Leo Gura

Spiral Dynamics Stage Blue Examples Mega-Thread

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2 minutes ago, fridjonk said:

@Leo Gura What if you were to make a separate threads of the positives for each stage. Like "Positive Stage-Blue Examples". 

Post 'em here.

Positive and negative are inseparable.


You are God. You are Truth. You are Love. You are Infinity.

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Here's a stage Blue/Orange Christian's politics vs a stage Green Christian's politics:

Quite illuminating how they talk past one another.


You are God. You are Truth. You are Love. You are Infinity.

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Here in Seattle, which is a mostly Stage Green city, one of the most beloved landmarks is St. Mark's Cathedral. Even though they hold regular Christian Episcopal Church sermons, they also strive to be a figurehead that represents all peoples of the community. They hold LGBTQ meetings regularly. They've had regular Yoga classes held in the main hall. They hold major concerts, throw huge celebration events, and let people film music videos. Every Sunday night at 9:30pm they have Gregorian choir singing for about an hour, followed by a solo on a two-story Organ. The pubic is welcome to come as the are, sit anywhere you like, bring pillows, blankets or have a picnic if you like. It's all so extremely informal. Great place to bring dates. Every Green person I know here loves this church and goes there often, not to worship (obviously), but to celebrate life and community. Not sure if this is an example of positive Stage Blue, or religious Stage Green church. Is that possible? 

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@Jed Vassallo It could be Blue/Green, but honestly that just sounds like more Green using imagery that is more traditionally associated with Blue. There's no reason why a cathedral can't be home to Code Green yoga lessons and LGBT meetings, other than a lack of popular imagination linking the two.


“All you need is Love” - John Lennon

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2 hours ago, Keyhole said:

@Leo Gura I wonder if you perhaps maybe underestimate folks who are lower on the SD model's ability to sense that disconnect in communication.  I can be in my most egotistical state and still in the back of my mind see that there is something that is not integrated.  I imagine most people can sense this to some degree, even if they choose to sit with beliefs or act from a lower consciousness framework.

What do you think?

Do you think people are that obtuse, that they can't see it at all?

That said, the stage blue/orange man seems genuinely baffled by green's perspective.

Yes, people are that obtuse. You can see it because you are probably exceptionally conscious and developed.

Most people are very closedminded and see the world in black/white, I'm-right/you're-wrong.

Tucker Carlson is quite obtuse. His worldview does not account for relativity or multiple perspectives.

Or course Cornel West is much more able to understand Tucker than Tucker is able to understand him. Cornel West is a world class intellect. Tucker Carlson is an ideological hack.


You are God. You are Truth. You are Love. You are Infinity.

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Wasn't Buttigieg involved in some pretty unethical, racist, and illegal dealings with getting the police department in his hometown to be all white cops?  

If so, this kinda baffles me if he's also gay...  I'm imagining, if he's racist and involved with those types of people and going to those extremes (I think TYT did a report on the scams/fraud or whatever it was) for racist values, I just don't see how he could be openly gay in that environment and have supporters.

I guess I see the gay identity and racist identity as not being compatible... yeah, within his person I could see it, but socially?  ... I dunno.


"Just a spoonful of sugar helps the medicine go down"   --   Marry Poppins

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@Matt23 well gay and conservative is not really excluding each other. that is if a gay person was indoctrinated by blue maybe in very loving way - it’s not that the fact that someone is gay changes their upbringing or love for what they learned to love in their family home. gay men are sometimes very correct and love blue things as they love aspects of structure and order and sophistication about it, or they just love the indoctrination part and giving authority to people they worship  - that can also sometimes mean that a gay person is conservative or even a right winger. 

blue these days is sometimes openminded for exceptions especially if they still conform and support the organisation/ideals blue is bound to, it mimikris openmindedness. 

of course this is not all on buttigiegs shoulders, it’s a phenomenon that especially showed in more conservative parties - german afd has a female member example where life and ideology are so counterintuitive to each other that it’s a mystery how exactly that works. maybe because it’s more accepted for women in that party.

it works exactly the same way as it works for a person from the left to be preoccupied about what being gay means or putting the fact that someone is gay for or against what people then are politically doing. political correctness is not a visa to be politically incorrect...you see where the fact that he is gay can lead to in a seemingly logical argumentation?

Edited by remember

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54 minutes ago, Matt23 said:

Wasn't Buttigieg involved in some pretty unethical, racist, and illegal dealings with getting the police department in his hometown to be all white cops?

That's one way to look at it. But are you really sure that's the proper way to look at it? Where did you get this perspective? From TYT? And you just blindly accept it as unbiased?

Quote

If so, this kinda baffles me if he's also gay...  I'm imagining, if he's racist and involved with those types of people and going to those extremes (I think TYT did a report on the scams/fraud or whatever it was) for racist values, I just don't see how he could be openly gay in that environment and have supporters.

Calling him a racist is pretty silly.

Racism is a complex and nuanced issue. There is personal racism and systemic racism, which is much more subtle. Someone can have no personally racists attitude and yet still be part of upholding a systemically racist institution for many complex reasons, chiefly, his own survival.

Quote

I guess I see the gay identity and racist identity as not being compatible... yeah, within his person I could see it, but socially?  ... I dunno.

He's not some open racist. You're saying it as though he's a KKK member. This is absurd.

The accusation is that he inappropriately fired a black police chief due to political influence. But even this requires serious proof. There are many reasons why he could have fired him. Maybe you should listen to Pete's version of the story before jumping to conclusions.

One can have biases and blindspots without being explicitly racist. In fact, most of us have such biases. If I put you into a position where you had to fire a black police chief to feed your family, you'd probably do it without blinking an eye. And you would never ever consider yourself a racist for doing so.

Of course being gay does not automatically make one a champion for African American rights or justice. Mostly likely Pete just grew up in a white bubble where African American rights were not even a topic of conversation or concern. He would have to go out of his way to care about that.

I grew up in such a white and affluent part of the US that I didn't even know racism was a thing until well after college. When you live in a great part of the country, you don't even know what injustice is. The notion that a cop would treat a black person different than a white person was impossible to even imagine where I grew up. It would be like worrying about people eating dogs.


You are God. You are Truth. You are Love. You are Infinity.

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@Leo GuraI guess I heard some stuff from TYT and what they portrayed, or how I saw it, was that he was sort of in that kind of crowd...  Southern states, municipal government and police trying to get rid of black cops...  

I think my image of being gay is also causing me confusion.  He's gay, so I associate that with being more liberal and open minded.  Then that whole "southern/racist/kkk" image is connected with that which turned my head for a loop.

For me, it's like finding an elephant eating a zebra alongside a bunch of lions after a kill...  does not compute.  

Edited by Matt23

"Just a spoonful of sugar helps the medicine go down"   --   Marry Poppins

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7 minutes ago, Matt23 said:

He's gay, so I associate that with being more liberal and open minded.

Everything is relative.

Pete is far more liberal and openminded than the average person in the country, and certainly the South.

But is he as liberal as TYT hosts who love to bash him? No

Pete is a moderately liberal guy which is decent for someone from the Mid West. He's not from San Francisco.


You are God. You are Truth. You are Love. You are Infinity.

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13 minutes ago, Matt23 said:

For me, it's like finding an elephant eating a zebra alongside a bunch of lions after a kill...  does not compute.

That's why you must be careful with your stereotypes and categories.

For some people, the idea of a smart black man also does not compute. Which is the very source of racism.

An overly simplistic mind is a dangerous and ugly thing.

The devil you see in others is the devil inside your self.


You are God. You are Truth. You are Love. You are Infinity.

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Yeah... seems like it...  

I think I'm seeing I'd like more experiences with different sorts of people... Like I've maybe been "cooped up".

Like this really turned many of my categories (particularly relating to people) for a loop...  "Huh... maybe people aren't this way or that... maybe people are a lot more complex than I first realized."

Like it somehow made me see my bigger generalizations and "invited" me to start considering making finer and more individual, and contextual distinctions.  

Cheers.


"Just a spoonful of sugar helps the medicine go down"   --   Marry Poppins

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Healthy stage Blue integrity and morality:

 


You are God. You are Truth. You are Love. You are Infinity.

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Stage Blue Rap Song

 


Digital Minimalism: A philosophy of technology use in which you focus your online time on a small number of carefully selected and optimized activities that strongly support things you value, and then happily miss out on everything else.” - Cal Newport

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Hello guys. I have this question about stage Blue. So I know someone from my country who's an Imam, so fully 100% Muslim, and he gives lectures every Friday and prays 5times a day. 4-5 years ago he with some other ppl appeared on a TV channel, and he created this foundation in need of homeless or poor ppl, or ppl with severe health issues that need treatment outside the country. He has over 700k IG followers, everyone follows him even non religious ppl, and his motto is "ALBANIA FOR ALBANIAS" In all of this helping he does not teach Islamic ideology, just on Friday in the mosque and in his IG. So is this guy BLUE,ORANGE,GREEN at the same time? 

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10 hours ago, Virgo said:

Hello guys. I have this question about stage Blue. So I know someone from my country who's an Imam, so fully 100% Muslim, and he gives lectures every Friday and prays 5times a day. 4-5 years ago he with some other ppl appeared on a TV channel, and he created this foundation in need of homeless or poor ppl, or ppl with severe health issues that need treatment outside the country. He has over 700k IG followers, everyone follows him even non religious ppl, and his motto is "ALBANIA FOR ALBANIAS" In all of this helping he does not teach Islamic ideology, just on Friday in the mosque and in his IG. So is this guy BLUE,ORANGE,GREEN at the same time? 

Blue. Blue is not bad. Blue people help others, but for very different reasons than other stages.


“Many talk like philosophers yet live like fools.” — Proverb

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