Leo Gura

Announcement: User John Flores Banned

67 posts in this topic

37 minutes ago, Annetta said:

@Fidelio I think it was good that he was banned for now, I just want people to understand what happens to folks who have these episodes, how to spot them and what to do and not to be too harsh because he can't really help it right now.

----
John, if you're reading this you're unwell right now and you need to see somebody.  I'm not telling you this to cause you problems or because I think any less of you I am telling you this because I care.

I friend of mine had rapid cycling bipolar and thought he was Jesus as well, and also had a very interesting story - he was also very well educated on religion.  He got worse for a while, but finally saw someone and started medicine and therapy - and although I have not talked to him in years I did look him up last year and he is married now, living in Hawaii and looks so happy and healthy.

There's no shame in mental illness, it's just a brain abnormality, it can happen to the best of us.

Please go in and see someone.
Good luck.

Western medicine is nowhere near understanding these phenomena. I advised him to look for an authentic shaman for some proper guidance, but he laughed it off. But of course as you say, if that doesn't work, a shrink/clinical mental health care should be considered!

Good luck John

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@Visionary Excerpt from an "authentic shaman":
 

Mental Fracturing and Present Day Spiritual Practice
There is an unfortunate belief that there “is no such thing as mental illness”. There is also a thought of “shaman being the first psychologists” (Krippner, I believe). There is no denying that this work is powerful at working through emotions, beliefs, and traumas.

This is also born out of the understanding that in traditional cultures that there are varying thoughts of mental illness, or that all mental illness is spiritual in origin. While I certainly agree that all things are spiritual in origin technically, in our modern world we are divorced from the earth to the extent that we are either completely disassociated from our bodies, or are just in our heads (our mental “body”), and we lack the connections to our fellow humans that allow us to heal in community.

In modern-day society, there is a lot of purely mental work that goes into the practice (and is why spiritual workers tend to now work “with” people, as unless the person mentally works through the process, they tend to reject the spiritual changes that have happened to some degree)

It is hard to convince people who have not worked in psych hospitals and similar situations that some people are so divorced from any form of communal reality or are fractured to the extent that what they need is mental help, not spiritual. It is also an understandable hope for people who are struggling, or who have a family member or friend who is struggling, with significant mental illness that they are secretly a “shaman”: it can bring hope to a situation that is incredibly difficult to traverse.

The muddling of the spiritual with the psychological has delineated the boundaries a bit too far– it would be an ideal society in which people would refer to the appropriate professionals. To recognize spiritual awakening or shamanic sickness and refer to a spiritual worker… to differentiate that from someone who may need mental health support and “light” spiritual work from perhaps a therapist trained in neo-shamanism and its visualizations… to the people who are struggling with psychosis and delusions that threated their safety and make them non-functional in their lives and get them the help that they need.
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3 minutes ago, Annetta said:

@Visionary Excerpt from an "authentic shaman":
 

Mental Fracturing and Present Day Spiritual Practice
There is an unfortunate belief that there “is no such thing as mental illness”. There is also a thought of “shaman being the first psychologists” (Krippner, I believe). There is no denying that this work is powerful at working through emotions, beliefs, and traumas.

This is also born out of the understanding that in traditional cultures that there are varying thoughts of mental illness, or that all mental illness is spiritual in origin. While I certainly agree that all things are spiritual in origin technically, in our modern world we are divorced from the earth to the extent that we are either completely disassociated from our bodies, or are just in our heads (our mental “body”), and we lack the connections to our fellow humans that allow us to heal in community.

In modern-day society, there is a lot of purely mental work that goes into the practice (and is why spiritual workers tend to now work “with” people, as unless the person mentally works through the process, they tend to reject the spiritual changes that have happened to some degree)

It is hard to convince people who have not worked in psych hospitals and similar situations that some people are so divorced from any form of communal reality or are fractured to the extent that what they need is mental help, not spiritual. It is also an understandable hope for people who are struggling, or who have a family member or friend who is struggling, with significant mental illness that they are secretly a “shaman”: it can bring hope to a situation that is incredibly difficult to traverse.

The muddling of the spiritual with the psychological has delineated the boundaries a bit too far– it would be an ideal society in which people would refer to the appropriate professionals. To recognize spiritual awakening or shamanic sickness and refer to a spiritual worker… to differentiate that from someone who may need mental health support and “light” spiritual work from perhaps a therapist trained in neo-shamanism and its visualizations… to the people who are struggling with psychosis and delusions that threated their safety and make them non-functional in their lives and get them the help that they need.
Link

Thanks for this piece.

Yes, but it's a very difficult distinction. My friend suffered from a severe psychosis twice. Thought he was Jesus, made his own religion etc. They drugged him up until he was completely numb. Now when i speak to him, he knows he was spiritually enlightened. A complete loss of ego. Synchronicities every second. However, he was also completely deluded in certain ways. He started to interpret messages that simply weren't there.

I start to realize more and more that the social norm of being "mentally healthy" makes less and less sense. Once you wake up from the illusion, the whole world looks nuts.

So what to do when? Very difficult to say.

BUT DEFINITELY LOOK FOR HELP.

http://www.jaysongaddis.com/the-shamanic-view-of-mental-illness/

http://nautil.us/issue/40/learning/a-mental-disease-by-any-other-name

 

 

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@Visionary No problem, I've read these articles actually.  I know through my own psychosis that it does have extreme similarities to a spiritual awakening, but your friend's case is an exception.  Psychosis, like most things runs on a spectrum that goes in all directions.  Some people with psychosis might only experience delusions, others will have hallucinations, disorganized ways of living and thinking, ect.  And because of the chemical imbalances it causes physical symptoms as well such as problems with sensory integration.

I've been to a mental hospital once in my life for a two week stay.  The people there became my friends.  They clearly needed help.  Near the end of their stays they weren't looking numb or drugged up - they started to interact with one another, speak coherently, weren't as frightened, there was a sense of community and hope.  These people were clearly getting healthier.  I am thinking if someone feels completely numb on their medication then it is the wrong medication.

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Using the pm system to start a cult, is wrong i suppose.
But i regret not being invited, because I would've joined him for shits and giggles. Seems like some fun role-playing to do :) 

On the forum, he had strange idea's, but he was never really offensive to me.
At worst, i found him entertaining.

I will miss him, for his weird and colorful posts. For me, it was not insane what he was saying, it was artful and beautifully abstract and bizarre. And for that i enjoyed reading it.

But it was the right call, with all the information regarding him starting a cult.
 

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@zazed The dude was flogging himself with medium sized pinecones. Colorful and entertaining?

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@Annetta A nice rule of thumb Prabhaker told me for figuring out if you have a mental illness, is whether or not you'really open to having one.

That's really the only way to tell.

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On 6/4/2017 at 6:37 PM, Outer said:

 

I think social anxiety is a direct consequence to cults like Western Civilization. Good video, thanks!

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@electroBeam Not necessarily.  What you are describing is called anosognosia and not all people with mental illness have it, some have insight and some do not.

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32 minutes ago, Annetta said:

not all people with mental illness have it, some have insight and some do not.

A person can't enter into mental illness in awareness, if you are aware you can't become mentally ill. Those who have insight , it comes in saner moments of a mentally ill person.

There are moments in life of a normal person, in which he can become mad, like in anger, but while he is in a insane moment, he is unaware. 

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poor john. by acknowledging the fact that he is special, he didn't notice the fact that everyone is equally special :(


unborn Truth

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On 6/4/2017 at 4:10 AM, Leo Gura said:

User "John Flores" has recently been banned from this forum for a particularly egregious Forum Guidelines violation.

He was using the PM system to recruit people to start a Messiah cult -- with himself as the Messiah (of course) -- promising they will become billionaires if they join.

I couldn't make this shit up.

Needless to say this goes against everything self-actualization is about.

In the future, if anyone ever contacts you privately to start any kind of secret group, please report them to me immediately. This is a very dangerous phenomena which we need to stay on guard for. Also be very careful about meeting up with online strangers in person. There are real nutcases around. Which is why I tend to be strictly against private chat groups and the like, because these things need to be moderated, or else they can get badly out of hand.

Actualized.org will not be a tool for dogmatic behavior of any kind.

With the general rise of fake news, alt-facts, and conspiracy-peddling all over the web, we need to make an extra effort to avoid all forms of dogma and cults of personality.

I want to stress that you not hold me or Actualized.org as any kind of cult, dogma, or thing to "follow". I am not special in any way. I do not want you to be my follower. I do not want you to believe anything I say or teach, or hold it as true or special. I am fallible. Everything I say could be wrong and should be taken with a grain of salt. My teachings are purely pragmatic. I am not to be idolized in any way.

If you find yourself holding me as special in your mind, that's your projection -- something for you to become mindful of and to own as your doing. If you find yourself revering other teachers out there, whether it be Ekhart Tolle, Mooji, Rupert Spira, etc, likewise, that's your projection, which is actually holding you back from learning their teachings. No good teacher wants to be idolized or blindly followed.

If user "John Flores" re-appears in the future under a new alias, please report him.

He messaged me a couple days ago about that stuff. He didn't pose himself as some religious leader but talked about some "Pleidian" prophesy about the first twelve Actualized forum members to follow him on the forum would get a billions of dollars. I just assumed he was wanting attention and to have more forum followers to make himself look cool. So, I humored him and told him that I didn't really need a financial incentive to follow someone on here, because it cost nothing and is no hassle. It's just a forum. And he was really excited and was like "Don't tell @Prabhaker that I asked you to follow me." So, I was like "I'm pretty sure he won't ask (or care for that matter)..." It sucks that that's what he was trying to do. I hope the poor guy gets help. 


If you’re interested in developing Emotional Mastery and feeling more comfortable in your own skin, click the link below to register for my FREE Emotional Mastery Webinar…

Emotionalmastery.org

 

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? So that was it all about. I thought he was lost reading his last two post. 


I will be waiting here, For your silence to break, For your soul to shake,              For your love to wake! Rumi

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@Emerald  I think @John Flores was delusioned , I tried to help him but I was not successful. Then I followed him because after much efforts he got only one follower.

This was my conversation with him.

On 6/3/2017 at 7:39 PM, John Flores said:

Before I become famous, I'm going to give you proof of said phenomenon and ask you to follow me so you can become a billionaire. I will be discontinuing from allowing people to follow me until come I hit #12. I don't want JSE to follow me, but he might try just to be a deuche 

On 6/3/2017 at 9:01 PM, Prabhaker said:

I am following you now, but I don't want to become a billionaire. I was only son of very rich parents but I left them. I want Kingdom of God, not money.

On 6/3/2017 at 9:30 PM, John Flores said:

Interesting. Either way, you'll be rich

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And he wasn't even going to recruit me.

*cries*


Suppose Love is real, and let's assume reality is unreal. Suppose we discover that the building block of reality is real Love, that means our assumption was wrong and reality is actually not unreal. Reality is real, if everything we supposed is true. I'm not going to say if it is or not.

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Ok. I'll just say what I observed. He came in around the time that Prabhaker came in. He seemed very "normal" and "decent." Then, he complained about the drugs and that he regrets taking them and will not anymore till age 50 - when he's married with children. Then, his threads all went "downhill" from there.

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52 minutes ago, Prabhaker said:

@Emerald  I think @John Flores was delusioned , I tried to help him but I was not successful. Then I followed him because after much efforts he got only one follower.

This was my conversation with him.

That's what I kind of gathered from the snippets I read from him. So, when he was promising me a future billion dollars from the "Pleidians" just to follow him on the forum, I thought that he must be in need of some feeling of significance or influence or being admired. So, I followed him on here and made sure he knew that I followed him just because he asked me to and not for some kind of monetary reward. I had no idea that he meant follow him literally, as a disciple. It's sort of unfortunate (and admittedly a little humorous) that the wording of the "follow" function on the internet can be played upon in this way by aspiring cult leaders. But I admit that it was a bit of blonde moment on my part not to consider that possibility, and that I could be lending credibility to a thing like that. Either way, I hope he gets help and learns to love himself without needing for others to think he's the messiah. 


If you’re interested in developing Emotional Mastery and feeling more comfortable in your own skin, click the link below to register for my FREE Emotional Mastery Webinar…

Emotionalmastery.org

 

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