I think psychedelics can blunt spiritual progress. thoughts?

[Forestluv]

@corndjorn All stories are ultimately groundless. 

[corndjorn]

@Whatever yep i agree about the life thing, but teachers have benefited me identifiying my blindspots which i thank them for that, which is part of life anyway haha

[now is forever]

@corndjorn what did i say?

[corndjorn]

@Serotoninluv dude you know i agree with you right? everyone here knows nondual pointers you dont have to reitrate them all the time lol. listen man you can hide in nondual pointers all you want but as humans we experience fear, and fear is not synonmus with nonduality. the awakening to awareness initiates a process in experience which unclings all the attachments that is in your memory, it is definitely there. merely awakening to awareness is not the end point.

[corndjorn]

@now is forever just checked convo, woops, i thought you said something that @Nahm said, nvm lol

[Forestluv]

@corndjorn Not my point. You keep saying “X is Y”. Then you say “I understand X is not Y”. Then you go on telling stories with an underlying belief X is Y. 

Embodiment goes much deeper.

And I am not pointing to your concept of nonduality. That is an assumption you seem to be making and I think you are dismissing nuggets of insight because of that assumption.

[corndjorn]

@Serotoninluv "all stories are groundless" is indeed a nondual pointer. and what is the x and y talk? be more specific please. i have no beliefs systems i only stated what i observed is occuring my system after my awakening, is stating what i observed a belief system? 

[Jack River]

We can tell where we stand in our everyday life.

The degree that we project images on ourselves is the degree that we impose images onto others/environment in which influences inevitable action. 

After all, there are no enlightened individuals, only enlightened action. 

To not live with the image, this is truly beautiful. An art really

 

 

[Forestluv]

@corndjorn Go back in your writings and look for everytime you used the word “is”. The “X” is on the left of “is” and the “Y” is to the right of “is”.

And you most certainly have some beliefs appearing. You just aren’t aware of it. The ego will always want to control the narrative. 

And I am not suggesting there is something wrong with beliefs or it is something to be avoided. As a mind expands, as does awareness.

[Forestluv]

3 minutes ago, Jack River said:

To not live with the image, this is truly beautiful. An art really

Indeed

[corndjorn]

@Serotoninluv @Jack River lol again, to state something you observed in your experience is not a belief system, its just about not being attached to it. avoiding it is not truly nondual. nonduality is synonmus with truth since you would have no aversion to truth. and the process of unentanglement in your limbic system is something that is occuring after awakening, if not seen it will be seen as time progresses. its like saying drivers licence test doesnt exist because ultimately nothing exists...

Edited February 3, 2019 by corndjorn

[corndjorn]

 as @whatever said, many people here awoke to nonduality but havent yet discovered that a process is occuring in their system. disacknowledging said proccess is not being congruent to your experience, which comes from aversion, which ultimately comes from fear, which is ultimately delusional. 

[Jack River]

@corndjorn I’m not opposing anyone here. Not playing any sides. My post was action in and of itself. I’m sure you guys see what I mean though. 

 

 

Edited February 3, 2019 by Jack River

[Leo Gura]

@corndjorn You're acting as though someone here is instructing you to avoid stuff. No one said to avoid anything. You are arguing against your own self.

Why are you associating psychedelics with some kind of avoidance??

You might as well go to a Zen temple and complain to them that meditation is a form of avoidance.

As a general rule of thumb: You are creating whatever results you are getting.

[corndjorn]

@Leo Gura not associating psychedelics with avoidance and my post is not dogmatic at all concerning psychs as others think, i said it CAN but not WILL blunt your progress, it can be used as avoidance, however when i was talking about avoidance i was speaking to people here that were not being truthful about the process of unentanglement, saying its just a concept, blah blah blah, and all that, when its just the mere fact that they arent conscious of it or are just early on in their awakening.

Edited February 3, 2019 by corndjorn

[Forestluv]

@corndjorn Seven “IS’s” in that last post and you state each one as if you believe it’s true. 

I’m not agreeing or disagreeing with you. Take a step back and look at the thought dynamics appearing in the mind. The ego wants to control the narrative. It appears in my mind as well. That’s what egos do. It’s hard to let go of. 

[Leo Gura]

@corndjorn Mind is a concept. Body is also a concept. Past and future are concepts. Most things humans know are concepts.

[Mezanti]

@Leo Gura leo why aren't you uploading

[corndjorn]

@Serotoninluv the door is in my room, the computer is in my hand, the chair is under my ass. just because you describe whats in your experience doesnt mean that youre attached to it. i think youre the one thats attached to the narrative concept.

[Aquarius]

1 hour ago, corndjorn said:

@Aquarius ive said they are tools in the post, but im saying if youd like to advance in the spiritual path, you cannot be using psychedelics  as a conductive tool anymore at a certain point, the mere subconcious need for mystical or cool experiences for it comes from attachment and thus underlying fear mechanisms, a person in nonduality has no need for a psychedelic experience and would in fact blunt the process that their system is going through. its a good tool as a starting spiritual tool like i said, as it helped me alot aswell, and it awoke me to nonduality, but psych experiences are perverted by many emotions that are amplified, and as humans we should be humble enough to realize that we have blindspots, and giving our blindspots an energetic amplifier is a bad idea, especially if you are on the path. but some tools are more conductive than others. would you use a fancy looking hammer to build your house or would you use a hammer thats most conductive to building the house? you can choose whatever hammer you want at the end of the day, but like i said, at a certain point in the path psychedelic use is not conductive for full enlightenment. and enlightenment is not a tool... tool for what exactly? enlightenment is the clearing of all fear mechanisms and their attachments, basically all of your ego, its not something your ego can take advantage of. some people mistake awakening as enlightenment when that couldnt be farther from the truth. enlightenment is when your limbic system catches up with your awakening, by clearing all subconcious energetic contractions. 

also your post makes alot of condescending assumptions/projections, i dont appreciate that.

@corndjorn

Ah, I see it now. Thanks for explaining, the situation is clearer now. I now see where I was mistaken. I think we can learn a lot from each other if we let go of the egoic need of being right all the time. When you come to a self-help community, it is expected that people will try and give you advice. Because we are a community.  I meant no harm.

I know what enlightenment is. But you seem to have a spiritual ego. I recently found this video and it helped me clear my mind, the girl really knows what she talks about. You might find it beneficial.

What I was trying to say is that you can do whatever you want without convincing anyone that you are right or wrong about your ideas. We all have different ideas about life. I was agreeing with you in all that you said, in fact, I really appreciated your post and thought it was cool, but you could have not known that because you cannot read my mind, neither can I read your mind, I can only make guesses on what would benefit you best, and then try and give you some advice, because it seemed to me that you would appreciate it. I didn't mean to annoy you. I just pointed out certain mechanisms within you that you might not be aware of, but they are showing in your way of wording certain things. I wasn't assuming anything, just simply telling you that's how it came across as. 

 

I was telling you how it sounded like, I wasn't assuming anything. I admit I could've asked some questions beforehand instead of saying things that might rub you off the wrong way. Many things in my post were unnecessary, I know, but I wasn't saying anything harmful and I based my arguments on personal experience and I think I was fairly neutral in what I said. 

Was trying to know you better, give you helpful advice the best way I could with the information I had, from my point of view. Don't act like we know each other since we were kids. You cannot expect me to know exactly what would help you, again, I'm just a random individual on the internet. 

I don't feel superior to you, now THAT'S an assumption from your part. I was responding to your ideas, not to you. You seem to be attached to ideas. I meant it might be seen this or that way, and I appreciated you explaining what you meant. It was constructive feedback, in a way. I'm sorry my ideas didn't resonate with you, but that's just how my personality is. I cannot be everyone's cup of tea, unfortunately. I don't even try to. Why would I? 

I'm just a stranger on the internet, don't get offended by me.  I don't know anything about you, how could I? I only make observations based on the information you provide. I'm interpreting it through my own lens. What else would you expect me to do?

Treat others as you want to be treated. You got very defensive of your ideas, a mechanism of the ego. Again, just an observation. 

I know I said enlightenment is just a tool, but I meant it figuratively from my point of view. Then I realised I worded it weirdly and I corrected myself, and said: enlightenment is not the end destination. Go check my post again, and ask yourself if you yourself aren't projecting any anger or arrogance into it.

 

After you get enlightened you still have a lot of other things to do.

Ever heard the zen saying, "Before enlightenment, chop wood. After enlightenment, chop wood." ?

I also got frustrated about you not being receptive to my advice and not appreciating me working literally 1 hour editing and writing the post, but I accept it and I let go of the feelings and desires for my advice to be received well. I'm pretty sure someone one day will find it helpful, and I'm pretty sure others will do their best to "debunk" and misinterpret me. I'm fine with that too. Because I know that I was being honest with myself and true to my values when I wrote that. A thing which is, in the end, meaningless.  Unless it has a meaning for you. But that's your choice. 

I think I learned a lot from our interaction, which is great. How do you feel about what I said in this current post? Does it resonate more? I'm just trying to teach you something, but maybe I was expressing it in a way that didn't feel quite right for whatever reason, maybe touching on insecurities. I took a lot of care on wording my thoughts carefully and respectfully, could you please elaborate on why it seemed condescending to you? I would gladly accept any feedback because I'm on actualized to learn, and I am flexible to developing myself further. Thanks in advance. 

In any case, I wasn't trying to make you feel inadequate, if that's what you mean. I just offered something that I felt could be helpful for both you and members of the community reading it. Do you think that's a "bad" thing? If so, why? 

Pic related.