour or addiction to hand or we would probably default to one that is similarly dysfunctional (in the long run).

I'm cutting & pasting your replies here onto a separate document for me to look at during the week, that's how useful I've found this topic. 

[KMB4222]

@Bill W Wow! I'm glad to hear that this has been that useful to you. All the best!

[SriBhagwanYogi]

@KMB4222 yep misunderstood you

@Bill W https://www.watkinsmagazine.com/differences-between-neo-and-traditional-advaita-by-dennis-waite

Its a huge trap when people do self inquiry google neo advaita they call pff the search too early they have belief system that yoz are already Enlightend just stop doing practices you dont exist. Thats correct but at last stage of path

[Bill W]

Thanks for that @SriBhagwanYogi