Rant

[Nahm]

@eputkonen thanks for taking the time to share what you did. I experienced some insights while reading it on the distinctions I’ve made with words / meanings, in terms of -  I hold some strict definitions - and holding them itself isn’t assisting me in terms of communication involved in helping someone else. I don’t know personally (outside of the forum) know anyone who has practiced meditation for years. A handful of people in my life have asked me about my mood, mental state, ‘progress in life’, whatever, what I “do” to feel the way I feel, and I always recommend the practices. I think, for a while, I might ask if they want to know what they are or not, and just leave it at that, and maybe that is an ‘entry point’ for assisting / deducing use of my energy. I want to experience that communication and collect the experiences from it. I see a lot of suffering, and I do see that meditation can ease it, but I am open and contemplating that ‘style’ without the basis of self inquiry, meditation might reduce suffering, but it might be likely it will just continue to surface. I realized a few years ago, I was choosing to live out my life in this bliss, or I was going to attempt to do that and help others. Then I realized my path is of course, both, as ‘others’ are no more or less me, than Nahm. So I think I’m learning the importance of ‘meeting them where they’re at’. I’m rambling...lol....    the point is, thanks!! And any thoughts and insights from you are more than welcome. 

One more thank you....I had a little more insight into my lack of distinctions between enlightenment, self actualization, and life purpose. Just a little, but a little there is a lot. Thanks!

[SOUL]

@Capethaz Yes, it's very apparent you aren't satisfied from the way you lashed out at people here in admonishing them. Your post was expressing much contradiction, first you tell people to stop with the "bullshit" theories and then say "start debate".... so which is it? Stop or start?

Then you are critical of what you assume others want, how is it you know what everyone wants? I would venture a guess from what you yourself want but didn't get any "happiness" from so project that out onto others. While I agree not basing our own happiness... or peace... on external circumstances is a healthy recipe for actually being at peace if you aren't "there" yet how is it that you can confirm this actually works?

Peace isn't "there", it's 'here'..... at every moment, just be it. "Practice" is the word we use for actually doing what it is we are speaking about so when we practice what we preach we are living what we teach. Although practice also refers to training in a particular skill, we are repeatedly doing something to gain a proficiency in that skill and in this instance we are practicing peace so we become 'experts' in being at peace.

You tell us when we are at peace we won't care about who is right.... after you have already told us our theories are "bullshit" so it seems you think you know which is right and care enough to say ours aren't. You tell us we should listen are learn yet you say we should stop sharing the "bullshit" theories, so if everyone stops then who is there to listen to?

I don't mean to be critical of you but i only point out these contradictions as possible reasons why you don't have this peace yourself, they create inner tension which results in a turmoil that disrupts the peace. Then take your advice to listen to someone who has a healthy measure of peace in their life and let go of it, just let go of that tension in you.

We all have our theories and we are sharing them, we each 'graze' on each others theories, yes debate as you said. From that feeding on the ideas and concepts of others growing in places like this some of it nourishes us, some of it empowers us and some of it is bullshit that we get rid of but even the bullshit enriches the soil of our garden so has some value to our work and path.

Edited December 4, 2017 by SOUL

[eputkonen]

@Nahm , meditation does ease some stress, suffering, etc.  I don't deny that practices can be partially successful.  Even the 30 year meditator I mentioned, he said he has seen many benefits from his meditation and has had amazing spiritual experiences.  He says he is not even the same person he was compared to before he started.  However, he still suffers and he tells me enlightenment is something he still seeks.  He just is not content.  We have spoken for many hours and I can see that he still has not delved into the "me"...instead he is trying to grasp enlightenment through the mind (thinking/logic) or through meditating longer or perhaps a new practice (other than just sitting with who you feel you are and looking at it).  In all version, he is trying to do something to get over some invisible obstacle.  I keep telling him, he has created the obstacle in his own mind...there is no obstacle...also there is no "me" to get over the obstacle...you need to look at the mind and who you think you are.  It is somewhat amazing how resistant people are to looking at who they think they are and questioning what am I?  They want to do anything but that.  In so doing, they distract themselves from the root...the base upon which most of the other illusions of the mind are founded.

Edited December 4, 2017 by eputkonen

[JustinS]

@Capethaz lol c’mon now that’s a bit rude. Be mindful of limited beliefs. 

@eputkonen I like your style. You’ve a got a bit of Paul Hedderman in your teaching. 

[eputkonen]

Just now, JustinS said:

@Capethaz lol c’mon now that’s a bit rude. Be mindful of limited beliefs. 

@eputkonen I like your style. You’ve a got a bit of Paul Hedderman in your teaching. 

Thank you.  I have no idea who Paul Hedderman is...so I will have to take your word for it.

[Leo Gura]

The reason people seek for decades and never get it, is because they aren't seriously contemplating. They are running around doing all sorts of spiritual practices, new age practices, retreats, worshipping Ekhart Tolle, hugging gurus, adopting beliefs like "we are all one", and reading books, but they are not questioning their actual identity for realz. Of course! That's just one the traps within the trap.

Most people who do spirituality do a softcore version of it. They are looking for comfort, not truth. And they get stuck following one teaching, which is often insufficient to point them to the truth. Or they have no focus and dabble in a bunch of stuff without any depth.

Which is why psychedelics are so good. They cut through all that human crap and force you to go existential.

[Key Elements]

Interesting rant...

I understand the rant, but the question is, what have you learned by being on this forum? If you can get something beneficial to yourself, that's great, but can you identify it?

*Remember, this is not about what others are mentally masturbating. Don't label. This is about what you learned.

For me, I learned how to communicate better and share my thoughts. For example, some things are meant to be shared and better communicated in the pinned threads. Some things are more appropriate in the joke thread, etc., etc. Why is that? One reason is, it reduces debates. If a person is serious about the info given, he/she will go out and research it, do self-inquiry on it, and incorporate it into one's life. The person will have to digest the info before taking action on it. Being here also gave me different ideas on how to incorporate spirituality into a life purpose. For example, you could tell it in 3rd person or as a joke so that those who are ready to hear it will hear it. Those who are not will just gain a skill (self-mastery).

[ADD]

@eputkonen good insights, thank you.

What i realize is that you can easily make spiritual path to the same endless seeking you do with seeking fullfilment from external and material things. If you are seeking to be enlightened in the future you are doing just this. 

 

[Capethaz]

@Leo Gura @eputkonen People half ass in every field of their life, career, relationships, why won't they do it in the spiritual path too? There are traps in this path as in any field of life. It's not just a question of HOW LONG HAVE U BEEN PRACTICING. 

[Toby]

Awakening or "Englightenment" doesn't happen because of effort but in spite of effort.

[Shin]

47 minutes ago, Capethaz said:

@Leo Gura @eputkonen People half ass in every field of their life, career, relationships, why won't they do it in the spiritual path too? There are traps in this path as in any field of life. It's not just a question of HOW LONG HAVE U BEEN PRACTICING. 

So let me get this straight.

You're complaining because other people aren't doing as good as you want them to.

Rings a bell ?

Edited December 5, 2017 by Shin

[Preetom]

If I am totally honest here then I have no choice but to confess that I only come to this forum when I'm NOT practicing properly (AKA lost my path) 

If I am at peace...I mean TRULY at peace, at flow state...then things called 'others', 'future', 'world', 'good and bad', 'fear', 'forum  ' etc really make no sense and can't induce any attraction.

I guess this forum can only be a good entry point and maybe a good place for help in critical, dire roadblocks

 

[Capethaz]

In Pali scripture, the Buddha is challengingly asked: "aren't you attached to the practice?" to which he replies: "Yes. I am. One must break all attachments except the attachment to the practice".

[jjer94]

On 12/3/2017 at 0:53 PM, Capethaz said:

I think that it would be beneficial for us all that we stop with bullshit theories about reality, life, and start debate about practice and the path to awakening.

"Stop with bullshit theories, and start debating."

Uhhhhh.......

That's kind of like saying, stop eating fruit, and start eating bananas.

[Nahm]

@Key Elements Yes!❤️