Leo Gura

Spiral Dynamics Stage Yellow Examples Mega-Thread

1,196 posts in this topic

4 hours ago, Rolo said:

selflessness doesn't mean people forget about you

That wasn't my point. Selflessness just means that you don't care if people forget about you, and it's generally speaking an indicator of higher development. I say generally because there are some nuances there.

There are different ways of viewing selflessness. You might want to call people who sacrifice themselves for their tribe or country selfless, but you can also look at it as them serving their identity as being a member of a group (which is collectivistic instead of individualistic) and is therefore instead an act of selfishness. I would place Assad in that category: he wants to be remembered as a man who protected his country. A more puritanian version of that would be if he instead had said that he doesn't care about being remembered and that he only cares about his country.

The type of selflessness that Zappa is displaying is on a deeper level. He doesn't care at all about the idea of being remembered, neither from an individualistic standpoint or from the standpoint of being associated with any group (like his country). To be able to disassociate yourself from your identity and view yourself from a larger perspective is a sign of higher development. Then you could argue that this process has been somewhat hijacked by the fact that he had been diagnosed with terminal prostate cancer and that he had essentially been forced over a couple of years to come to terms with the impermanence of life. Then again, most people don't come to terms with that before their last breath.

Edited by Carl-Richard

Intrinsic joy is revealed in the marriage of meaning and being.

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20 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

I would place Assad in that category: he wants to be remembered as a man who protected his country. A more puritanian version of that would be if he instead had said that he doesn't care about being remembered and that he only cares about his country.

 

Its important to recognize that his remembrance is inevitable, he is facing a challenge that requires success or failure and a whole country is looking at him as their protector. Its a fair call for him to make that statement due to his political position and where most of the middle east is on the spectrum.    

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3 hours ago, Rolo said:

Its important to recognize that his remembrance is inevitable, he is facing a challenge that requires success or failure and a whole country is looking at him as their protector. Its a fair call for him to make that statement due to his political position and where most of the middle east is on the spectrum.    

Still, the way he phrashes it has typical red/blue dictator wibes. "I hope I will be remembered" was said as a standalone sentence. Zappa's point that the people who care about being remembered are people like Reagan and Bush applies here.

Edited by Carl-Richard

Intrinsic joy is revealed in the marriage of meaning and being.

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On 10/5/2020 at 11:01 AM, DocWatts said:

Just something interesting that I recall Don Beck mentioning during an Interview is that he would probably map himself as Blue in SD.

Which would explain why he doesn't understand Ken Wilber and Turquoise.


You are God. You are Truth. You are Love. You are Infinity.

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On 10/15/2020 at 2:08 AM, Kamran said:

Some yellow in there?

Brainpower without consciousness = stupidity


You are God. You are Truth. You are Love. You are Infinity.

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7 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Which would explain why he doesn't understand Ken Wilber and Turquoise.

I thought one could not possibly see beyond their stage on the spiral. How is it that the founder of spiral dynamics not be at least orange centered, since the model he designed is essentially scientific?

Edited by Happy Lizard

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57 minutes ago, Happy Lizard said:

I thought one could not possibly see beyond their stage on the spiral. How is it that the founder of spiral dynamics not be at least orange centered, since the model he designed is essentially scientific?

Clare Graves placed himself at Blue/Orange.

If you are doing science well, you can scientifically map out higher stages without yourself having direct experience of them.

A doctor can study cancer without ever experiencing it.

A scientist can study advanced meditators and mystics without ever accessing their levels of consciousness.

But this is a dry sort of knowledge. It isn't embodied.


You are God. You are Truth. You are Love. You are Infinity.

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1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

Clare Graves placed himself at Blue/Orange.

If you are doing science well, you can scientifically map out higher stages without yourself having direct experience of them.

A doctor can study cancer without ever experiencing it.

A scientist can study advanced meditators and mystics without ever accessing their levels of consciousness.

But this is a dry sort of knowledge. It isn't embodied.

@Leo Gura

Can you get a quote for that?

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@Leo Gura I guess I made a guess that since he or Clare were the founders of spiral dynamics, then that must've come form them being aware of the spiral, hence they'd be placed at yellow, but I guess I was wrong. I wonder what having a direct realization of the spiral be like.

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"We are like the spider. We weave our life and then move along in it. We are like the dreamer who dreams and then lives in the dream. This is true for the entire universe."

-- The Upanishads

Encyclopedia

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3 hours ago, Bernardo Carleial said:

The 2020 Nobel Prize winner in physics Roger Penrose

You can certainly influence the content but not the structure that enables the content in the first place.

What you measure is what you measure. You interpreting the measurement as consciousness is an interpretation.


Life Purpose journey

Presence. Goodness. Grace. Love.

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?

Edited by Carl-Richard

Intrinsic joy is revealed in the marriage of meaning and being.

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The channel is all yellow, has many systems thinking courses. 

Look at these playlists...

https://www.youtube.com/c/ComplexityLearningLab/playlists

VALUE!!!

Political Complexity Course!!!

Edited by integral

How is this post just me acting out my ego in the usual ways? Is this post just me venting and justifying my selfishness? Are the things you are posting in alignment with principles of higher consciousness and higher stages of ego development? Are you acting in a mature or immature way? Are you being selfish or selfless in your communication? Are you acting like a monkey or like a God-like being?

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How is this post just me acting out my ego in the usual ways? Is this post just me venting and justifying my selfishness? Are the things you are posting in alignment with principles of higher consciousness and higher stages of ego development? Are you acting in a mature or immature way? Are you being selfish or selfless in your communication? Are you acting like a monkey or like a God-like being?

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Overview of a new Integral 2.0 movement, based of Ken Wilbers Work. 

 

Edited by integral

How is this post just me acting out my ego in the usual ways? Is this post just me venting and justifying my selfishness? Are the things you are posting in alignment with principles of higher consciousness and higher stages of ego development? Are you acting in a mature or immature way? Are you being selfish or selfless in your communication? Are you acting like a monkey or like a God-like being?

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Holacracy Company structure. Moving away from the standard authority hierarchy structure. 


How is this post just me acting out my ego in the usual ways? Is this post just me venting and justifying my selfishness? Are the things you are posting in alignment with principles of higher consciousness and higher stages of ego development? Are you acting in a mature or immature way? Are you being selfish or selfless in your communication? Are you acting like a monkey or like a God-like being?

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Liquid Democracy 

 

Game Changing, this needs to be pushed for HARD. We all need to get behind this. 


How is this post just me acting out my ego in the usual ways? Is this post just me venting and justifying my selfishness? Are the things you are posting in alignment with principles of higher consciousness and higher stages of ego development? Are you acting in a mature or immature way? Are you being selfish or selfless in your communication? Are you acting like a monkey or like a God-like being?

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