Are Emotions Just Rewards/punishment?

[Damir Elezi]

In order to control my emotions more, I studied the topic a little bit In order to first understand how emotions really work. 

Scientifically speaking, it seems like all emotions are caused by hormones, which are set free by the brain and other parts of the body In reaction to a certain situation (or rather the mind's interpretation of it). What kinda surprises me about this as I dig deeper is that even the most profound, most beautiful emotions people have can be explained by mere chemistry In the body. Even the feeling of inner peace and appreciation people have after meditating can be explained by Serotonin, which is produced by a part of the brain which is  stimulated during meditation. From an evolutionary perspective, it seems like even the most beautiful feelings only serve the purpose of rewarding an action, which the system interprets as beneficial to survival. All emotions seem to be survival-mechanisms or as you might call it 'egoic'. Scientifically speaking, I didn't find any proof for a 'deeper area of emotions' apart From that. 

Apart From this view being pretty depressing, what do you think about it? People on here talk about experiences that go beyond the body and ego, realizations of the true nature of existence. How do you know that all that and even enlightenment isn't just an illusion itself? A feeling created through stimulation of the brain? I mean People have these experiences on psychedelics and psychedelics stimulate certain parts of the brain that are responsible for feelings like these. 

How do we know that enlightenment and eudaimonic happinesd actually exists and that it's not just another product of a machine-like organism like our own?

[eskwire]

@Damir Elezi Enlightenment can exist as a product of the mind/body phenomenon. I don't see a conflict there. A phenomenon can be caused by a chemical reaction and still exist, of course. The only conflict you see is with the phrase "beyond body and mind" - those are just words, chosen by people who perhaps aren't great with words. 

I wouldn't think of the body as a machine. It's incredibly complicated and takes care of itself. 

[Damir Elezi]

@eskwire but people see enlightenment as 'realization of the objective reality' - which wouldn't be true if it was a product of a biased, human-centered mind, right? This would make enlightenment itself a product of the ego

[Nahm]

@Damir Elezi how do you explain my love for you?

Emotions are the motion between reality and the illusion, love, and what love is doing / dreaming. After the truth is experienced, emotions make sense. Like most things, the simplest explanation is true, but we are complicated perceivers. 

Edited October 21, 2017 by Nahm

[eskwire]

2 hours ago, Damir Elezi said:

@eskwire but people see enlightenment as 'realization of the objective reality' - which wouldn't be true if it was a product of a biased, human-centered mind, right? This would make enlightenment itself a product of the ego

Who has proven it is the product of an ego-centered mind? Because there are chemicals involved?

One thing you need to understand about enlightenment is that it is spoken about poorly. There are no correct ego-derived words for it.  So, I can see why you would assume that a "realization" comes from a mind and the mind is necessarily egoic, but it is not a "realization" as generally understood. That's a bad word for it. They're all bad words. 

It is good you are attempting contemplation. Just be careful that you aren't jumping 5 steps ahead to unwarranted conclusions. Do you do self-inquiry and meditation? You need to experience this directly to understand. 

[Sevi]

5 hours ago, Damir Elezi said:

How do you know that all that and even enlightenment isn't just an illusion itself? A feeling created through stimulation of the brain?

How do we know that enlightenment and eudaimonic happinesd actually exists and that it's not just another product of a machine-like organism like our own?

An evolutionary question to ponder. Made me reach my book which is a collection of Ouspensky's work.

I can't give an answer, that's for sure. But I wanted to write what it made me think of.

It is said that human body is a machine to process the energy input into a more subtle energy form. Information, energy and perception is carried into the system through the senses, so that, all of the input is subjective due to those filters.

But still; in the evolutionary process of consciousness, it is still a relatively higher level. (Let's say first you were a vegetable than wanted to be an animal which can be eaten humans.. etc.)

In this machine 'you' are in, you'll have a collected data, but for the purpose of escalation of the consciousness, machine has to be left behind for the sake of merging into the 'objective reality'

So of course, this question here inquires if there is such a thing as 'objective reality -or however we wanna call it-' existing other than this machine's projections?

Well, the concept of "God" is born here, referring to the continuity of 'that thing' still exists; despite of the discontinuity of the data which is carried into the human system, through the limited connectors (senses)

That's why it is said that you need to have 'faith' because clearly just relying on our sensory system is not enough, but still there is this urge to merge. The worst case scenario is there is no such a thing and it's just a illusionary side effect of our organic system. And we will not be knowing for sure till we get rid of the body for good.

In Sufism, it is said that you won't know till then, but if you keep having the faith so that doing work necessary required, if there IS such a thing, then at least you will be prepared for the next layer.

 

*interestingly I wrote down the date I was checking that book, and that is October 29, 2016, 02:36am: a year ago. I remember I was working on Ouspensky stuff through one of Leo's videos and a related thread here. 

Edited October 21, 2017 by Sevi

[YaNanNallari]

Enlightenment changes the brain more than just chemically. It's scientifically proven. I think enlightenment won't give us truth about the materialistic world but it certainly gives a more truthful view. If you're worried about emotions just being reward systems then of course meditate so that you're more detached from them. If you happen to feel good in an enlightened state you can still not really care about it and do stuff more efficiently and with more accurate understanding and goals.