Joseph Maynor

I sense an anger in Jordan Peterson, it's a vibe

68 posts in this topic

3 minutes ago, Sea said:

After everything Leo used to say about consciousness and not labeling, him and his audience have now started labeling and categorizing people in an almost-neurotic way. There's no greater emotional bullying tactic than giving people labels and demonizing them on that basis. 

The thing about this example is you think these liberal college students can only go up the hierarchy. In reality, about half of them will stay green for the rest of their lives, and the other half will move down to orange or even blue once they find their mindset isn't bringing results.  Those that progress to stage yellow will be a small minority. 

No, you don’t move down Growth Levels.  

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Just now, Joseph Maynor said:

No, you don’t move down Growth Levels.  

That's your dogma, not mine. You saw my thread. The scientific evidence on this is sparse, this whole model is just based on one study done in the 50s and no, it did not confirm that you can't move down levels. 

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2 minutes ago, Sea said:

That's your dogma, not mine. You saw my thread. The scientific evidence on this is sparse, this whole model is just based on one study done in the 50s and no, it did not confirm that you can't move down levels. 

Try becoming a toddler again.  You can’t dial back Growth Levels.  You can’t undo what you know is stupid.  That’s called growth.  Growth cannot be reversed.

Edited by Joseph Maynor

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Just now, Joseph Maynor said:

Try becoming a toddler again.  You can’t dial back Growth Levels.  You can’t undo what you know is stupid.

Not the best analogy, but I can work with it. As a toddler you were probably less egoic and more present in the moment than you are now, i.e. there were some things you did better. You can work towards regaining some of that pure perspective on life without crawling or shitting in your pants. Your claim that everything that came in previous stage to yours was 100% stupid is unsubstantiated.

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3 minutes ago, Sea said:

Not the best analogy, but I can work with it. As a toddler you were probably less egoic and more present in the moment than you are now, i.e. there were some things you did better. You can work towards regaining some of that pure perspective on life without crawling or shitting in your pants. Your claim that everything that came in previous stage to yours was 100% stupid is unsubstantiated.

No, you’re being too reductionistic.  You miss the forest for the trees. What I said is obvious.  You cannot go back to a prior growth level that you’ve already realized doesn’t work.  It’s obvious.  You can see it in your own life.

Edited by Joseph Maynor

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1 minute ago, Joseph Maynor said:

No, you’re being too reductionist.  You miss the forest for the trees. What I said is obvious.  You cannot go back to a prior growth level that you’ve already realized doesn’t work.  It’s obvious.

Sorry, but "it's obvious, it's obvious" is not an argument. People don't go through every stage. Not everyone has passed through purple, red or blue before reaching adulthood, I think that should be pretty clear. Blue is a good example because it's unlikely someone passed through it if they weren't exposed to religion (or something similar) during their childhood. These stages require a specific environment, specific experiences to come about. Hence a lower stage will not always be one "you've already realized doesn't work". There will often be a lower stage that was unexplored.

Also, "doesn't work" is very ambiguous. A person isn't going to have the same goal at every stage of life. Even something as obvious as happiness isn't a goal for many people. Therefore another possible reason someone may go back to a prior level is because what they want out of life has changed.

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16 hours ago, Sea said:

Not everyone has passed through purple, red or blue before reaching adulthood, I think that should be pretty clear. Blue is a good example because it's unlikely someone passed through it if they weren't exposed to religion (or something similar) during their childhood.

Actually, everybody goes through the levels in childhood development. Red is the 3 years old who doesn't control his physical strength yet and hits the mother. Blue is when the 5 years old conforms with the family and preschool rules. 

Blue is not just religious fundamentalists. Blue is nearly all the rules, institutions and social laws we have, good and bad. Blue is where you wouldn't fathom walking out of your front door naked because shame. 

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Haha, people are getting heated are they? :P .

Seems like most of everyone here is wrong in some form — and even with people arguing with each other, some can be both wrong. Guys, take a deep breath and relax. . . alright? Can we all admit that we can be all wrong in some form — including me?

 


“The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing.” 
― Socrates

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