MatteO22

There’s been a lot of talk in this section that I’ve engaged in regarding manipulation and what it is to communicate in healthy ways, directly, honestly and openly, while still having the right and space for your own boundaries. So here’s a list of green flags in a relationship. Disclaimer: look for these green flags within yourself, and let your partners show up as they will. If they don’t meet your standard you have every right to terminate the relationship, but don’t make someone jump through hoops of conditions and expectations that you yourself don’t embody. - Being able to engage in vulnerability Unless you have the ability to be vulnerable with others, you won’t feel heard, seen and understood because you won’t be able to share the things that truly matter. What vulnerability is: Sharing feelings and emotions preferably using ‘I statements’ such as ‘I feel heard/hurt’, not ‘You make me feel xyz’. What vulnerability isn’t: it is NOT needing to share every single emotion you have with your SO, it is NOT making your SO responsible for all your emotions and wellbeing. It is NOT expecting your SO to never trigger your emotions that stem from your past experiences and family dynamic. - Respecting the free will of your partner Great example of this is just informing and asking your partner’s permission when making choices that affect them and the relationship. Such as if you’re booking a vacation for you and your SO, and for some reason you dislike the food that they serve in the hotel, before you buy the option that excludes food (breakfast, dinner and what not) you run it by your partner and ask their preferences and reach a compromise, just to make sure they have a say in the matter. It’s never an option to assume that you know better than your partner and so it’s okay to make a choice ‘for them’. It’s always extraordinarily important to run it by them. -Having a good relationship with space and closeness between the two of you Some people are overly focused on closeness and terrified of space - because space may represent an option for your partner to cheat, abandon or betray you. Closeness is important but only when you have the space necessary to process all that you’ve experienced in the moments of closeness. In the same way, individuals who are afraid of being smothered, taken advantage of, and neglected may be terrified of closeness and need copious amounts of space to preserve their own autonomy that they on some level feel like is being threatened. Here’s the hiccup - If you’re in a relationship and need unhealthy amounts of space, you will never have enough of it, because the very thing that is giving you space (your partner) is the thing that you need space away from, and so it’s more about making peace and regulating yourself within closeness, rather than escaping and running away towards your own space. It’s not that you can’t have space, but not at the expense of the intimacy that is the very building block of your relationship. -Having the ability to get curious when your partner acts out Let’s say your SO gets triggered, fails to show up or makes you feel miserable. Before jumping to conclusions how horrible of a partner they are, can you actually get curious ? Such as, oh wow I feel like shit about this, okay let’s regulate my feelings first and then inquire about your partners behaviour - ‘Hey what you did was a big deal to me and I feel like I need to know what your motivation and thought process were in order for both of us to be able to work through it together.’ - this can be done without blame and still with the option of holding your partner accountable. - This shouldn’t be applied to rationalise and enable toxic behaviour. En example of this NOT happening is your SO breaking a promise such as not picking you up from work, and you giving them a silent treatment as a punishment - again, that’s manipulation. -Being able to ask for what you need We all have emotional needs. If you feel unseen, Unheard, sad, lonely it’s always okay and needed to ask for some quality time from your partner. They don’t have to show up 100% of the time, but just in the act of asking for what you want, and seeing your partners response, intimacy is deepened. - Equal accountability It’s fairly simple. Take responsibility for your own traumas and neuroses, not for your partner’s. While it’s always important to be open and kind towards an SO, it’s never reasonable to be an enabler to toxic tendencies, to allow yourself to be a doormat to abusive, neglectful or abrasive behaviour, and to have the right to set strict and absolute boundaries around things that hurt the integrity of your relationship, and you as a person. Thanks for reading, hope this clears things up.

Hi! I used to be very focused on romantic relationships in my younger years, having a loving relationship and a happy family was THE thing that I felt would make me happy. Ever since then I had gone through my fair share of heartache, betrayals, failed relationships and dating that was more casual in nature. While I do feel like a loving committed and conscious relationship is something wonderful I truly want in my life when the time is right, it’s no longer a priority. I genuinely feel like if I do have a relationship it will be an extension of my wholeness and not something that will make me happy/miserable. Regardless I have been going through a lot of healing and finding myself just needing to spend a lot of time alone and focus my energy on emotional integration, healing trauma and withdrawing from relationships in general. The healing journey these days takes so much time and energy that there really isn’t that much left to give to anyone else. Which is okay for me, I don’t mind that and am aware that it’s just a temporary stage of integrating my awakening. It’s not that I miss relationships, I don’t feel disconnected, if I do feel lonely it’s a healing that will integrate and not a symptom of a lack of people in my life. I’ve been having a reoccurring dream about a girl (always a different one) asking me out and me agreeing to it, and being genuinely excited about the date, but underneath feeling like it’s not the right time/fit. Like the girl always seems nice and I feel attracted but it’s not ‘it’. Even if they’re great and sexy, if I don’t feel like it’s the totally right fit I don’t want to consent to a relationship if I don’t feel like it’s 100% ‘yes’, because a) I’d have to lower my standards and b) on some level it feels like wasting everyone’s time - because if I don’t feel like they’re 100% right for me, it means I’m not right for them and out there is someone else who for them will be a better fit. I think there’s a component to it of being comfortable saying a clear and decisive ‘no’ straight up and not just agreeing, giving them a shot even if the feeling underneath I have is ‘meh probably not.’ - it’s basically a fear of missing out. Good ol FOMO Your guyses input is welcome, Partially I also wanna spell it out and write it down for myself to help myself process. thanks for reading and/or your input!

@mivafofa no worries all good!

Aw thanks ! Can’t say I haven’t thought the same ?.

@ivankiss for real though this is about respecting your ‘no’ and your boundaries. And his unwanted advances should not be tolerated, so Id just say a hard No, and if that’s not respected I’d consider terminating that relationship in the name of self-respect. ps: unless there’s more to the story then he’s certainly, but certainly not sexually assaulting you. Asking for nudes isn’t a criminal behaviour as far as I’m aware, unless you’re a minor… which I think and hope you’re not ? Unless we’re all here being catfished and you’re actually 12.

@ivankiss I’m sorry boo… I’ll stop. I didn’t know it was such a big deal for you… apologies. Byeeee

@Harlen Kelly if you don’t wanna be tagged feel free to use the ‘block function’, if there’s a point in directly calling out destructive rhetoric, gaslighting and abuse I won’t refrain from quoting the things you post, just so that an atmosphere where it’s not okay to speak up isn’t cultivated. So block away, it’s your best option !

Bruh the only harem I need is your mom, your mom been hareming me since before you were born so hard, that I’m prolly your father. …. I hope i didn’t take the joke too far

@Nahm hey that was nice! Thanks!

@kai0 hey, I reported your comment. I just wanna express myself also in case a mod doesn’t do something. To associate women’s clothes with sexual assault is the age old victim blaming strategy. It is such an outdated, abusive patriarchal point of view that it should never be a relevant point in discussions like this.

Ikr, kinda awful to gang up on others… hate that shit. Its not like anyone did that to@Shin thankfully… wait what ? they did ? It was you who did that ? with that ego-maniac @Harlen Kelly? oh fuck ! Didn’t see that one coming. touché. You seem to be so quick to point out the faults you find in others, have you ever tried taking a good hard look at your own behaviour ? I heard it helps. 10/10 dentists would recommend- to watch what comes out of your mouth.

@Valach the distinction between needing someone from a perception of deficiency and simply being attracted to their presence for mutual benefit lies in how you perceive the relationship between the two of you in terms of what is the main focus. - is the main focus of what this person can give me, get me; make me feel more of, make me feel less off ? - or is the focus on desiring to create mutual benefit by interacting together - do you want the things that are good for you and simultaneously probably good for her and vice Versa? Are you excited about this persons little and big victories even if you didn’t play a role in their achievement ? Do you see the well-being of both you as the essence of what needs to happen, or is it more about the well-being of ‘just you’? Or even the well-being of ‘just her’ where you’d be abandoning yourself and leaving yourself out of the equation ? This is the essence of interdependency. The focus is on meeting the well-being of you with the well-being of her. That’s how your relationships stay clean of toxic cycles.

I just wanna say that I agree, the first comment I made regarding the guy ‘sleep humping’ wasn’t meant to somehow justify non-consensual sexual activity when someone is asleep. I was more or less making a joke because I was in a funny mood, but it wasn’t anything of substance. Sometimes I can forget how far people can go to justify abusive behaviour just so they can avoid evolving through their outdated paradigm and experiencing shame, guilt and other uncomfortable feelings. So even if by some you’re being told otherwise, you’re right in what you’re saying regarding sexual assault and consent. The arguments I’ve seen being thrown at you today are just excuses and avoidance of the reality that for many is too vulnerable and uncomfortable.

Journal, and I don’t mean rationally. Take a piece of paper, or a word document and write out your absolute uncensored and brutal preferably foul-mouthed anger. Let it pour through you like your life depended on it - only via keyboard/pen where no-one is being harmed in the process, and you’re being liberated. Rage via writing. It works extremely well when repressed anger comes up. Because via writing nothing needs to be held back. ps, I wouldn’t use the self actualisation journals here, it’s best to delete it usually.

For sure, I was sort of erratically sharing a story I had in my mind that was out of context. Regardless the comment I made was timed unfortunately, I haven’t been reading a lot of the discussion when I made it. I wasn’t even trying to make the point that women can rape too, which is true but maybe a topic for another time. When I made it I was a little all over the place oops! ?? but hey, I’m drowsy from my post covid vaccine symptoms so I get a pass haha

Only betas fuck 6 and bellow. Us big dicked chads will only go for 6.5s and up. The moment a girl is 6.49 (which can be a 6.6 that farts) - I’m outta here bruh. I’m jumping into the chopper and flying to the woods to hunt grizzly bears.

I think you’re dancing on the edge of being an apologist for rapists. Not to sound too dramatic but desire has nothing to do with anything. Were not entitled to have all our desires fulfilled all the time. It’s only when you live in a reality where you feel entitled to your urges being satisfied, what you say will actually have relevance. Even when you say ‘most men restrain themselves’ - as if they were some champions or something. To not have your desires fulfilled all the time is the most basic thing you learn early in life, where it’s much more important to make sure that your desires don’t violate the free will and freedoms of other people, and the moment they do you’re starting to enter the territory of abuse. The priority to respect the free will of another person comes before everything else, thus the fact that men have these urges is not relevant in the given context. That’s the one thing that distinguishes you from an abuser - do I prioritise respect for others over my fleeting desires.

Just cause me have them doesn’t make them acceptable to be acted out. Pedophiles have urges to fuck children. And fucking a child will never be okay. What you’re saying is like… well some men have urges to beat their wives, we should embrace a culture of wife-beaters, we wouldn’t wanna oppress those men would we …

I wouldn’t say so, wanting to be left alone when you’re sleeping is a human right. To finger girls when they’re sleeping is certainly not okay. There’s a wiggle room when you’re in a LtR with an established habits, and a sexual dynamic other than that it’s a big Nope.

Somewhat yes. If there’s a part of you that finds value in rebelling, that precise part of you will see gender identity as a prison to conform to and something that threatens its freedom, therefore there may be an unconscious desire to reject the identity of gender. Similarly, the same non-conformist you might see relationship and the commitment it represents as a problem, because it’s sense of freedom would be threatened once more, which would explain why you may have felt like the attraction to your SO went away. What might have happened during the trip was just that the part of you that doesn’t wanna be tied down by anyone or anything came to the surface and sort of took over, and showed itself in its full glory, so you can integrate it. Which I think is a great growth opportunity. This particular issue I can actually relate to. I used to be a huge commitment/authority/identification with stereotypical roles phobe. Just as you described, I hated the roles I was put in as a child and craved to have my own sense of autonomy and freedom (even though I think it might’ve been different from yours). And yet, over time I realised I had to surrender to the trauma I was running away from, which was terrifying and painful. And in some ways I’m still integrating that, but the alternative would’ve been awful.

@Etherial Cat also in my example, it was the guy who was sleeping (‘sleep humping’) and the girl engaged in sex with him. So technically the girl in this case would be the offender ? Anywho of course it’s a very rare and extremely unique case. But it just shows how weird and difficult the sexual dynamics can be. I also had a female friend who always complained how she hated that guys in nightclubs just touch and grab you all the time (which I agree with), and yet once when she was drunk and was hugging me goodbye, she grabbed my butt… what a hypocrite! ?

@Etherial Cat oh I didn’t read emeralds response. Sorry my bad! I thought it was a really funny story and meant to point out how the dynamics of consent tend to shift once you’re in an established relationship with a certain dynamic. Of course not when a 42yo is touching you when you’re 14 and asleep! That’s sexual harassment committed against a minor, that’s a prison sentence.

I heard about a guy who would hump his girlfriend when he was asleep, then they’d have sex, and in the morning he’d remember nothing ?. Consent gets complicated here sometimes. It’s difficult and unfortunately isn’t total black and white.

Well there you go. That’s what I’ve been low-key waiting for you to say. I’ll just leave you with this unless you wanna continue this dialogue. Living in non-conformity is a state of rebellion. When you emotionally live in rebellion, it’s a state of invisible imprisonment - because to rebel you always have to have an antagonist to rebel and defend against. And my only question is… dont you get tired of always needing to fight and fend for yourself ? I mean damn girl If you live as a non-conformist, you probably won’t allow yourself to receive enough support. Because you’re somewhat always on a battle field. On the lookout for danger… haven’t you had enough? Hasn’t it been too hard for too long ? Don’t you deserve better ? I think you do. And I don’t mean to cross any lines, but I think you deserve more support than you’ve ever had the chance to receive.

I love this guy, we need more of people like you on the forum !